Find Ancestors

lancashireAnn - we have a very frustrating problem with the internet at the moment. Every time I go to the census or try to spend any time searching, it throws us out! I will try to do as you ask at a quieter time when I might be more successful.

please could you put them both on here for reference as I can't view them via any site

lancashireAnn - I found them in the 1861 census but the 1871 shows a very depleted family with Mary (born 1847) as the Head of it and only George and Arnold around at the time. I have lost track of Alice and Simeon senior at that point.

that looks fine - it helps avoid some confusion

did you find the 1861 & 1871 census

lancashireAnn - hope I have done that correctly!

if you have access to the census returns just copy the relevant part and paste it into your reply

edit

sorry did you mean your post title
if you change the 1st line of your 1st post to something like
edited - Simeon Lord 1818 and Alice 1819 (maiden name unknown)

do do this just click on edit at the bottom of that box

Not sure how to do that!

Susan did explain on p 1

"I have two generations of Simeon Lord, unfortunately both married an Alice. Father, born 1818 married to Alice but I don't know her maiden name, and son born 1845 who married Alice Hope, born 1843 who gave birth to my grandfather Harry in 1880 (died 1960). I agree that there were far too many Lords in the Spotland area, but so far this family appears to answer most of the questions. I am having great difficulty in confirming the line because I cannot find birth records for either Simeon."

perhaps it would be better to change the title of this post Susan

Source of confusion ...

One post reads
Simeon Lord (1850), married to Alice Hope (1855)

as opposed to this post which states..
Simeon Lord, born 1818 in Spotland, Lancashire, married Alice Hope (born 1819).

Mike -
as Susan has all the details for Harry the 1st 1881 census is correct and Simeon (c1845 & Alice Hope (c1843) married in Birkenhead (yet to be proved)) Susan thinks Simeon's father was also a Simeon married to an Alice - maiden name as yet unknown
if you want to see more detail read the thread no of Susan's the link to which I posted on page 1 and my last post on page 1 of this thread

Susan
sorry not sure which Alice you mean - i think I have posted one or two!
I think with all the references, including the 1881 census, to 30 Wye St you can be sure that what you have for that generation is correct assuming that Harry's birth cert says his mother was Alice Hope.

Where did you get Simeon (1845) parents from please
Did you find him in 1861? If so please could you post it for ref (and maybe 1871 as well) as I cannot look at census info other than 1881.

Not all parish records are transcribed on lan-opc. If Simeon was born manchester area in 1845 not much of Manchester is there. The site is being constantly updated. If we can prove what Alice (c1819) maiden name was and where she was born it would help. If it was Lancashire the records may be in the Lancs record Office.

Mike - thank you for the link to Lancashire Parish records. I could not find Simeon (1818) there. The only Alice I could find in Baptismal records within the birth year of 1819 was Alice Law, Baptised 6th June 1819.

Mike - I think as the dates for Harry are correct, and 30 Wye Street is on all the certificates, that has to be the family? Does that prove it?

LancashireAnn - Does that mean that the Alice you found is not the same one?

Very confusing -- Opening post states " Alice Hope (born 1819)"



This would appear to be the Alice Ann Hope baptised in 1843

Household:1881

Simeon LORD Head M Male 36 Mchester, Lancashire, England Engine Fitter At Works
Alice LORD Wife M Female 38 Prestwich, Lancashire, England
Charlotte LORD Daur Female 9 West Derby, Lancashire, England Scholar
Simeon LORD Son Male 6 Holywell, Flint, Wales Scholar
Arnold LORD Son Male 3 Holywell, Flint, Wales
Harry LORD Son Male 1 Everton, Lancashire, England

Dwelling 30 Wye St . Everton, Lancashire, England



There is also this Alice and Simeon Lord in 1881


Simeon LORD Head M Male 56 Marland, Lancashire, England Butcher & Grocer
Alice LORD Wife M Female 40 Heywood, Lancashire, England
Mary LORD Daur U Female 16 Castleton, Lancashire, England No Occupation
Annie LORD Daur Female 12 Castleton, Lancashire, England Scholar
Samuel LORD Son Male 9 Castleton, Lancashire, England Scholar
Alice MILLS Aunt W Female 63 Heywood, Lancashire, England Annuitant
Sarah J. PRITCHARDS Servt U Female 20 St George, Shropshire, England General Servant Domentic


Dwelling 141 Manr Rd )Lock house)
Census Place Castleton, Lancashire, England



( CASTLETON, a township and two subdistricts in Rochdale parish , Lancashire )
-----------------------------------------------------

Maybe the occupation will help determine the correct Simeon.

this may be a complete red herring but found this on lan-opc

Baptisms: 11 Dec 1842 St Mary the Virgin, Prestwich, Lancashire, England
Alice Ann Hope - Child of Charlotte Hope
Abode: Prestwich
Notes: X X [written under child's name]
Baptised by: John Lowthian Curate
Register: Baptisms 1834 - 1843, Page 284, Entry 2265
Source: LDS Film 2113204

note - in 1881 Alice says born Prestwich & their eldest daughter was called Charlotte

again the marriage cert would perhaps indicate if Alice's father was known

so Charlotte, Simeon, Arnold and Alice were Harry's siblings and from Harry's birth certificate his mother was Alice formerly Hope and father Simeon an engineer.

Didn't they move around a lot!

The marriage of Simeon & Alice in Birkenhead I thought a strange area at first, but looking at the different birth places for children, Including Alice born c1882 in Everton but all in Stepney in 1891 anything is possible.

Do you have that certificate? It would confirm Simeon's age (b c1845 in Manchester according to census - see Ginny's birth reg suggestion in your other post) and his father's name & occupation.

Have you found Simeon in 1861 with his father - I do not have access to census information

info from Lancashire Parish Records ..

www.lan-opc.org.uk

Mike - how and where are you finding the birth records with such detail?

Mike - that looks interesting. I have been put off the Bacup Lords because they haven't appeared to fit in any other way. I'm probably wrong!

Wonder if this is Simeon junior ?......
Father Collier ( Quaryman ?)


Baptisms: 7 Feb 1818 St John, Bacop, Lancashire, England
Simeon Lord - Son of Simeon Lord & Alice
Abode: Bacup
Occupation: Collier
Baptised by: Wm Porter


BACUP - 6.4 miles (10.3 km) north of Rochdale

Mike - sorry, the elder Simeon appears to have been a quarryman (that's if I have the correct family) not a farmer.