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1891 England Census
about Thomas Thompson
Name: Thomas Thompson
Age: 52
Estimated birth year: abt 1839
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Frances
Gender: Male
Where born: Over, Cheshire, England

Civil parish: Over
Ecclesiastical parish: St John
Town: Over
County/Island: Cheshire
Country: England



Registration district: Northwich
Sub-registration district: Over
ED, institution, or vessel: 3
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Thomas Thompson 52
Frances Thompson 56
Fanny Thompson 15


Found this but not yet aware of child fanny
Definitely not this one.

This is a possible death for frances so that would not be them 1891

Deaths Jun 1888 (>99%)

THOMPSON Frances 44 Wirral 8a 260

Marriages Sep 1861 Davies Frances Holywell 11b 377
Thompson Thomas William Holywell 11b 377

Hmmm but why Hargreaves in census?

Little bit more on 1861
he is living with a Davies family in llanasa.
OH has Davies in Llanasa.
So does Madmeg. must get her on here too.

1861 Wales Census
about Thomas Wm Thompson
Name: Thomas Wm Thompson
Age: 21
Estimated birth year: abt 1840
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Male
Where born: London City

Civil Parish or Township: Llanasa
County/Island: Flintshire
Country: Wales


Registration district: Holywell
Sub-registration district: Whitford
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 139
Household Members: Name Age
Margaret Davies 51
Richard Davies 31
Thomas Wm Thompson



Richard is a master mariner

Explains why not with family 1881

1881 England Census
about Frances Thompson
Name: Frances Thompson
Age: 37
Estimated birth year: abt 1844
Relation: Visitor
Gender: Female
Where born: Mostyn, Flintshire, Wales

Civil parish: Tynemouth
County/Island: Northumberland
Country: England

Street Address: 2 Northd Terrace
Condition as to marriage: Married


Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Isabella Gee 48
Mary H. Gee 24
Jane Gee 24
Annie Gee 20
Robert H. Gee 18
Thomas Gee 17
John R. Gee 15
Arthur H. Gee 13
Edith H. Gee 12
Frances Thompson 37
Louisa B. Thompson 6
Mary Robinson 20
Margaret Hall

There is no marriage to a Frances Hargreaves

tracked Percy hargreaves 1866 but no clues there.

So we have mariage of Frances Davies 1861

but frances hargreaves listed as wife in 1871
with a 6year old also a Hargreaves.

but using Thompson 1881.

2 Fanny's? but no second marriage?

Hi LadyKira
Have another look at the 1881 census as Margaret is the wife of a master mariner and richard is a sayer or joiner.
Also not sure why Frances was listed as a Hargreaves. She's not mentioned in Robert's will only her children of which there is a Frances Ellen Whitaker.
.
I found on UKBMD a Frances Ellen Thompson b1867 Eastham Cheshire West EAS/17/16. Frances Davies was also known as Fanny in the 1851 census records.

Of course this doesn't help in one of the other records you found a Fanny but I think that would have made her born in 1876 not 1867, I'm confused.

Just looked at the 1861 census records and I wonder if the person taking the census just used the ditto under the name Hargreaves without really meaning Hargreaves, I think he meant Thompson.

Linda

I have found Frances Thompson /Whitaker now and I noticed the problem with dates. Maybe it was reversed on one document. Still looking at that.

I followed Percy as hargreaves through the other censuses.

Ladykira alerted me to this cos I have a John Davies from Llanasa born c 1840, but I cannot trace him firmly with his supposed father Peter, a Quarryman, until he pitches up in Glossop, Derbyshire in 1881. He marries Margaret Fish nee Duxbury in 1890 after having three children with her prior to that, and says he is a widower.

So if anyone happens to find him, I'd be thrilled.

The Hawarden office's best choice was father Peter, mother Ann Vaughan.

So, I don't think he's connected to Robert Davies, which is a pity cos he left money to a cats' home.

I'll see if I can help on here though.

