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Facebook and Twitter accounts are voluntary.

Having one's personal data posted here w/o one's knowledge or consent, not so much.

Sorry Joonie

I'm afraid I simply don't agree with you. I have used this site for a lot of years and as long as the information posted doesn't break Genes rules - which I'm assured by them in the past when I was asked by them to be part of their "help clinic" that it doesn't - I don't think there is anything wrong here.

Unfortunately in this time of social media there is much more that can be found out about a person other than a birth reference from an index - which is why I, myself, don't use sites like Facebook and Twitter.

Kath. x

Yes, Kathleen, that is the standard answer.

Two things:

- Internet search engines do not find that information and they do find information posted here

- the public domain information does not appear in the context of personal details like: the person had a child outside marriage

My standard question is always: do you or does anyone else want their birth reg info posted here?



concerning the electoral roll entry referred to by Shirley

http://tinyurl.com/zw9g37m

an appointment she held (if that is she, which seems sure from matching bio information) was terminated in 2014

and without a death record for Arthur by 2007, since Arthur has not been on the ER in the last 15 years, his absence from her household does not mean he is deceased.

Joonie,

The birth and marriage details posted on here by me do not give any information other than what is already in the public domain on the open register. I wouldn't dream of giving any other information - never full birth dates etc. but as I say, what is posted is accessible already to anyone who wants to look on the register or electoral roll.

Kath. x

well Susanna was on the electoral rolls to 2011 but Arthur wasnt with her at the address in Bristol

Since there is no death recorded for either Arthur or his wife in the records accessible to 2007, and many people born in the 1930s are still living, is it appropriate to post his birth details, marriage details, etc, in this forum?

I have always thought not, that this was an invasion of privacy, but I seem to be constantly mistaken ...

??

Alice Gardner in the England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name: Alice Gardner
Registration Year: 1911
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: Paddington
Inferred County: London
Volume: 1a
Page: 56


Alice Gardner in the 1911 England Census
Name: Alice Gardner
Age in 1911: 0
Estimated birth year: abt 1911
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Paddington
Civil Parish: Paddington
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 24 Hampden Street, Paddington
Marital Status: Married
Registration district: Paddington

Household Members:

Ernest Gardner 29 Paddington (Horse Keeper)
Lily Edith Gardner 27 Paddington
Alice Gardner 0

Ernest and Lily married 5 years........3 children born, 1 living, 2 had died.

Ernest Thomas Gardner in the London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
Name: Ernest Thomas Gardner (Bachelor) Horsekeeper
Estimated birth year: abt 1883
Age: 23
Spouse: Lily Edith Bruce (Spinster)
Spouse Age: 21
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 4 Feb 1906
Parish: St Oswald, Anselm Road
Borough: Hammersmith and Fulham
Father Name: Stephen Gardner (Cab Driver)
Spouse Father: Robert Bruce (Carpenter)
Register Type: Parish Register
Witnesses: Thomas George Bourne and Mary Jane Still


Ernest Thomas Gardner in the British Army WWI Service Records, 1914-1920
Name: Ernest Thomas Gardner (Occupation....Horse Keeper)
Gender: Male
Birth Date: abt 1883
Birth Place: Paddington, London, England
Enlistment Age: 26
Document Year: 1909
Regimental Number: 556
Regiment Name: London Brigade ??
Number of Images: 6
Form Title: Territorial Force Attestation

Family Members:
Name
Relation to Soldier

Ernest Thomas Gardner Self (Head)
Lily Edith Gardner


2 possible sons born to the marriage after 1911......

Births Dec 1917 (>99%)
Gardner Frank W Bruce Paddington 1a 10

Births Mar 1920 (>99%)
Gardner Robert W B Bruce Paddington 1a 39

Thanks everyone x

If you look on FreeBMD they had three children to 1937

These don't show as an open record as they are possibly still alive

On the 1939 Register (which is what you have been given above) anyone who is less than 100 years old and hadn't died up to the time the records were regularly amended (about 1990) has their record "closed" so that no one can see them. These are likely to be children of Alice and Arthur. Basically it means that their names and other information about them is covered up on the original image.

Kath. x

What does the below mean about the 3 children and closed records?

