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Seeking any info on my gt grandfather Joseph Robertson who married Ellen Elizabeth Waters 1857 in London have grandmother Eliza Charlotte birth cert 1864 Glasgow which shows he was a Master mariner understand his father Alexander(also a Master mariner)was a witness at the wedding so far have been unable to find any birth/death records of Joseph or Alexander grateful for any help Graham Duncan

Am pleased to advise everyone who gave help in this search that have just had a contact with Robertson family members and we are exchanging docs& pics!..thanks for all your efforts
Graham

1881

Name: Ada Robertson
Age: 10
Estimated birth year: abt 1871
Relationship: Daughter
Mother's Name: Ellen
Gender: Female
Where born: Glasgow, Lanarkshire
Registration Number: 644/13
Registration district: Tradeston
Civil parish: Glasgow Govan
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 26 Airlie Terrace
Occupation: Scholar
ED: 56
Household schedule number: 14
Line: 23
Roll: cssct1881_250
Household Members: Name Age
Ellen Robertson 46
Charlotte Robertson 16
Joseph Robertson 14
Minnie Robertson 12
Ada Robertson 10
Robert Robertson 9

Source Citation: Parish: Glasgow Govan; ED: 56; Page: 3; Line: 23; Roll cssct1881_250; Year: 1881.



They married in 1857 not 1859.

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

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Marriages Sep 1857 (>99%)
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Robertson Joseph St Geo East 1c 834
Waters Ellen Elizabeth St. Geo East 1c 834

Thanks Flick
Afraid I don't know how old Joseph was when he married Ellen Elizabeth Waters I was told came from by a relative that his father Alexander was at the wedding at St.Geo East and assume that both came from Scotland it would seem that Joseph was away at sea which would account for the absence from Census returns. Cannot think what to do next!!
Regards Graham

Don't have a sub to view the image but this looks like the marriage, with father Alexander:

, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
Birth, Marriage & Death, including Parish
View Image
PreviewName: Joseph Robertson
County: Middlesex

Event Date Parish
Borough Father Name
Spouse Father Name
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Name: Joseph Robertson
Spouse: Ellen Elizabeth Waters
Father: Alexander Robertson

Have a Marine Register of Deaths showing a Joseph Robertson drowned at sea by the wreck of SS Sicilia on Jan 5 1867 apart from his age(31) no other details were given and cannot establish whether thi s was my relative.Have not been able to find any reports on this shipwreck which might help find more background such as next of kin,home address etc.Made contact with Glasgow University who came back with nil result and suspect marriage cert ex St George East 1c 834 1857 won't show address for Joseph or father Alexander currently waiting for a reply from National Archives thanks everyone who has tried to help me...Graham

Graham it looks like Ada was born in 1870 so unless she has a different father to the others, that death can't be you Joseph. From the census records posted (and we know that the details were only as good as the informant gave) it looks like Ellen became widowed between 1891 and 1901.

Scotlandspeople have deaths for 16 Joseph Robertsons between 1891 and 1901 in the Glasgow City area of these none are in the Tradeston District or Govan (the nearest hospital for Tradeston at that time would have been the Southern General in Govan). None were born 1827 +/- 10 years.

Have you looked at Ada's birth certificate to check who her father was please?

Have you looked at Ellen's death certificate to see if she re-married please?

EDIT

It may help if you get the full names of the children. In Scotland Grandmother's maiden surnames are often used as a middle name for Granddaughters.

Have checked that Ada Ward born Jul 21 1870 was daughter of Joseph Robertson&Ellen Elizabeth.
Ellen died May 5 1905 widow of Joseph Robertson Master Mariner
Am interested to know how yourself & others pick up enquiry requests from people like me.I look at curiousfox.com site (expect you know them) and see they publish a daily posting of received enquiries.So far have not had any hits from them regarding my own requests but have been able to pass on scraps of info to others which may help fellow members Thanks again Graham

Further to previous suggestions by several members have contacted LMA re marriage entry viz:- District St George East Vol 1c Page 834 and was informed that the birth date & place of birth of Joseph will not have been recorded thus am still searching for these facts . As all Scottish Census returns do not show Joseph (presume that he was away at sea each time) it appears that I have reached a dead end

Reading through the thread, I notice that there is a son, Alexander who only appears in the 1891 census, aged 30. This looks like his birth, so he should appear on the 1861:

ALEXANDER JOHN ROBERTSON Pedigree

Birth: 25 JUN 1860 Central District, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: JOSEPH ROBERTSON Family
Mother: ELLEN ELISABETH WATERS