Hi Janey
You know you said you have Littler's in your tree. Tell me, do you have an Eleanor Littler who remarried and became Eleanor Littler Whitley and had children Isabella Mary Whitley and Thomas Whitley?
Clutching at straws but they were in Robert Davies's will, but not as relatives.
Linda

There is a clue in the will you sent Linda

I bequeath to each of them, the said John Price Hargreaves and Withur Hargreaves who shall prove my will and accept the Trusteeship thereof the sum of THREE HUNDRED POUNDS.

I wonder if this is the one in the will?

1861 England Census
about John Price Hargreaves
Name: John Price Hargreaves
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: abt 1852
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Henry
Mother's Name: Mary Jane
Gender: Male
Where born: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England


Registration district: Birkenhead

Henry Hargreaves 44
Mary Jane Hargreaves 41
Ann Price Hargreaves 14
Jane Price Hargreaves 12
John Price Hargreaves 9
Elizabeth Price 37
Jane Rothwell 31
Caroline Glass 2 wk
Sarah Robert 16

1901 census - household transcription
Person: HARGREAVES, John P
Address: 3, Waterford Road, Birkenhead

HARGREAVES, John P Head Married M 49 1852 Stockbroker
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, Catherine G Wife Married F 47 1854
Whitechurch Co Dublin VIEW
HARGREAVES, Jahn A Son Single M 22 1879 Undergraduate
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, Annie B Daughter Single F 19 1882
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, William F C Son Single M 18 1883
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, Alfred R Son Single M 17 1884
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, Mary K Daughter Single F 12 1889
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
HARGREAVES, Herbert P Son Single M 10 1891
Birkenhead
Cheshire VIEW
GIBBS, Constance M Visitor Single F 38 1863
Edgbaston
Warwickshire VIEW
JOHNSON, Wilfred H C Visitor Single M 22 1879 Undergraduate
Pulloxhill
Bedfordshire VIEW
BIRKS, Elizabeth Servant Single F 23 1878 Cook Domestic
Buckley
Flintshire VIEW
HUGHES, Elizabeth Servant Single F 23 1878 Housemaid Domestic
Amlwch
Anglesey VIEW
FORSHAW, Lilian Servant Single F 27 1874 Housemaid Domestic
Bebington
Cheshire VIEW
SLEE, Harriet Servant Single F 15 1886 Kitchenmaid Domestic
Birkenhead
Cheshire

1911 census - household transcription
Person: HARGREAVES, John Price
Address: Oxton Birkenhead
HARGREAVES, John Price Head Married M 59 1852 Stockbroker Cheshire Birkenhead VIEW
HARGREAVES, Catharine Georgina Wife Married
33 years F 57 1854 Dublin Whitechurch VIEW
HARGREAVES, Henry Cecil Son Single M 30 1881 Stockbroker Cheshire Birkenhead VIEW
HARGREAVES, William Francis Carlile Son Single M 28 1883 Stockbroker Cheshire Birkenhead VIEW
HARGREAVES, Mary Kathleen Daughter Single F 22 1889 Cheshire Birkenhead VIEW
HARGREAVES, Herbert Price Son Single M 20 1891 Cheshire Birkenhead VIEW
JEWSON, John Christopher Visitor Single M 21 1890 None Private Means Norwich Norfolk VIEW
RALPH, May Single F 25 1886 Waitress Liverpool Lancashire VIEW
NIXON, Evelyn Single F 19 1892 Servant Cheshire Crave

Nothing to link with Percy or Frances yet

Linda, it's so nice of you to try to be related to me! ;)

My Littlers are from Cheshire in the early 1900s, and my own relocated to Leicestershire and then Nottinghhamshire, and then Canada. In my direct line there is no Eleanor, and I don't know of any sibling Eleanor to any of my directs.

A date or two would have been most helpful here I must say. I don't think I can deduce it because, at least as I'm understanding it, she was born Eleanor Littler, married Mr X and then married Mr Whitley. Without the X, I'm lost. No Littler-Whitley marriage so Littler must have been her birth name.

