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Is anyone able to help me find this birth/bapt. please?.

In 1876 he marries Phoebe G.Hodge in Westminster and lists his father as Henry Ellis, Labr.
The 1891 & 1911 census has him with his family and states born Bermondsey,(Surrey) London.

I think I have them in the 1861 census with John aged 9 still born Bermondsey and also lists his parents as Henry & Matilda Ellis - both
born Suffolk.

I am aware of the FreeBMD entry (Bermondsey Vol.4 page. 42) for birth of John Ellis but I think his parents are listed John & Sarah which only confuses the issue.

If any one can help sort out this problem it will be very much appreciated.

Alan

No penalties until 1875 for not registering births....his may simply not have been
registered

Have you tried the IGI for a baptism?

Does Henry's occ in 1861 match the marriage cert info?

No occupation does not match

1861 gives Henry as a tanner

Not found any of the baptisms to match the 1861 census



Witnesses - are they related ?

1851 for the parents?


Name: Matilda Ellis
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Henry Ellis
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Civil parish: Bermondsey
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary Magdalen
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England

Registration district: Bermondsey
Sub-registration district: St Mary Magdalen
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 39
Piece: 1561
Folio: 109
Page Number: 8
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Ellis 38..........Labourer
Matilda Ellis 35
Mary Ann Ellis 11
Elizabeth Statter 9 Mo Nurse child

1841


Name: Mary Ann Ellis
Age: 9 Mo
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1840
Gender: Female
Where born: Surrey, England
Civil parish: St Mary Newington
Hundred: Brixton (Eastern Division)
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England

Registration district: St Mary Newington
Sub-registration district: Trinity
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1065
Book: 4
Folio: 40
Page Number: 29
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Ellis 27
Matilda Ellis 24
Mary Ann Ellis 9 Mo

For ref


1861 census transcription details for: 3, Marigold Court, Bermondsey, Southwark
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National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG09
Piece: 326
Folio: 9
Page: 32
Reg. District: Bermondsey
Sub District: 3 Leather Market
Parish: Bermondsey
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District: St Mary Magdalen
City/Municipal Borough: Southwark
Address: 3, Marigold Court, Bermondsey, Southwark
County: London, Surrey
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
ELLIS, Henry Head Married M 46 1815 Tanner
Cadworn, Suffolk
ELLIS, Matilda Wife Married F 43 1818 ...
..., Suffolk
ELLIS, John Son M 9 1852 Scholar
Bermondsey, Surrey
ELLIS, Emily Daughter F 5 1856 Scholar
Bermondsey, Surrey
ELLIS, James Son M 3 1858 Scholar
Bermondsey, Surrey
ELLIS, Louisa Daughter F 0 (6M) 1861
Bermondsey, Surrey
NOBLETT, William Boarder Unmarried M 25 1836 Carrier

NOBLETT, John Boarder Unmarried M 18 1843 Bridle Cutter

1871 could do with a second opinion on the surname

Name: Matilda Cliffs
Age: 54
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1817
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Harry Cliffs
Gender: Female
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Civil parish: St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary Magdalen
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: St Olave Southwark
Sub-registration district: Leather Market
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Household schedule number: 196
Piece: 629
Folio: 20
Page Number: 37
Household Members: Name Age
Harry Cliffs 58
Matilda Cliffs 54
John Cliffs 19
James Cliffs 13

Class: RG10; Piece: 629; Folio: 20; Page: 37; GSU roll: 818926.


Address matches the 1861 census

What address does John give on his marriage cert ?

Yes, the 1871 image is Elliss....actually it's Ellifs...the old way of writing double 's'

Nice find GB! Henry is a labourer here, which matches the marriage certificate.

871 census transcription details for: Marigold Court, St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey
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National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG10
Piece: 629
Folio: 20
Page: 37
Reg. District: St Olave Southwark
Sub District:
Parish: St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: Marigold Court, St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey
County: London, Surrey
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
ELLISS, Henry Head M 58 1813 Suffolk
ELLISS, Matilda Wife F 54 1817 Suffolk
ELLISS, John Son M 19 1852 Surrey
ELLISS, James Son M 13 1858 Surrey

I have been unable to find a marriage for the parents.............

Will do a name correction on Ancestry.

Thanks for checking the image

Correction already done

1881 census transcription details for: 31, Remington St Greengrocer, St Luke
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National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG11
Piece: 360
Folio: 104
Page: 26
Reg. District: Holborn
Sub District: Old Street
Parish: St Luke
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 31, Remington St Greengrocer, St Luke
County: London, Middlesex
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
ELLIS, John Head Married M 29 1852 Greengrocer
Bermondsey, Surrey
ELLIS, Phoebe Wife Married F 30 1851
St Pancras, Middlesex
ELLIS, Ernest J Son Single M 4 1877
Peckham, Surrey
ELLIS, Geo H Son Single M 1 1880
St Luke, Middlesex

Have you considered this birth?


England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name: John Henry Elliss
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1852
Registration district: Newington
Inferred County: London
Volume: 1d
Page: 195

Could do with some feedback from Alan

1901 gives his place of birth as Southwark

?? Bermondsey is a district in south London, and a part of the London Borough of Southwark. Sorry, my knowledge of London geography is non-existant.


England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915 about John Ellis
Name: John Ellis
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1852
Registration district: St George Southwark
Inferred County: London
Volume: 1d
Page: 151

The baptisms for the two children on 1881 census he gives his occupation as leather dresser