General Chat

Thanks you guys for listening.

LW

Hi Hazel, you know you can always send anyone you empathise with a pm if you want to talk about personal stuff. When a problem is wrote down I can look at it from a new perspective and it does help. Or no need to talk personal stuff, just having friends on here has helped lift me, hopefully others too. I certainly see a big difference in me now, to when this thread first started. And having the support of friends here every day backs up any doubts.

Had news of a second friends death on Monday. She had gone out with her husband and he wanted a hair cut. She said she would go to her friends for coffee, while he had the hair cut. Our friend told her friend she felt unwell and could she have a glass of water. She dropped down dead. What a way to go.

LW I think that sometimes by writing things down we make sense to ourselves. Hope it was helpful to you to be able to write that down and know that somebody would read it and empathise with you. Hope you are able to turn things around.

Yes this thread is great as I am sure carole knows and it is good that people can read, know there are others in the same boat even if they don't want to comment.

Carole,

Yes, I read this thread at least twice a day but very rarely post. I suffer from depression and anxiety and sometimes feel sorry for myself. Reading about others gives me a really hard kick up the backside and spurs me on to shape myself. No, I don't believe in the 'pull yourself together' phrase that non-sufferers come out with but it makes me realise I'm not doing any good feeling sorry for myself.

I don't have 90% of the problems that many of you have. I am not making light of them. I really feel for everyone but I do sometimes slip into 'poor me' mode. I am quite selfish with my 'me,me,me' attitude and I must stop it.

This post may not make much sense, but I want Carole to know that this thread is invaluable.

LW

Daff thanks for your input to help Claire. I often wonder how many people read this thread but don't post anything. Sorry to hear about your sister. It's quite a stress on you isn't it.
As you may all remember I called the social workers out to my Aunt Lou last year. I was worried that she could fall. Or was cold, and not eating well. Also that she was having people in her house and didn't know who they were. What if she fell in her yard and someone found her, and helped her into her house, they would surley think why have her family left her in this mess? Well guess what they said, are you happy here, are you coping. She said yes and off they went. When old folk are found dead in their homes and have been dead a while, we ask why didn't anyone do anything to help? Well with the system we can't.

Claire,please remember that the social services feel that your mother is responsible enough to decide how to live therefore YOU ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR HER ACTIONS.
I always thought I would have a lot of guilt after my mother died,probably because she had always told me I would and you never really know until it happens.Well I didn't.
Your life is 150 miles away and it is YOUR life not hers to control.Likewise,you cannot control hers.
If it was you behaving in the same way as she is,do you think she would be feeling the same way as you are now?I think not.

Claire,

Sorry to hear of your troubles with your mum. I can't offer any advice but for her sake and yours I do hope that you are able to get things sorted out soon.

Carole,

So sorry to hear of your friends passing.

Sending (((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))) to both of you

Alison

It is just so hard no being able to do anything for someone who clearly needs help. I have phone her 8 times today left messages asking her to ring but to no avail.

I fear that she will continue to self neglect until she goes into a diabetic comma or something and eventually we get a phone call to say she has been dead a week and they found her body.

That is not an easy thought to live with.

Carole, so sad for you at this time, sorry you missed the message, it does happen and now I have an answering machine that blinks red when there is a message. It is a very annoying and demanding blinking as well. I am thinking of you and keep yourself well at this time, you have had much stress lately.

Daff, what can I say, but, well said. I also have a sister who is bi polar, and another close family member as well. The only time I seem to get any peace is when they are sectioned, horrid thing to say, but truth.

My mother was only admitted to care when she became a danger to my father. Even then it was a long drawn out process. Do not know why but she was let keep her license to drive, though not having it would not have made a difference, and yes she would get in the car and get lost.

I also had an aunt that lived in filth for many many years, only when she became a danger to herself or others was she placed in a nursing home. It was not just mess, or an accumulation of things, just down and out filth. Dogs doing their business in the house as well, big dogs. I gave up trying to help out, she was much happier with the filth anyway.

It is very stressful going through these situations, and at times it is better for our own health to back off. Not easy either, there is only so much anyone can do.

Thinking of everyone, hi to our Yorkie lass :))

love and hugs

Gail

Hiya all... just thought I'd make a couple of comments here... I do read the thread quite a lot... I have a vested interest, as my sister has mental health problems, in fact she was sectioned 10 days ago... and I have been her main supporter, even though I have my own life threatening health issues to deal with. She wished me dead last week, a long, lingering and painful death, was how she described it. So guess who will no longer have me in her life?

A close friend, whom I love dearly, has bi-polar.

I want to comment on the issue around a dirty, messy home... been there, worn the t-shirt. Hubby is an only child, and guess who was the one who dealt with it all? Yep... moi, again.