There are Eleanor Littler marriages in West Derby in 1894, Leigh in 1897, Aston in 1901, Manchester in 1935 and Bootle in 1937. Gotta be one of them?

There is a batch of Littlers in Wales through the 19th century censuses.


This Isabella in 1871? (she's Isabella Mary in a later census)

Thomas Whitley 39
Ann C Whitley 28
> Isabella S Whitley 6
Kate S Whitley 5
John J Whitley 3
> Thomas Whitley 3 months
Ellen Crooke 29
Mary A Musgrove 17
Elizabeth Newlon 28

in Newton, Lancashire.

Births Dec 1864
Whitley Isabella Mary Warrington 8c 122

I can only see her again in 1891 but the mother is still Ann Catherine, and Robert Davies had died by then.

I need one more puzzle piece before I can figure out who owned the giraffe!



LadyKira -- check this out. I'm going to put it here temporarily (and will delete it) in the hope of encouraging you ...


1901 census - household transcription
Person: HARGREAVES, John P
Address: 3, Waterford Road, Birkenhead

HARGREAVES, John P Head Married M 49 1852 Stockbroker Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, Catherine G Wife Married F 47 1854 Whitechurch Co Dublin
HARGREAVES, Jahn A Son Single M 22 1879 Undergraduate Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, Annie B Daughter Single F 19 1882 Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, William F C Son Single M 18 1883 Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, Alfred R Son Single M 17 1884 Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, Mary K Daughter Single F 12 1889 Birkenhead Cheshire
HARGREAVES, Herbert P Son Single M 10 1891 Birkenhead Cheshire
GIBBS, Constance M Visitor Single F 38 1863 Edgbaston Warwickshire
JOHNSON, Wilfred H C Visitor Single M 22 1879 Undergraduate Pulloxhill Bedfordshire
BIRKS, Elizabeth Servant Single F 23 1878 Cook Domestic Buckley Flintshire
HUGHES, Elizabeth Servant Single F 23 1878 Housemaid omestic Amlwch Anglesey
FORSHAW, Lilian Servant Single F 27 1874 Housemaid Domestic Bebington Cheshire
SLEE, Harriet Servant Single F 15 1886 Kitchenmaid Domestic Birkenhead Cheshire

See how neat and easy to read ...


(edit -- it isn't taking the word "View" out, although I did -- it's condensing each person onto one line instead of three, which means you can see them all at once without scrolling, and just tightens the thread up. Get three censuses on a page the other way, and it becomes a monster ...)

Frances Hargreaves does not appear on any other census.

JC I do try to do a certain amont of editing but the box is so small and I cannot see beyond the first line or two. I cannot see that taking the word View out is going to help anyone.

Births Mar 1852 (>99%)
HARGREAVES John Price Wirral 8a 394

Extract from the will for JC

To each of them. ISABELLA MARY WHITLEY AND THOMAS WHITLEY the children of the late Mrs ELEANOR LITTLER WHITLEY of Halton Cottage near Warrington the sum of FIVE HUNDRED POUNDS

So that's what we're basing the theory that she was born Littler, married someone else, then married Whitley, on? A tad tenuous maybe.

Thomas Whitley (married to Ann, father of Isabella Mary and Thomas) was the Vicar of St Peters Something in Newton. He's still living in 1891, so that can't be the right people. But I don't see any others to match.


Oh yes, well, "late" in 1882 might help there.

Well, hold on, aren't we talking about the will of Robert Davies who died in 1882? Seems not. It was a *date* I was after.

Name: Eleanor Littler Whitley
Estimated birth year: abt 1876
Year of Registration: 1905
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 29
District: Runcorn
County: Cheshire
Volume: 8


[deleted irrelevant Eleanor Littler in 1901]

Births Jun 1902
Whitley Isabella Mary Runcorn 8a 205

Births Jun 1904 ?
Whitley Thomas Runcorn 8a 222