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My Great Great Grandmother was illegitimate. This has taken ages to confirm as family whispers always had her husband as the illegitimate one. We know FOR SURE that he was not, and that is all now happily settled.
However, I now have her Birth Certificate. I've never come across illegitimacy in the family before so I am finding my way on this one. Dob: 16.12.1841 (no first name) in Brighton (birth registered by the Master of the Workhouse); christened Frances on 29.12.41 at St. Nicholas', Brighton with only mother's name of Jane Moon listed. Mother is listed as Jane Moon and that name stacks up. So far, so good. Lots of family photos and other memorabilia, etc., etc.

However, on Frances' birth certificate the name of the father is given as Walter SELLEY, Tailor.
And on her marriage certificate in 1861 (same church), she states that her father's name is James MOON, Butler.

I cannot find either of these two gentlemen in 1841 census, 1851 census or 1861 census.

I do know that mother Jane Moon went on to marry a Mr. White and has at least one son whom she called James (White). I've often wondered whether Frances 'made up' her father and reinvented him as her half-brother for the sake of decency!

Is there a sleuth out there who can find either Walter Selley and/or James Moon in 1841, PLEASE?

Thank you

can't find Walter or James sorry - you're lucky just finding illegitimacy in your family - hard to find legitimacy in mine!!!

Thank you for that - you made me laugh!
Possible that it isn't SEWELL, but JEWELL. Difficult to read but might make all the difference . . .
What do you think?

Sewell!!!????? where did that come in? Are you now saying Selley is Jewell?

I'm the clever one. My female ancestors had their kids before marriage, then got married, then had the kids I descend from. ;)

I'm confused here: "Possible that it isn't SEWELL, but JEWELL."

But earlier you said: "Walter SELLEY".

Is that the name you're talking about?

Whatever it is, it could also be mistranscribed in census databases, e.g. at Ancestry, as (assuming Selley) Telley, Jelley, Selleg, Lilley, Tilly, and you can just keep on making 'em up.

I'll take a wee poke about too.

1881 - here's a Frances Moon from Brighton - wrong date but could be connected

Fergus MOON Head M Male 33 Brighton, Sussex, England Bricklayers Labourer
Margaret MOON Wife M Female 40 Bishop Stalford, Hertford, England Charwoman
Robert HAGGIS Son In Law Male 14 Brighton, Sussex, England Stationers Assistant
William HAGGIS Son In Law Male 12 Brighton, Sussex, England Scholar
Frances MOON Dau Female 7 Brighton, Sussex, England Scholar


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Source Information:
Dwelling 2 Leicester Street
Census Place Brighton, Sussex, England
Family History Library Film 1341254
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 1079 / 118
Page Number 30

Hi Evie!!! I donlt know how old Nicola is but I feel she is having a sort of senior moment here- it'll probably end up as Smith

1881

James MOON Head M Male 55 Brighton, Sussex, England Butler
Esther MOON Wife M Female 56 Upper Beideny, Sussex, England
Alfred James MOON Son U Male 28 Brighton, Sussex, England Clerk To Brighton Town Clerk
Frederick Chas. MOON Son U Male 27 Brighton, Sussex, England Tailor
Harriett Esther MOON Daur U Female 25 Brighton, Sussex, England General Clerk
Jane Elizabeth MOON Daur U Female 20 Brighton, Sussex, England General Clerk
Alice Ann MOON Daur U Female 18 Brighton, Sussex, England General Clerk
Sarah WEBB Lodger U Female 75 Twickenham, Middlesex, England No Occupation


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Source Information:
Dwelling 32 Upper North St
Census Place Brighton, Sussex, England
Family History Library Film 1341257
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 1093 / 43
Page Number 9


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Questions first.

Where/when did Jane Moon marry James White? Not seeing a marriage in the GRO or the IGI.

Looking for Jane's personal data to place her in the 1841 census - do you have her there?

For ref:

Frances Moon
Christening: 29 DEC 1841 St Nicholas, Brighton, Sussex, England
Mother: Jane Moon
Batch No.: C013141

crumbs - just noticed I've found the butler - James Moon!!!!!

James Moon, butler, 1881 - excellent. I'm slow starting here. ;)

[edit - uh, yes, I noticed that straight off, before I saw you noticing it!]

