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thanks Fans

I have been wondering if perhaps his background was a little more complicated.
I have seen examples of children annexing stepfathers name to their original name so maybe he was born Robert Tait and Daubeney added later?

maybe?

Births Jun 1864 (>99%)
TAIT Robert Marylebone 1a 474

I definitely considered that possibility early on -- and yet failed to find that particular Robert Tait somehow!

The other obvious possibility is that the mother was Daubeney and the real father was Tait (a common reason for a surname as a middle name) (or vice versa), and then the mother married someone else altogether and the child is hiding in the next census under the stepfather's surname ... etc etc.

Name: Robert Tait
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1864
Baptism Date: 29 May 1864
Father's name: Archibald Tait
Mother's name: Susanna Tait
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Marylebone
Borough: Westminster

Plus at least 5 other children born to them on Baptisms,but no Ernest.

Searched for Tait as well I did.

Thanks again girls for looking at this, the ideas you're coming up with match the ones I've had on and off for a few years now.

I don't think anyone in the family had ever looked into his past - it's probably since certain TV programs started that we've started to ask these questions.

Nope,started looking into mine well before that prog..
Still have a prob being 100% on one Ggrandfather,but 99% will do me

And that Robert Tait is in the 1881

Name: Robert Tait
Age: 16
Estimated birth year: abt 1865
Relation: Son
Father's name: Archibald Tait
Mother's name: Susanah J. Tait
Where born: St Marylebone
Civil Parish: Willesden


We never even got that program on TV until 2 years ago.

Me, I'm just a search-engine fool, and I was wandering the net looking for those Moncks o' mine back before this millennium ...

Ooh my internet just went funny.
Got it back now.
so birthplace is a little fuzzy-Middlesex or Essex.
Parents names are fuzzy
Date of birth a little fuzzy.
Hmmm.

Hi all
I'll just throw this one in the pot..................

Daubeney/Daubeny seems to be frequently mistranscribed as Danbury. This one looks like 'Daubeny' on the image and has mother as Isabella (not Alice) but she is down as married and occupation is given as soldier's wife. She and children all born as per Robert's birthplace:


1871 England Census
Name: Robert Danbury
Age: 5
Estimated birth year: abt 1866
Relation: Son
Mother's name: Isabella R Danbury

Where born: Bainsbury, Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: Milton
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Registration district: Gravesend
Sub-registration district: Gravesend
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Household schedule number: 73

Isabella R Danbury 35
Frederick Danbury 7
Robert Danbury 5
Ernest Danbury 3

Julie

It certainly looks like Daubeny on image Jools,doesnt it?
Def DAU at the start anyway
If Mother died young then he may not have known her name for sure ,but just thought it was Alice?
It looks good with both boys on it anyway.
More looking into needed,but certainly a contender...

The usual mistranscription is "u" when it's really an "n". Witness all my Mouck-s. The "n" was written much like a "u", in fact indistinguishably, often.

There isn't a Robert Daub* or Danb* birth to match in any case.

And there isn't a marriage that looks likely for Daub* or Danb* -- just this possible:

Marriages Dec 1870
ASTLE Emma Derby 7b 776
BASSENDINE Isabella Derby 7b 776
DALBY John Derby 7b 776
DAUBNEY Brion Derby 7b 776

if a remarriage perhaps.

There is Milton Barracks nearby - it's listed separately under the enumeration district of Gravesend. 17 pages of names with difficult writing to read! I think there's an easier way of pulling up the transcriptions but I can't remember now and I've run out of time. Will look again tomorrow unless someone else has already done it......................

Julie

Barnsbury (what the 1871 says, not Bainsbury, for all famil members) is a sub-dist of Islington reg dist.

Births Jun 1864 ?
DAUBENEY Giles *Frederick* Daubeney Islington 1b 201

but no matching Robert or Ernest.

On the other hand, with father being a soldier, I wonder whether the whole lot of them (and/or of our Robert and Ernest) were actually born somewhere like Ireland?

Thats the one I gave at the top of page 2 but it does'nt match the date of birth from army records

ja...x

GRO REGIMENTAL BIRTH INDICES (1761 to 1924) 1761 - 1924 DARWENT to DAVENPORT 1 FREE

(not sure of this entry on FMP?)

