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My Casselden family originates from Teston in Kent. They were gardeners on the local estate - Barham Court. There were also families in Brighton and Surrey. We are probably all related and I have a huge family tree from a third cousin I made contact with some years ago. I have also located a third cousin in Australia. I speculate that this very rare name has its origins in France, from Cassel just north of Dunkirk across the Channel in France. Several places in Kent have name endings 'den' probably meaning a valley. I have a web site: http://uk.geocities.com/mikecasselden/ Various other casselden relatives have been located here on GR, so if you are interested get in touch!

In view of your Casselden connections I wonder if you can help me in my research into a Rosetta Casselden who was living with Thomas bidgood a composer and musician in 1911 until his death in 1925. She later married an Ernest Beach in1927. According to the records she had 3 sons by Thomas, Thomas.W.Bidgood, who died in 1915 age 19 in Flanders (WW1), Henry James Arthur Bidgood born 1900 and Warwick J Bidgood born 1914. I have documentary evidence of the Casselden connection from Warwick's birth certificate and military file of Thomas's death and military grave in Berthune France (mother's maiden name). According to the 1911 census Rosetta had been married to Thomas Bidgood for twenty years but i have been unable to find any evidence of this. My research has come to a brick wall and hope that you may be able to help. Colin

Hi Colin

this is an old thread, Michael might not be a member anymore

you might be best contacting Michael by clicking on his name in the first post, if he is still a member genes will attempt to contact him

Colin, you might not have noticed that Michael posted this over 7 years ago and has never posted anything else on the boards. It's highly unlikely he will see this.
You could try sending a message by clicking on his name, but he will only get this if Genes have his current email address.
Probably would have been best to start your own thread, but as you have some info from Kira112, you might as well carry on here!
Jan

I can't find a birth at sea for Rosetta (as per 1911 census).

Probate appears to have been granted to the wife Thomas was with in 1891 and 1901 censuses.



Name: Thomas Bidgood
Probate Date: 19 Aug 1927
Death Date: 1 Mar 1925
Death Place: Middlesex, England
Registry: London, England


Bidgood, Thomas of 169 Harringay road Green lanes Tottenham Middlesex died 1st March 1925 . Administration (with will) to Emily Louise Widow. Effects £100.



Census 1891:

Address: 5, Vicarage Lane, West Ham County: Essex

BIDGOOD, Thomas Head Married M 31 1860 Professor Of Music
Woolwich, Kent
BIDGOOD, Emily Wife Married F 29 1862
Woolwich, Kent
BIDGOOD, Albert T Son Single M 7 1884
East Ham, Essex
BIDGOOD, Frederick I Brother Single M 27 1864 House Decorator
Woolwich, Kent
BIDGOOD, Minnie G Wifes Sister Single F 22 1869 Living On Her Own Means
Woolwich, Kent


Census 1901:

Address: 100, Romford Road, West Ham County: Essex

BIDGOOD, Thomas Head Married M 41 1860 Professor Of Music
Woolwich, London
BIDGOOD, Emily Wife Married F 39 1862
Woolwich, London
BIDGOOD, Albert Son Single M 17 1884 Commercial Clerk
East Ham, Essex
MOORE, Minnie Sister Single F 29 1872
Woolwich, London

Name: Thomas Bidgood - house painter
Age: Full Age
Spouse Name: Emily Louisa Moore
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 25 Oct 1879
Parish: Plumstead St Nicholas
Borough: Greenwich
Father Name: William John Bidgood - house decorater
Spouse Father Name: James Moore - joiner
Register Type: Parish Register


Thomas was a housepainter rather than a musician at this stage, but in 1901 census Thomas the musician has a sister in law called Minnie Moore.

it's an old posting Kucinta - see postings previous to yours - 2004!!

I had noticed Ann, but as BrummieJan said, given Kira112 had started responding on this thread, might as well carry on here responding to Colin. :-)

Just as a matter of interest:

Portsmouth Evening News - Saturday 28 February 1891

" A Wooden Legged Burglar"

Yesterday, at West Ham Police Court, Edward Fearneau 20, a wooden legged man, described as a labourer, of no home, was charged on remand with burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house 5 Vicarage Lane, West Ham, and stealing therefrom various articles, the property of Thomas Bidgood L.A.M, a bandmaster; and he was further charged with breaking and entering the dwelling house 13 Ferns Road, Stratford and stealing therefrom various articles valued at £4, the property of Hannah Springall; - The prisoner, who made no statement, was committed to the Essex Assizes for trial on both charges.

I'm not having any luck finding Rosetta in 1901, or the two older boys.