So Nicola, do you know about that James Moon already, and that he was a butler? How is he Frances's half brother then? Sounds like he may have been Jane's brother. Or is it Walter you're thinking was a half brother?

Btw, making up a father for the sake of decency on a marriage certificate was a national pastime throughout the 19th century. My gr-grfather made one up for other reasons entirely, but just goes to show that it got done all the time.

The given name, surname and occupation (and status as deceased/living) were commonly some combo or other of real father, stepfather and/or maternal grandfather - or in the case of the groom, his own name (and occupation).

I'm old enough to know better and apologise profusely for throwing the curve ball out.
Of course, I meant to write JELLEY with a 'J' as opposed to SELLEY with an 'S'.
Right, back to business. I see our James Moon, Butler in 1881 - very interesting.
I really need, if poss, to find either of my GGM's choice of fathers in the 1841 census.
Can we start again, please?
Apologies again - will try not to be so silly in future especially when everyone's trying so hard to help me!

So go back to the beginning and tell us about Jane!

Where do we find her in censuses, what date/place of birth are given?

When/where did she marry?

1871 Census
Living at 2 Coast Guards Buildings, Sandgate, Kent.
Edmund Hooker, Head, aged 38, Coast Guard, born ????.
Frances Hooker, Wife, aged 29, born ????.
Edmund Hooker, Son, aged 5, Scholar, born ????.
Fanny Hooker, Daughter, aged 1, born ????.
Jane White, Mother, Married, aged 63, born Steyning, Sussex.

This is my own record and ignore the ??'s. I know that Jane White is NOT Edmund's mother, since her first name was Ann, so she's his MiL now remarried to (Charles) White??

f. Edward Moon m. Frances

1. MARY MOON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 10 OCT 1797 Steyning, Sussex, England
2. FRANCES MOON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 04 AUG 1799 Steyning, Sussex, England
3. SARAH MOON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 08 JUL 1804 Steyning, Sussex, England
4. ANN MOON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 22 FEB 1792 Steyning, Sussex, England
5. JANE MOON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 15 MAY 1808 Steyning, Sussex, England

1851

Name: Frances Moon
Age: 9
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1842
Relation: Niece
Gender: Female
Where born: Brighton, Sussex, England

Civil Parish: Steyning
Town: Steyning
County/Island: Sussex
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View Image

Registration district: Steyning
Sub registration district: Shoreham
ED, institution, or vessel: 2b
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 5
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Kennard 43
Sarah Kennard 46 (Sarah Moon????) b. Steyning 1805
Harriett Kennard 22
Frances Moon 9 niece
Richard Phillips 24

JANE MOON
Christening: 15 MAY 1808 Steyning, Sussex, England
Father: EDWARD MOON
Mother: FRANCES
Batch No.: C018401


edit: Okay, it's getting crowded and repetitive here, so I'll bow out.

http://content.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8767&iid=SSXRG9_593_593-0171&fn=Jane&ln=White&st=r&ssrc=&pid=7630797

I hope this is the way to do it??

If not, please somebody rescue me.

1841

Name: Jane Moon
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1811
Gender: Female
Where born: Sussex, England

Civil Parish: Brighthelmstone
Hundred: Brighthelmstone
County/Island: Sussex
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

View Image

Registration district: Brighthelmstone
Sub registration district: Palace
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Whelan 40
Harriot Whelan 15
John Whelan 14
Thos Brownrigg 30
Jane Moon 30

1841

** The image says Walter Selly, and he's a tailor. **

Name: Walker Selly
Age: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1821
Gender: Male
Where born: Ireland

Civil Parish: Brighthelmstone
Hundred: Brighthelmstone
County/Island: Sussex

Registration district: Brighthelmstone
Sub registration district: Palace

Caroline Reed 28
Edward Bowley 25
Walker Selly 20
Ruth Biddles 70

marriage of Jane Moon

Marriages Sep 1848 (>99%)
CHATHAM William Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
KING Edward Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
Moon Jane Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
O'HARA Margaret Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
Pettes Elizabeth Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
Razell Frederick Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
* Eliza Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view
SOUTHEY Eliza Brighton 7 390
White Charles Brighton 7 390 Scan available - click to view