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Kucinta............

I would tend to agree that the birth for Cecil is almost certainly for the chap who married and died as Cyril..............

He doesn't appear to have had any siblings, (certainly not after 1911) but I was hoping that Pauline could be persuaded to try looking for herself

Edna Jenkins is virtually impossible to pinpoint.........unless Pauline can tell us when she died.

There are a couple of Radford-Simons marriages, but very much out of the area.

As many old hands on here have said before, "start with what you definitely know".

So I think Pauline probably needs to get both the Radford- Jenkins marriage cert and the Cecil W Radford birth cert to see if the Radford father on both is a match.

She can then check on freeBMD to see if one of the Radford-Simons couples is a match for the parents on the birth cert.

This might help us move into census territory, and also give Pauline some names to search for in the freeBMD.

Thank you for all your help.

Pauline, if you want to order the certiificate mentioned, you can order on line through the General Records Office. Here is the link that you can copy and paste into the address bar:

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/default.asp

I think certificates cost 7.50 pounds (or did last tiime I ordered one).

You will need the information given earlier, volume and page number etc.

Let us know how you get on and if you need more help at the next stage.


Selena

One other thing - have you tried the search trees function at the top of the page?

There is one match with Cyril Radford c1913 with a member called Phillip so it might be worth sending him a message.

Good luck,

Selena

As i posted earlier in the thread, certs now cost £9.25 each.

yes thank u. Philip is my brother. i have send away for some information, so fingers crossed

Please can you help me find the parents of my grandad, Cyril W Radford born in coventry in 1913.
Plus my Nan her name was Edna Jenkins born in coventry, around the same time or a bit later then my grandad,

Pauline

Please look yourself on freebmd for the births.

When you find them, check for marriages for the parents whose surnames are listed.

freebmd is where anyone would look - they don't have access to any info which you can't find yourself.

http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/

BUT.......if you don't buy the marriage cert, you may follow the wrong Edna Jenkins.....you need to know how old she was when she married....plus the name of her father. Her name is not unusual enough to guess which birth might be hers.

And, with Cecil/Cyril using different forenames, it would give you accurate info about him as well

IF this is Cecil/Cyril's birth........it would appear from reading through this thread, that there is no marriage for Radford/Simons to fit.

Births Mar 1913 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Radford Cecil W Simons Warwick 6d 1593

So it may be that the mother had been married before............

Hi Pauline,

I have a had a look through but these are the only Radford/Simons marriages I can find I can on FreeBMD. Unfortunately they are all in the wrong area and far too early.

Marriages Dec 1887
Clark Austin Thomas M Kensington 1a 370
EXALL Margaret Ann Kensington 1a 370
RADFORD Henry Kensington 1a 370
Simmonds Leila Annie de W Kensington 1a 370

or

Marriages Dec 1892
Radford Herbert William Tendring 4a 831
Simons Emmaline Tendring 4a 831

or

Marriages Mar 1895
Davey Jessie Newton A. 5b 160
Ley Alfred John Exeter 5b 160
Radford William Exeter 5b 160
Simons Emma Elizabeth Exeter 5b 160
Webber Annie Exeter 5b 160

If I were you, I really would to get Cyril/Cecil's marriage certificate before going any further as you could end up researching the wrong family.

Best of luck,

Selena

The family of the couple who married in Essex are still there in 1911

Person: RADFORD, Emmaline
Address: Burnt Heath Ardleigh Essex

----------------------------------------------------------------

RADFORD, Herbert William Head Married M 45 1866 Labourer Hon Farm Wigborough Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Emmaline Wife Married
18 years F 36 1875 Ardleigh Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Lilian Daughter F 12 1899 Little Bromley Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Emily Daughter F 10 1901 Ardleigh Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Evelyn Daughter F 8 1903 Ardleigh Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Edna Daughter F 4 1907 Ardleigh Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Hilda Daughter F 2 1909 Ardleigh Essex VIEW
RADFORD, Herbert Son M 0 (9 MONTHS) 1911 Ardleigh Essex

I WONDER!!!!!!!

This fits with the marriage in Exeter

1911 census

Person: RADFORD, Albert
Address: 11 Parkes St Warwick

Cost:
You will be charged 10 credits for a transcript and 30 credits for an image, unless you have purchased a subscription for this set of records.


RADFORD, William Head M 44 1867 Barracks Labour Sweep Devon Exeter VIEW
RADFORD, Emma Wife Married
16 years F 40 1871 Somerset Brokeboro VIEW
RADFORD, Ethel Dr Single F 15 1896 Devon Exeter VIEW
RADFORD, Harold Son Single M 14 1897 Errand Boy Draper Devon Exeter VIEW
RADFORD, John Son M 8 1903 School India VIEW
RADFORD, Annie Dr F 6 1905 School India VIEW
RADFORD, Albert Son M 3 1908 Devon Exeter VIEW
RADFORD, Muriel Dr M 0 (3 MONTHS) 1911 Warwickshire Warwick VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
18710 Reference:
RG14PN18710 RD393 SD1 ED1 SN135

If the Herbert marriage is right, then it looks like they are keeping the middle name William in the family.

Wow! Flick's 1911 census entry for William and Emma Radford certainly looks very promising to me!

However as we have all been saying, Pauline really does need to get Cyril/Cecil's birth cert to be certain of his parentage.

And without the Radford-Jenkins Marriage cert we don't have much hope of getting a fix on Edna.

I really do think that census 1911 entry of Flick's is a MAJOR breakthrough though.

In the light of Flick's census 1911 discovery, I'd be tempted to say that if money is an issue, buy the marriage cert first to check if the father is William Radford, and to give us something to work with re Edna.

Even if you don't have an Ancestry sub, you can search at Ancestry for Radford kids with mum's MS=Jenkins - there's 10 hits in Warwickshire - 8 in Coventry & 2 in Warwick - click on the shopping basket and you'll get some details - don't order thru Ancestry as they've got quite a markup for placing the order for you. You can't see all the details nor Ancestry's images without a sub but you can see the names - you can search FreeBMD and see some images - for the rest, go to FreeBMD's home page and use their klunky "view images" link.

There's also a 1931q3 Jenkins kid with mum's MS=Jenkins rego'ed in Coventry.

Pauline was pmed (as they may be still living) with Radford-Jenkins children back near the beginning of the thread, and in a response to a pm from her, a lot of the children's marriages and the subsequent offspring too.

Excellent advice though.

Thank you i have appied for all certifs and have joined another site aswell. which i have found some more info which i needed. but thanks again i have now found loads of family and been in contact with them... Thank you again for all your help.

Great that you've applied for the certs.

Please come back here and update us with the info on them when you get them and we may be able to help you further, especially if they confirm Flick has the right Radford -Simons family in 1911.

Given the fact that Emma Radford nee Simons was born c1871, it would make sense that we found no more Radford-Simons siblings for Cecil/Cyril after 1911. Looks like he was the lastborn of the family.

According to the 1911 census William and Emma had 7 children of the marriage, one of whom had died before census 1911. So quite a few siblings for Cyril/Cecil if the certs confirm William and Emma as his parents.