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Hello,

I have an ancestor, called Sarah Ann Gruton. From what i understand, she married a man called Daniel Judd, who was born in 1844, in 1863. However, I have found some conflicting censuses, that imply that at the same time, she was married to someone called Abraham Judd, how is this possible? I have attached some useful biographical information, on the people in question below:

Daniel Judd
1844–1899
BIRTH JANUARY 1844 • Ongar, Essex
DEATH APRIL 1899 • Epping, Essex, United Kingdom
3rd great-grandfather
Found in the 1851, 1861, 1871, 1881 and the 1891 censuses.
Parents: James Taxbey Judd (1811-1878) and Ann Stanes (1811-1886)

Sarah Ann GRUTON
1845–1914
BIRTH ABT 1845 • Coopersale, Essex, England
DEATH 1914 • High Ongar, Essex, England
3rd great-grandmother
Found in every census mentioned above and below.

Abraham Judd
1843–1898
BIRTH MARCH 1843 • High Ongar, Essex, England
DEATH DEC 1898 • Chelmsford, Essex, England
husband of 3rd great-grandmother
Found in the 1851, 1871, 1881 and the 1891 censuses.
Parents: William Judd (1806-1853) and Susan Flack (1808-1897)
__________________________________________________________________

There seem to be two different marriages, with different children, but there are some records, to suggest that some of the children belong to both Daniel and Abraham Judd. Needless to say, it would be good to know, if they are two separate marriages, and which children belong to who. It would also be good to know, my correct line of ascendance/descendance.

Kind regards,
From Edward Powell

For ref

Marriages Dec 1863 (>99%)

Gurton Sarah Ongar 4a 127
Judd Abraham Ongar 4a 127

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
King Street, High Ongar, Ongar, Essex, England

Essex, England Abraham Judd Head - Male 27 1844 -
Essex, England Sarah Judd Wife - Female 26 1845 -
Essex, England Alice Judd Daughter - Female 6 1865 -
Essex, England William H Judd Son - Male 4 1867 -
Essex, England Ernest J Judd Son - Male 1 1870 -

Birth of Alice in 1865 confirms mmn as Gurton
JUDD, ALICE GURTON Order
GRO Reference: 1864 D Quarter in ONGAR Volume 04A Page 85

Isn't the correct maiden name for Sarah actually Gurton? As per your other thread on this page....................

https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/living_relatives/thread/1370228


For INFO ONLY

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Johnsons Cottages, Princes Road, Chigwell, Epping, Essex, England
Learn more

Print transcription View image Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Birth place Occupation
Daniel Judd Head Married Male 48 1843 Essex, England Jobbing Gardener Transcription
Sarah Judd Wife Married Female 47 1844 Essex, England - Transcription
William E Judd Son Single Male 20 1871 Essex, England General Labourer Transcription
Robert D Judd Son Single Male 17 1874 Essex, England General Labourer Transcription
Caroline R Judd Daughter - Female 13 1878 Essex, England Scholar Transcription
Alice L Judd Daughter - Female 11 1880 Buckhurst Hill, Essex, England Scholar Transcription
Bertie C Judd Son - Male 8 1883 Essex, England Scholar Transcription
Agnes M Haley Lodger - Female 20 1871 West Ham, Essex, England General Servant Domestic Transcription

JUDD, BERTIE CHARLES CAIN Order
GRO Reference: 1883 D Quarter in EPPING Volume 04A Page 249

Marriages Dec 1863 (>99%)
Cain Sarah Epping 4a 73
Judd Daniel Epping 4a 73

Sarah (nee Gurton)

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Old Wathers, King Street, High Ongar, Ongar, Essex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Birth place Occupation
Abraham Judd Head Married Male 48 1843 High Ongar, Essex, England Journey Man Blackend Transcription
Sarah Judd Wife Married Female 47 1844 Essex, England - Transcription
Thomas Judd Son Single Male 17 1874 Essex, England Agricultural Labourer Transcription
Daisy Ethel Judd Granddaughter - Female 2 1889 Essex, England

Daniel is not related to you - unless he was Abraham's brother

Marriages Dec 1863 (>99%)
Cain Sarah Epping 4a 73
Judd Daniel Epping 4a 73

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Johnsons Cottages, Princes Road, Chigwell, Epping, Essex, England

Daniel Judd Head Married Male 48 1843 Essex, England Jobbing Gardener
Sarah Judd Wife Married Female 47 1844 Essex, England -
William E Judd Son Single Male 20 1871 Essex, England General Laboure
Robert D Judd Son Single Male 17 1874 Essex, England General Labourer
Caroline R Judd Daughter - Female 13 1878 Essex, England Scholar
Alice L Judd Daughter - Female 11 1880 Buckhurst Hill, Essex, England Scholar
Bertie C Judd Son - Male 8 1883 Essex, England Scholar
Agnes M Haley Lodger - Female 20 1871 West Ham, Essex, England General Servant Domestic

JUDD, BERTIE CHARLES CAIN Order
GRO Reference: 1883 D Quarter in EPPING Volume 04A Page 249

Ahead of me there Erika :-)

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Forest Hall, Road Side, High Ongar, Ongar, Essex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Susan Judd Head Widow Female 48 1813 Labourers Widow Essex, England Transcription
Hannah Flack Daughter Unmarried Female 31 1830 Labourers Daughter High Ongar, Essex, England Transcription
Abraham Judd Son Unmarried Male 19 1842 Agricultural Labourer High Ongar, Essex, England Transcription
Henry Judd Son Unmarried Male 15 1846 Agricultural Labourer High Ongar, Essex, England Transcription
Ruth Judd Daughter Unmarried Female 14 1847 Scholar High Ongar, Essex, England Transcription
William Judd Son Unmarried Male 10 1851 - High Ongar, Essex, England Transcription

Nyx..........Confirmation of info found is good.............

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Cottage, Moreton, Ongar, Essex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
James Judd Head Married Male 40 1811 Farm Labr Barking, Essex, England Transcription
Ann Judd Wife Married Female 40 1811 - Essex, England Transcription
Emma Judd Daughter - Female 14 1837 - Moreton, Essex, England Transcription
John Judd Son - Male 10 1841 Farm Labr Moreton, Essex, England Transcription
George Judd Son - Male 8 1843 - Moreton, Essex, England Transcription
Daniel Judd Son - Male 6 1845 - Moreton, Essex, England Transcription
William Judd Son - Male 1 1850 - Moreton, Essex, England Transcription
Stephen Judd Son - Male 0 1851 - Moreton, Essex, England

So - not connected to Abraham, unless it's further back in history

JUDD, WILLIAM ALFRED FLACK Order
GRO Reference: 1850 J Quarter in ONGAR Volume 12 Page 189

JUDD, RUTH FLOCK Order
GRO Reference: 1846 D Quarter in ONGAR Volume 12 Page 162

Which of Sarah (Gurton) Judd's children is your proven direct ancestor?

Erika, as the name sounded familiar and had ticks against the name on FMP I checked messages and the link is through the later marriage of William Ernest Judd, child of Daniel and Sarah (nee Cain), and Agnes Haley... they are together on the 1891 census you posted.

My direct ancestors are William Ernest Judd, and Agnes Margaret Haley.

So Sarah Gurton is not related to you - your relation was Cain at birth.

Do you know about freebmd?

https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Looking there would have saved you getting confused over the census records.

It's an excellent free site - worth bookmarking for future use

Hi there,

Sorry for the late reply. I have used freebmd before, and i have found it quite useful on occasions.

Kind regards,
From Edward Powell