Thak you for aall your responses. They confirm my difficulty in trying to locate Rosetta. I have all Thomas's certificates (handed down in the family). With regard to Rosetta I have the following positive documentation:-

Cemetery: Bethune Town Cemetery
Country: France
Area: Pas De Calais
Rank: Private
Official Number: 9916
Unit: 2nd Bn. Oxford and Bucks Light Infantry.
Force: Army
Nationality: British
Details:
13th October 1915. Age 19. Son of Thomas and Rosetta Bidgood of 162 Harringay Rd. South Tottenham London. IV. F. 19.

The following is the wording on Warwick’s birth certificate.
When and where born:- 27th March 1914 at 162 Harringay Road Tottenham
Name:- Warwick John Sex:- Boy
Name and surname of father:- Thomas Bidgood
Name, surname and maiden name of mother:- Rosetta Bidgood formerly Casselden
Occupation of father:- Musician (composer)
Signature, description and residence of informant:- R.Bidgood, mother, 162 Harringay Road Tottenham
When registered:- 23rd April 1914

As a matter of interest Thomas, although not in the military, composed the military march "Sons of the Brave" which is regularly used on big military occasions including The Trooping of the Colours. He was also a professor at the Royal School of Music. Unfortunately he was said to be an alcoholic and died from gas poisoning while of unsound mind - Coroner's verdict - in 1925.

She married Beach using the name Bidgood, but that is no proof that she ever married Bidgood

You haven't given birth info for Rosetta

Could this be her?

Births Sep 1871 (>99%)
Casselden Rosetta Ann Poplar 1c 623
Marriages Sep 1887 (>99%)


Marriages Sep 1887 (>99%)
Anscombe Harriet Matilda Poplar 1c 920
BOATWRIGHT Alfred James Poplar 1c 920
BUTLER Alfred Charles Poplar 1c 920
Casselden Rosetta Ann Poplar 1c 920

I think you need to do some checking!

1911

BIDGOOD, Henry James Head Married M 38 1873 Traveller Hampstead Rd London VIEW
BIDGOOD, Lettie Emma Wife Married12 years F 36 1875 St Georges on the East VIEW
************BIDGOOD, Henry Arthur Jas Son M 10 1901 School Tottenham VIEW
BIDGOOD, Eva Daughter F 7 1904 School Walthamstow VIEW
BIDGOOD, Alexander Son M 3 1908 Islington VIEW
BIDGOOD, Bertha Daughter F 0 (4 MONTHS) 1911 Tottenham

1901

Name: Henry Arthur Bidgood
Age: 10 months
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1900
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Henry James Bidgood
Gender: Male
Where born: St Tottenham, London, England
Civil parish: Tottenham
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Registration district: Edmonton
Sub-registration district: Tottenham
ED, institution, or vessel: 45
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 308
Piece: 1252
Folio: 180
Page Number: 48
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry James Bidgood 38
Littie Bidgood 23
Alma Blanch Bidgood 1
Henry Arthur Bidgood 10 months
Kate Stent 15

Name: Alfed Charles Butler
Age: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1864
Spouse Name: Rosetta Ann Casselden
Spouse Age: 17
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 21 Sep 1887
Parish: Bromley St Leonard St Mary
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Father Name: Henry Butler
Register Type: Parish Register


Name: Rosetta Ann Casseldon
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1874
Baptism Date: 31 May 1874
Father's Name: James Casseldon
Mother's Name: Rosetta Ruth Casseldon
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Bartholomew by the Exchange
Borough: City of London
Register Type: Parish Registers

It would be helpful if you posted the 1911 census to which you referred

You omitted to post the name from the CWGC record

BIDGOOD, THOMAS WALTER

There is no birth on freebmd to match the death record

Reggie,

Thank you for your input and comments.

With regards to the 1911 census the following is the data :-

R.Bidgood – Wife age 37, T.Bidgood _Head age 51 married 20 years 4 children born alive 2 surviving
R.Bidgood born at sea. T Bidgood born Woolwich South.
T.Bidgood occupation – musician & teacher
Children:- W.T.Bidgood son 14 and H.J.Bidgood son 12 both born in West Ham
Address 91 Harringay Road, West Green, Tottenham

I think that the "At Sea" birth could be a miss reading of two ditto signs in the birth box in 1881 census for Casselden as I could not find any reference to Rosetta among At Sea births..


I have looked at the Rosetta Ann Casselden and Alfred Butler marriage and did not think this is applicable as Rosetta had 3 children Allan b 1891, Walter b.1897, and Henry b 1899 But I am now wondering if Rosetta left Alfred or he died and she and the children took the Bidgood name. The census says she had 4 children of which 2 died by 1911 and the two surviving children were W.T. (Walter Thomas) and H.J.(Henry James). The dates and christian names tie in with those in the 1911 census.

Thomas was known for his dalliances with woman as well as his alcoholism.


Incidentally Henry aka "Harry" Bidgood was also know as Primo Scala and his accordion band and broadcast regularly on BBC. All Thomas's sons were musicians in one way or another.