If he was linked to Sir Henry Charles Barnston Daubeney :-) Wow!.

Chris :)

Investigating ... and ruling out ...


This is just interesting ...

Marriages Jun 1861
> Armstrong Elizabeth Mile End 1c 941
Chalk Esther Mile End 1c 941
> Daubney George Greenwood Mile End 1c
Gurling William Henry Mile End 1c 941

Marriage would likely have been in Q1 (actually, parish record shows 3 April 1861, Stepney - George has father of same name, Elizabeth's father Robert Armstrong); they are together in her parents' household in Mile End in 1861 census:

Robert Armstrong 62
Elizabeth Armstrong 54
Eliza Armstrong 18
Robert Armstrong 30
William Armstrong 29
> George Daubney 28
> Elizabeth Daubney 25
Caroline Armstrong 12
Rosina Armstrong 31
William Armstrong 13
Eliza Armstrong 1
Ellen Armstrong 23


However ...

ROBERT WILLIAM DAUBENY
Christening: 19 MAY 1872 Saint Philip The Apostle, Stepney, London, England
Father: GEORGE GREENWOOD DAUBENY
> Mother: SARAH
Batch No.: C042691 (no other births in batch)

Thought it might be a late baptism, given the possible marital intricacies, but

Births Jun 1872
DAUBENEY Robert William Mile End 1c 599
Deaths Mar 1876
Daubney Robert William 3 Mile End 1c 420

There's a bride missing here:

Marriages Mar 1869
Daubeney George Pancras 1b 175

and just too many marriages in that quarter to identify the missing one. But no other apparent marriage to a Sarah.

Wife died:

Deaths Jun 1876
DAUBNEY Elizabeth 40 Mile End 1c 312

The person I noted earlier:

Births Mar 1876
Daubney William Avis Mile End Old Town 1c 562

I'm just wondering whether our Robert and Ernest could have been children of this Sarah unknown who apparently subsequently partnered with George Greenwood Daubney.

Deaths Jun 1895
Daubney George Greenwood 63 St. Geo. East 1c 217

Blamed if I can find them in censuses after 1861. Could Elizabeth Armstrong Daubney have been partnered with someone else by 1871?

- edit - I think my suspicions may have been unfounded:

Births Jun 1861
DAUBNEY Elizabeth Sarah Mile End 1c 540
Deaths Dec 1862
DAUBNY Elizabeth Sarah Mile. End 1c 443

-- mother was quite likely *Elizabeth Sarah* also.




And now a separate batch ... who's this in 1891?

John Mansfield 36
Rosina Mansfield 31 - Manning; marriage 1884 Mile End
Rayma Matilda Mansfield 6
Jessie Mansfield 4
Leona Sophia Mansfield 2
Mary Ann Eliz Dauberg 56 - (abt 1835) Daubney, mother-in-law

Marriages Dec 1878
Beales Elizabeth Mile End 1c 1137
> DAUBNEY Thomas Mile End 1c 1137
> MANNING Mary Ann E Mile End 1c
Pye George Mile End 1c 1137

Could it be possible? --

Births Mar 1866
Manning Robert Mile End 1c 558


1861, Stepney

Samuel Manning 28
Mary Ann Manning 28 - Bird, married 1853, Marylebone
Elizabeth Manning 6
Ellen Manning 3
Mary Ann Manning 1

But no. -- 1871, Mile End:

Samuel Manning 39
Mary Ann Manning 39
Ellen Manning 14
Mary Ann Manning 12
Rose Manning 10
Louise Manning 8
Matilda Manning 5
Edith Manning 3
Alice Manning 3 Months
Rosine Manning 1 MO

(And I did so like the idea of the son of Ms Bird having Avis for a middle name!)

Just looking at that Manning-Daubney-Mansfield bunch again for a minute ...

