Military Chat

Hello any body,

My Grand Father was killed in WW1 George James Reid Scottish attached to West Kents
I understand. Can't find when and where he was killed. I also need the date. Please
Thanks
Jan

Is this him?

REID, GEORGE JAMES
Rank:SerjeantService No:3814Date of Death:22/10/1916Age:35Regiment/Service:The Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment) 6th Bn. Grave ReferenceII. B. 15A.CemeteryETRETAT CHURCHYARD
Additional Information:

Son of George and Mary Reid; husband of Josephine J. Reid, of 92, King St., Rochester, Kent.

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/101798/REID,%20GEORGE%20JAMES

and his medal card from TNA which can be downloaded for £3.36

It will say what medals he was awarded, Someone may do a lookup on ancestry to see what he was awarded and also if his service record survived the bombing in WW2, Only abt 30% survived


Reference: WO 372/16/188629
Description: Medal card of Reid, George
Corps Regiment No Rank
The Queen's Regiment G/3814 Acting Corporal
The Queen's Regiment G/3814 Serjeant
Date: 1914-1920
Held by: The National Archives, Kew

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D4818857


Roy

From ancestry,


Name: George Reid
Birth Place: Beverley, Yorks
Residence: Halstead, Kent
Death Date: 23 Oct 1916
Death Location: France & Flanders
Enlistment Location: Tonbridge, Kent
Rank: Sergeant
Regiment: Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment)
Battalion: 1st Battalion
Number: G/3814
Type of Casualty: Died of wounds
Theatre of War: Western European Theatre
Comments: Formerly 4545, R.W. Kents.

Name: George James Reid
Age: 35
Birth Date: abt 1881
Death Date: 22 Oct 1916
Cemetery: Etretat Churchyard; Etretat Churchyard Extension
Burial Country: France
Father: George Reid
Mother: Mary Reid
Service Number: 3814
Region or Memorial: France

I wonder?

1891 census,


Name: Geo Read
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Geo Read
Mother's Name: Mary Jane Read
Gender: Male
Where born: Beverly, Yorkshire, England
[Beverley, Yorkshire, England]
Civil Parish: Woolwich
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Registration District: Woolwich
Sub-registration District: Woolwich Arsenal
ED, institution, or vessel: Army Service Corps Barracks
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 534
Folio: 51
Page Number: 4
Household Members:
Name Age
Geo Read 38
Mary Jane Read 32
Geo Read 4

1891


Name: George Reid
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Father's Name: George Reid
Mother's Name: Mary Reid
Gender: Male
Where born: Beverley, Yorkshire, England
Civil Parish: Colchester
Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity and St Botolph and St Giles
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Registration District: Colchester
Sub-registration District: Colchester, First Ward
ED, institution, or vessel: Garrison (1)
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Schedule Number: 1
Piece: 1707
Folio: 65
Page Number: 3
Household Members:
Name Age
George Reid 42
Mary Reid 43
George Reid 14
Henry Reid 7

This would seem to match the NA entry found by Porkie Pie/Roy. This is from Ancestry

Name: George Reid
Regiment or Corps: The Queen's Regiment
Regimental Number: G/3814

Queens o R Rank Pte
Queens oR Rank A/Cpl
Queens o R Rank *Sgt

Victory medal
British medal
Star (the number 15 added to the entry)
Theatre of war; (1) France
Date of Entry therein 6-7-15

Remarks
Died 23/10/16
Correct Rank Auth Enclo 3A (probably referring to Sgt as there is a * next to it)
OC Recs Hanwell requests instructions for disposal of medals of deceased N.C.Os and (men?) of the R West Surrey R (dated) 21.7.20

.........

There are a lot of George Reids!

Thank you everyone.
I am very grateful for your input. I know there was a lot of George James Reid's . But I didn't believe he was a sgt. I always understood he was just a private.
But who knows?? As they made them up quick in WW1.I also understood him to been born in Leith Scotland. However he was married to his first wife Josephine 'til about 2009ish. she was scottish too! But I know he did marry my Grandmother in the end as she received the pension and the notification from war office he had been killed in action. My mother was born in 1914 and she was 2 when he was killed. She was Alice Mary .
My grandmother Alice Beatrice. What dont add up is the Yorkshire bit.

Men didn't always serve in their local regiments, WW1 had heavy losses and men were allocated to whatever regiment needed the manpower to replace losses

I have one born lincs served in an Irish regiment and another from Norfolk who served in the durham light infantry and my uncle who was from Yorkshire in WW2 served in a Australian regiment

Roy

Hi all.
Thanks so much again just seen the DOB on the war records and it can't be 1881? I make it 1875 he was 2 yesrs younger than my Grandmother. she was 1873. Not sure about this I'll have to go back and have anoyher look at my records.