This looks like Alexander and Ellen in 1861:
1861 Scotland Census
about Alexander I Robertson
Name: Alexander I Robertson
Age: 9 MO
Estimated birth year: abt 1860
Relationship: Visitor
Gender: Male
Where born: Glasgow, Lanarkshire
Registration Number: 652/3
Registration district: Old Monkland Eastern District
Civil parish: Old Monkland
Town: Farms Cottages
County: Lanarkshire
Address: Greenside Cottage
ED: 2
Household schedule number: 14
Line: 11
Roll: CSSCT1861_118
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Cochrane 37 Civil Engineer, b England
Jane Cochrane 38 b England
Joseph Cochrane 19
John H Cochrane 14
Mary Cochrane 12
Thomas B Cochrane 10
Anne M Cochrane 6
William Cochrane 5
Jane Cochrane 1
Helen E Robertson 27 b England
Alexander I Robertson 9 MO
Elizabeth Falloon 16

which ties in with the Eliza's POB:

3. ELIZA CHARLOTTE ROBERTSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 28 SEP 1864 Old Monkland, Lanark, Scotland

Where did Ellen die please? Just wondering if it was in a hospital. If so, it may be worth checking the Poor Relief Records as this was often the route to hospital for those who could not afford to pay. The records for Glasgow are held at the Mitchell Library and are indexed. You never know, you may be lucky and find that she claimed relief after Joseph's death in which case they may well give a year and place of death for him.


The people that pick up the enquiries on here are just members like yourself. They often have subscriptions to sites like Ancestry.co.uk and FindMyPast and are happy to use these to assist other researchers. Many of them have many years of experience researching family history and are, again, happy to share their expertise.

Was hoping to find Alexander with a relative in 1871 which might have helped with Joseph's family, but no luck.

Ellen died May 5 1905 at home ... District of Tradeston,Glasgow Death record shows widow of Joseph Robertson(Master Mariner) informant J.Robertson (son) Am intrigued by the Cochrane household members and wonder if Elizabeth Falloon has any connection with Ellen This is all very complicated and am thankful to everybody for their efforts to help me
Regards Graham

Hi Graham

There does not appear to be a family connection with Elizabeth Fallon - she is shown as a servant on the 1861.

I did wonder if there might be a connection to Jane Cochrane but from the births of her children (on familysearch) her maiden name was Lloyd. Joseph's occupation of Civil Engineer is interesting, as Alexander is shown as a Bridge builder in 1891. I have tried to find Alexander in 1871 and 1881 but no luck.

I think that to find out more about Joseph and his father, you will have to get Joseph and Ellen's marriage cert. That would at least give his father's occupation and possibly Joseph's age, which might help find him on earlier censuses.

Have already contacted LMA re marriage cert but was told that Joseph's birth/address would not be recorded so apart from knowing his father Alexander (Master Mariner) was present at the wedding realised that sending for the document would not give me further info.I note that Alexander b1860 had a second name of John which was the christian name of his maternal grandfather John Waters( also a Master Mariner) and maybe if I could trace if he married details re his father Joseph would throw up some clues. this is all getting complicated to say the least!!
Regards
Graham

I am surprised that the LMA have told you that Joseph's address at the time he married would not be recorded on his marriage. This is standard info on a marriage reg as is the age of the partners, although this can sometimes say "of full age" meaning over 21. Maybe the LMA do not have full copies of the Register. I am sure this info would be on a cert ordered from the GRO.

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ELIZA CHARLOTTE ROBERTSON

28 SEP 1864 Old Monkland, Lanark, Scotland
JOSEPH ROBERTSON Family
Mother: ELLEN ELIZABETH WATERS

This is not Glasgow

Sorry computers playing up.

1871
Name: Helen E Robertson
Age: 37
Estimated birth year: abt 1834
Relationship: Wife
Gender: Female
Where born: London
Registration Number: 644/9
Registration district: Tradeston
Civil parish: Glasgow Maxwell
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 119 Shields Road
Occupation: Artstudent
ED: 91
Household schedule number: 67
Line: 21
Roll: CSSCT1871_140
Household Members: Name Age
Helen E Robertson 37
Eliza C Robertson 6
Joseph Robertson 4
Minnie E Robertson 2
Ada W Robertson 8 MO

1861
Name: Joseph Cochrane
Age: 37
Estimated birth year: abt 1824
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Jane Cochrane
Gender: Male
Where born: England
Registration Number: 652/3
Registration district: Old Monkland Eastern District
Civil parish: Old Monkland
Town: Farms Cottages
County: Lanarkshire
Address: Greenside Cottage
Occupation: Civil Engineer
ED: 2
Household schedule number: 14
Line: 1
Roll: CSSCT1861_118
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Cochrane 37
Jane Cochrane 38
Joseph Cochrane 19
John H Cochrane 14
Mary Cochrane 12
Thomas B Cochrane 10
Anne M Cochrane 6
William Cochrane 5
Jane Cochrane 1
Helen E Robertson 27
Alexander I Robertson 9 MO
Elizabeth Falloon 16


JOSEPH COCHRAN Family
Mother: JANE LLOYD

ALEXANDER JOHN ROBERTSON Pedigree
Male

25 JUN 1860 Central District, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland
JOSEPH ROBERTSON Family
Mother: ELLEN ELISABETH WATERS