1881

Thomas Dabeney 63 - born Lincolnshire, Carpenter
Mary Ann Dabeney 50
Edith Manning 14
Samuel Clark 63
John Mansfield 27 - future husband of Rosina Manning >> Milkman
Charles Tuckwood 26
James Medword 28

Thomas in 1871

Name: Thomas Danbury
Age: 53
Estimated birth year: abt 1818
Relation: Boarder
Where born: Lincolnshire, England
Civil Parish: St James Clerkenwell
- widowed, carpenter

1861

Name: Thomas Danbury
Age: 42
Estimated birth year: abt 1819
Relation: Lodger
Where born: London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Shoreditch St Leonard
- unmarried, carpenter

1851

Name: Thomas Daubrey
Age: 30
Estimated birth year: abt 1821
Relation: Brother
Where born: Sibsey, Lincolnshire, England

Civil Parish: St Pancras
Thomas Seymor 38
Eleanor Seymor 36
Joseph Seymor 1
Thomas Daubrey 30

baptism was 1818, Sibsey, Lincolnshire
(he is not Thomas Willows Daubney or the Thomas married to Adelaide from Channel Islands)

A widowed older father could be a reason for children to be in institutions.

Just cannot find a marriage.

So, this is just investigating and trying to rule out. Putting it all here for that purpose!

Here's something interesting: a name to actually match something.

Births Sep 1845
Dauberry Fredrick Charles Bedminster 11 80

It's actually DAUBENY (precedes Dauber in the list, another Daubeny and a Daubeney are also mistranscribed).

I've submitted a correction to FreeBMD.

But I just can't win:

Deaths Dec 1851
Daubeny Frederick Charles Bedminster 11 63

although that could be a person of an older generation.


Marriages Dec 1896
? Beasley Alice Agnes Westminster 1a 1023
? DAUBENEY Frederick Charles Westminster 1a 1023
DEBNAM Fannie Westminster 1a 1023
Hooper Richard George Westminster 1a 1023

A belated marriage? Two of my grx2 grparents married at 45. ;)

But no, this is that couple in 1901 in St Pancras:

Frederick C Danbury 32
Alice Danbury 25

Just got in from work and seen all this - WOW!!

Jooleh - I do think that 1871 is a contender. I'm pretty sure that their mother must have died young.

One thing I am certain of is that when he enlisted on 11 Aug 1879 his age was given as 14 years and four months (he was only 4 ft 8 in tall, with a chest measurement of 26 ins). When he died in 1940 his age was 74 years. I don't think his birth could have been after 1866.

Chris - I have often harboured suspicions about Sir HBC - have you seen his marriage record!

You're missing Ernest in 1901, right?

The Danburys in 1871 were born in Barnsbury.


1901

Name: Ernest Danberry >> it says DANBENY, obvious enumerator error
Age: 31
Estimated birth year: abt 1870
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Elizabeth Danberry
Where born: Barnsbury, London, England
>> Milk Carrier

Civil Parish: West Ham

Ernest Danberry 31
Elizabeth Danberry 34
Elenor Danberry 8
Lucy Danberry 5
Lily Danberry 1
Thomas N Carlton 28
Lucy E Bedford 23


Jooleh's 1871 household in Milton, Kent:

Isabella R Danbury 35
Frederick Danbury 7
Robert Danbury 5
Ernest Danbury 3

I wonder whether that Ernest might have been 3 months, not 3 years? (The image doesn't say mo.) Or just the usual slippage.


It's almost looking like Jooleh has hit the jackpot.

There is one other interesting Barnsbury-born person in 1901:

Name: Fredk Daubney
Age: 23
Estimated birth year: abt 1878
Relation: Boarder
Where born: Barnsbury

Civil Parish: Greenwich
James Daubney 26 - place of birth N
Eliza Daubney 29
Eliza Daubney 6
James Daubney 4
Rose Daubney 3
George Daubney 54
Fredk Daubney 23
Jack Thorn 20
Dick Allen 31

Name: George Daubney
Age: 54
Estimated birth year: abt 1847
> Relation: Father, occupation carman
Where born: Kennington, London, England

That Fredk is too young to be the one in 1871, but possibly connected?

edit - this is them in 1881 in Islington, just for info:

George Danbney 33 - butcher, born Kensington
Mary J. Danbney 34
James G. Danbney 6
Frederick Danbney 3

and in 1871 in Kensington:

George Daubney 23
Mary J Daubney 25
Alice P Daubney 5

Looking to see whether George had siblings; 1851 in Kensington:

James Danbury 36
Mary Danbury 34
Mary Danbury 10
James Danbury 9
Sarah Danbury 7
Charles Danbury 5
George Danbury 3
Rachael Danbury 1
Mary Ann Harker 19

You may actually have the Moncks beat for mistranscriptions. ;)