Littleprinces Road , Hendon M.B., Middlesex, England
Start free family tree View original imagePrint
FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB SEX OCCUPATION MARITAL STATUS SCHEDULE SCHEDULE SUB NUMBER
Alice Temple 28 Jan 1911 Female Part Time Cleaner Heavy Worker Married 234 2
Arthur E Temple 07 Feb 1904 Male Setter operator??? Married 234 1

there are 3 closed records which will equate to the 3 children

Arthur Edward Temple in the 1911 England Census
Name: Arthur Edward Temple
Age in 1911: 8
Estimated birth year: abt 1903
Relation to Head: Son
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Leyton, Essex, England Civil Parish: Paddington
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 9 Senior Street, Paddington, W
Occupation: SCHOOL
Registration district: Paddington
Sub-registration district: Paddington Central

Household Members:

George Temple 47 ISLINGTON, Middlesex (Butcher Assistant)
Martha Temple 43 HACKNEY, Middlesex
Violet Mary Temple 13
Gladys Bethia Temple 10
Arthur Edward Temple 8
Thomas Frederick Temple 2

George and Martha married 23 years.......9 children born, 8 living, 1 had died


George Temple in the London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
Name: George Temple (Bachelor) Butcher
Estimated birth year: abt 1864
Age: 24
Spouse: Martha Willson (Spinster)
Spouse Age: 20
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 25 Dec 1888
Parish: St John the Baptist, Islington
Borough: Islington
Father Name: Thomas Temple (Deceased) Coffee House Keeper
Spouse Father: George Willson (Baker)
Register Type: Parish Register
Witnesses: George Connerey ? and Annie Willson

Res for both.......12 James St.


Thomas Temple in the 1871 England Census
Name: Thomas Temple
Age: 45
Estimated birth year: abt 1826
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Sarah Temple
Gender: Male
Where born: Tottenham Cowrt Rd, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Islington
Ecclesiastical parish: St Phillip
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Islington

Household Members:

Thomas Temple 45 (Morning Coffee Stall Keeper)
Sarah Temple 41 Acton, Middlesex
Nicholas Temple 19
Emma Temple 13
John Temple 9
George Temple 6 <<<<<
Henry Temple 4
William Temple 2
Alice Temple 2 Months


Thomas Temple in the England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index, 1837-1915
Name: Thomas Temple
Estimated birth year: abt 1828
Registration Year: 1883
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 55
Registration district: Islington
Inferred County: London
Volume: 1b
Page: 244

her death

First name(s) ALICE
Last name TEMPLE
Gender Female
Birth day 28
Birth month 1
Birth year 1911
Age -
Death quarter 3
Death year 1993
District BRIDPORT
District number 4281
Register number 24B
Entry number 005
Date of registration mm/yy 0793
County Dorset
Country England

the informant could be family

Arthur passed before her

First name(s) ARTHUR EDWARD
Last name TEMPLE
Gender Male
Birth day 7
Birth month 2
Birth year 1904
Age -
Death quarter 2
Death year 1977
District BRIDPORT
County Dorset
Volume 23
Page 0461

so this looks like alices birth

Births Mar 1911
Gardner Alice Paddington 1a 56

and Arthur

Births Mar 1904
TEMPLE Arthur Edward W. Ham 4a 420

Temple Household (2 People)
3 Littleprinces Road , Hendon M.B., Middlesex, England
Start free family tree View original imagePrint
FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB SEX OCCUPATION MARITAL STATUS SCHEDULE SCHEDULE SUB NUMBER
Alice Temple 28 Jan 1911 Female Part Time Cleaner Heavy Worker Married 234 2
Arthur E Temple 07 Feb 1904 Male Setter operator??? Married 234 1

there are 3 closed records which will equate to the 3 children

look on FreeBMD for siblings births also reg Paddington

you may be able to follow them up

If the birth above is the correct one for your grandad then this is likely to be his parents' marriage:-

First name(s) ARTHUR E
Last name TEMPLE
Marriage quarter 2
Marriage year 1931
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ ARTHUR E TEMPLE married
ALICE GARDNER
Spouse's last name GARDNER
District PADDINGTON
District number -
County London
Country England
Volume 1A
Page 99
Record set England & Wales marriages 1837-2008

Kath. x

Have sent you a private message with possible children from the above marriage.

Kath. x

Thank you for this

Hannah x

Welcome to the boards Hannah.

This is a possible for your grandad's birth:-

First name(s) ARTHUR P
Last name TEMPLE
Birth year 1933
Birth quarter 1
Registration month -
Mother's last name GARDNER
District PADDINGTON
County London
Country England
Volume 1A
Page 11
Record set England & Wales births 1837-2006

There is also this possible marriage:-

First name(s) ARTHUR P
Last name TEMPLE
Marriage quarter 3
Marriage year 1964
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ ARTHUR P TEMPLE married
SUSANNAH F MAUGER
Spouse's last name MAUGER
District WANDSWORTH
District number -
County London
Country England
Volume 5D
Page 1515

Kath. x