Odd that Josephine should be shown as his wife on the CWGC site. The information on the graves was collected until a few years after the war. Whereabouts did the family live?

Some thoughts purely from a research perspective (I am no military expert); looking at the facts from a different angle may help you establish that this George James Reid is indeed your grandfather.

What age is given for George Reid on his daughter Alice Mary's birth certificate in 1914? This should give you more of a clue if the dob of 1881 is correct.

Do you know anything about the mother's maiden name given on Alice Mary's birth certificate? I cannot tie this name in with Reid marriages. It may have been mis-transcribed of course.

If you are taking Alice Beatrice's year of birth as 1873 calculated from her death record then be aware that this is not always accurate (no proof would have to be given, it would depend on what whoever registered the death stated). The only proof of birth is a birth certificate.

What name was given on the War Office notification of George Reid’s death? Was it Mrs George Reid, Mrs Alice Reid or just Mrs Reid. It is possible that George & Alice Beatrice never officially married and Alice assumed the name of Reid after George’s separation from Josephine - and before the birth of their daughter Alice Mary . This may explain why ‘first’ wife Josephine is noted as his wife on the CWGC site. The only proof of marriage is a marriage certificate.

I hope this helps. I’ve seen so many people follow incorrect lines due to assuming dates & names given by other family members as fact, without backing it up with solid evidence. And I would like to say thank you to the military experts, I have learned so much just by looking through the thread!

With best wishes
Carol

Carol, agree with most of what you say but re the first point - father's age isn't given on birth certs. It might be given on his marriage cert(s) but might just say full age.

Also, re Alice M's birth reg - her mother may have been married before and the marriage to George Reid would be in her 1st married name. Also, the MMN in the birth index could be wrong - it is quite an unusual one and I can think of more than one name that could have been mistaken for it.

Jan, do you know where Alice Beatrice was born?

Have you tried looking for his marriage to Josephine on the scotlandspeople site? A Scottish marriage cert will give both his parents' names. The site is pay to view and you can view and download an image of the original marriage entry.

This looks like the George posted in the above censuses. There are a lot of others in the same house, all as boarders. The couple have been married 3 years and have had one child who has died:


1911 England Census
about George Reid
Age in 1911:27
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1884
Relation to Head:Boarder
Gender:Male
Birth Place:Bearley, Yorkshire, England
Civil Parish:Liverpool
County/Island:Lancashire
Country:England
Street Address:21 Bridport St Liverpool
Marital Status:Married
Occupation:Operator (image says cinematagraph operator - what occupation is given for George on Alice's birth cert?)
Registration District:Liverpool

George Reid 27
Josephine Reid 27 b Ireland

This is the only marriage coming up on scotlandspeople for a George Reid to a Josephine, so not your George:

1 1906 REID GEORGE ROY BREBNER JOSEPHINE ANNAN WOODSIDE ABERDEEN CITY/ABERDEEN

Yes, my mistake re father's age on birth cert, apologies.

I couldn't find reference to a marriage of an 'Alice Beatrice' to a Mr M.... or similar, there are quite a few to just 'Alice' so any of these are possibilities.

FMP transcribes George Reid's place of birth as Beverly, Yorks and looking at the original I think this is correct - the 'v' could be an 'a' but my view is it's definitely Be?erly. This ties up with the place of birth given on the war record for George James Reid (albeit misspelt).

Obviously this doesn't prove that this is Jan's grandfather, we need details from Alice Mary's birth certificate, particularly George's occupation, as you have already pointed out.

There is a death record of a Josephine Reid in Eastbourne in 1945, aged 61 which would make her approximate year of birth 1884, could this be George's first wife??

The 1945 death would tie up with the 1911 census. I can't find a marriage for that couple - possibly in Ireland?

Edit: no marriage coming up in Ireland either.

Hi everyone
Thanks for all this help But Ive found out more and my Dad who died last year blesshim left me notes which has just come to light! He was 99. & such a good memory.
My cousin also helped shes 85...Now Josephine was married to our George James by civil service in Ireland. Her surname name was mispelt to my dad's notes .... it was annulled a short after the wedding! Don't know how long.
We dont know why. so this dont show any where of course. My Grandmother with George and baby Alice Mary lived at 92 King St, Rochester. Kent. (all pulled down now)
So now we know. but I have verified alot of this too. Next step find that marriage...I'll try parish.
As she did get the letter to say he was killed in action and his pension. she kept it for a long time. Not sure of that.
But I feel the records with the war office may be 'old' ones, likre when he joined up. Does that make sense?
His DOB is 1875 though, so did he lie when he joined up?
Jan