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What area of Notts did your friend inquire for any paperwork>

She was 2 weeks old and it was in Nottingham. She was born in a "nursing home" so I wouldn't be surprised if they were involved

How old was Pauline when the adoption was granted>?

Was it in Nottingham?

Has she looked into the background of the adoptive family,,,could either have worked with the birth mum?as arranged adoptions usually parites have had a personal contact,,,,private is usually done by word of mouth,

Do let us know when you receive the 1951 marriage cert.

Prickles. ;o))

Wow.

Thank you all for your thoughts. I would have joined in but a friend popped in yesterday and asked me look for her maternal branch. Turned out some kind sole has put a photo on line with her G Grandfather and Grandmother with other family members. Great excitement from friend!

Anyway, back to Constance. She was apparently with an older man at court but its not know if it was her father, brother or someone else.

The adoptee Pauline did make inquiries with the court bu no papers were found.

Gerry

Perhaps her family wasn't from Beeston as she may have moved to be near work.

My parents left at 14 in 1930 and 1935 but gave the example of my aunt as she went past the date in this case.

Surely the Constance L at Rufford Rd is the 1 born 1911 not 12, for some reason lost a year. Birthday right quarter wrong year.

She is staying/boarding with the Deppe family.

This looks like the only Al(l)sop(p) family in Beeston in 1911, at 2 Broad Gate:

Henry Alsop
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Henry Alsop
Age in 1911: 45
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Mansfield Woodhouse, Nottinghamshire, England
Civil Parish: Beeston
County/Island: Nottinghamshire
Country: England
Street address: 2 Broadgate, Beeston Notts
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Railway Clerk Official
Registration district: Basford
Registration District Number: 429
Sub-registration district: Beeston
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Piece: 20430
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Alsop 45
Mary Elizabeth Alsop 45
Maud Mary Griffith Alsop 25
Florence Emma Alsop 24
Percy Douglas Alsop 19
James Edward Alsop 17
Maggie Alsop 16
Doris Mayr Alsop 14
Edna Madelon Alsop 12
Noel Guy Alsop 10
Nira Irene Alsop 4
Henry Kenneth Alsop 3

Constance L, posted by Kay, might be the 1911 Constance, with a mistake in the YOB?
Birth registered in the correct quarter, at least.

Yes, of course - my father left school and went to work at 14, in 1929, as his wage was needed.

It was the Butler Act 1944 and used from 1947 that moved the leaving date to 15. My youngest aunt left at 14 and she was still at school in 1939, she left school in 1942 born in 1928.

I once did a project about female education and it's inequalities and did a section on the Butler act and talked to relatives about their schooling prior to the act.

The 14 yr old Constance would very likely be at work. Not many working class girls' education went on past 14, their wages were needed.

1939,
Allsopp Constance L,,22 April 1912,Single and a clerk at Boots,,(which is in Beeston) she is at ,40 Rufford Rd,Basford,,no corresponding birth,so she either took a step surname ,, been missed off the indexing, or born outside England/Wales.

School leaving age was 15.........

Come to think of it - would a 14-yr-old be a tobacconist's shop assistant?

My thoughts too Pat.

I personally would not rule out the one born 1911.

A query about the court case.

Was the mother with her parents or an adult In loco parentis. If not she was over 21.

Up to the late 1960s children were being adopted without the (under 21) mother's permission. A mother under 21 was a child and would have no legal rights over her baby and her parents would be able to sign the child away to be adopted. If the mother had no parents surely someone else would have to take over as a legal guardian to allow the court to do the adoption as a mother, still legally a child, couldn't sign the forms

What made me ask is the lady who was adopting said the mother looked very young. Being small I was never seen as an adult for many years. Someone I knew thought I was a teenager when I had children - a 7 year old and a 3 year old with me. My first was born when I was 24. My daughter is still being stopped from buying alcohol without producing a means of identification and once had a bottle of champagne taken from her basket and she was refused the sale. Someone she knew worked there and bought it for her later that day. She's well into her 30s. :-D

If she was old enough to sign then perhaps she just looked very young. This could mean the older Constances could be in the frame as the mother if not look at the 14 year old.

It's a conundrum :-)

Could she have been as young as 14 ??

There's a 1926 birth in Nottingham.

Then there's a possible marriage in 1943 in Atherstone.

That Constance was a GI bride. Her husband's home was in Texas.
In 1946, she and a 4-month-old daughter sailed from Southampton to the USA.


EDIT: -

No, the one who married in 1943 isn't the one who was born in 1926.
From US Social Security record, she was born Warwickshire 1923, and mms Pickering, which doesn't match the 1926 birth record.
And I now see her birth 1923 Atherstone.


Which still leaves the 1926 birth as a (slight) possibility for Pauline's mother.

I found the exact info Pat,and cant find any relationship to Allsop/p either way back to 1900.

Gerry I wonder if it was a private adoption,which at that time only needed a solicitor and a court to grant the adoption,as in your post you state the adoptive parents and birth parent were both present,which is very unusual as privacy was kept at a premuim.

Private adoptions were stopped 1983.in UK

Has the adoptee applied to the court who granted the order to see if any paperwork is archived.

Does the BC say Allsop or Allsopp.......no middle I gather which means Constance didnt have one.

Also if Constance was born after 1915 there is a greater chance she wont show in 1939.---1920 birth would make her 19/20 when the child was born 1940 ,,,,,,concidered young back then,

Kent Road is in Carlton and is close to Mapperley Golf Club.

On 1939 Register in September 1939 at 26a Kent Rd Carlton.

Eric J Douglas 15 Sep 1871 Wholesale Fruit And Potato Marker Lorry Driver Heavy Worker

Ivy A E Douglas 02 Sep 1912 Unpaid Domestic Duty

Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record


They are married, am sceptical about Eric's 1871. The years on the original are 12 for Ivy and there's a couple of squiggles above Eric's. It's been transcribed as a 7, I think it's a 1 therefore 1911. Squiggles seemed to refer to their neighbour.

Yes it is 1911 birth. Found out he married 1935, she was a Sonnell but think there's an error. Can't find her as Sonnell but Bonnell.

The child is a daughter born 1938.

At No 26 is a family named Green. He's retired.

Wonder if the Douglas family were related or friends? She may have just known the area.

Hope this helps :-)

Hi Kay

Pauline, the adoptee was born a the nursing home in Mapperley Notts and Constance, her mother was living in the same area at the time. Where Constance was born is not known.

Social Services could not find any info, which was the same for me in Worcester.

Constance was single

So,,the lady was actually born in the area of **Mapperley Park** in Nottingham and not Mapperley over nr Ilkeston which is edg of Derbyshire,


Basford would be the reg district.

Has the lady applied to Nottingham Social Services for any adoption paperwork they may hold.?.from the time it was handled by Welfare but SService took over custodianship of their records late 1960s.this is the best route as as scant the paper/s maybe there will be more details than can be gleened from the BC in these cases,she may have even been a married woman.?