The social workers hands are tied.. they rely upon the evidence of their own eyes, and also evidence from medical professionals. If a person appears to be lucid, medically fit, and in control of decision making, and medical staff/cpn's agree with that, then the law states that a social worker cannot force a person to live in a clean environment UNLESS they are causing a serious health or health and safety risk to others as well as themselves. If family and relatives wish it to be otherwise, then they must clear up themselves. It is all down to the Human Rights, and the element of choice.

You would be amazed at how much filth one woman can accumulate in two weeks.... I was regularly slated by *friends* of my mil.... even though hubby was away defending their flaming country, our son was recovering from a broken back and lived 300 miles away from me at the time, and I went to him on my days off... I worked full time (social worker/manager of residential home for adults with severely challenging behaviours) and had what we now know to be the precursor to my current problem... and I took annual leave once a fortnight to go on a 200 mile round trip to her, in order to clean for a woman who knew exactly what she was doing, and took great steps to explain that she liked it that way. Which meant that when hubby got back from Iraq, or wherever, I had no leave left to chill out with him!

Some people do not want to be helped. It took me a number of extremely stress filled years to realise that... and then my own illness to decide that I must stop feeling guilty over it.

She is now in a residential home, with a filthy room... and as soon as it is cleaned, she filths it up again. Until she had a stroke... I called the ambulance... she had locked us all out.... they said that they could only break the door down if I thought she was at risk from fire... so I then called the fire brigade and told them I thought she'd left the hob on... we had done the same thing a couple of times before... and she had been fine, crying wolf in a phonecall to me, as usual. This time it was for real.

It is not always someone's fault... maybe society is too quick sometimes to find a scapegoat. Not a pleasant aspect of human nature, and I am as guilty as the next person. I partly blame my cancer on the stress of it all!! Edit.... mostly, I know it is just one of those things, no-one is to blame, it just happened.

Whitenancy, you may have to face the dilemma I had to face... there comes a time when we have to accept that we can do no more.... and that others can do no more. That on it's own will reduce your own stress.

Take care, and I hope all goes well.

Love

Daff xxxx

Claire, maybe your Mum's friends feel they will be letting her down if they talk to social workers, maybe they have been accused by her before of interfering so don't be too hard on them. Just ask the social worker to do another assessment and explain what you feel may be the problem, that is all you can do really while she is still appearing to be lucid.

Carole, I am sorry to hear about Anita, such a cruel illness but she is out of pain now and I am sure she knew how much you loved her.

Thank you for all your replies it really dose help to have some constructive suggestions. My head is aching from worrying about it all and woke up this morning feeling like i had been run over by a bus.

Phoned the social worker who has been dealing with her and he didnt think their seemed to be a problem when he visited on Friday! but then even people with advanced dementia can appear rational and lucid for short periods.

Her so called friends are not willing to talk to the social workers even though they probably know her better on a day to day basis than i do which annoys me they call themselves friends and Christians to my mind they are neither

The social worker seems to only take things at face value and dosnt seem to be prepared to dig a bit deeper.

My mum has suffered from depression for as long as i can remember but the Diogenes syndrome certainly seems to fit i will pass this info on to the social worker and her GP.

At least i have my OH to support me through all this but i am feeling very battered and very down and bleak at the mo maybe i need to up my meds to enable me to cope with all this.

Claire

Anitas funeral is Feb 11th

Carole, I am glad your Aunt seems to have accepted her new home and is happy for her old place to be cleared. You must feel relieved at seeing her happy.
I am so sorry that your poor friend Anita lost her fight against the cancer but you can't wish her back really to suffer more pain and suffering. Shame you didn't notice the message sooner but I don't expect you have missed the funeral as these things seem to take a while to sort out. I haven't heard yet about my relative but will phone tonight if they don't send me a message first. Don't think I will be going all the way to Banbury tho, depends when it is and how I feel.

Hi Barbra, u.t.i.s and dehydration can cause confusion. Maybe Claire's Mum isn't drinking sufficient liquid especially if she is having tummy problems, hence the confusion, but I think considering she got the place in a mess before, it is more likely to be something else, possibly the Diogenes. I still feel the social worker isn't doing her job properly if she cannot see the state of the place, wonder if she has actually visited lately or just phones.

Keep us posted Claire.

LIzx

Carole your Aunt sounds a lot better now bless her . its sads when you break the home up . but she is in a better place now with friends & carers . give her a hug from me Take care Barbra xx

Oh Claire you poor love, having this worry over your mum.
Do you remember last year I called the social workers to call on my aunt who wasn't taking care of herself? She fell at Xmas and to cut the story short had a water infection and she was coming out with the strangest things. We now have her in a home and she is doing very well. Your mum could have a UTI like Barbara says, or the other thing Liz says. Which ever, I think you need to talk to her doctor, can you get a phone appointment like we can? You can have people certified, but what a terrible thing to have to do to get help for your mum. She can't be left this time.
Is it her own house? You must be feeling so mixed up over this.
Sometimes we have to take the bull by the horns and do something. Try CAB. They may be able to give you some ideas as to what can be done. It may be unpleasant but you have to make something happen. Please keep us up to speed with this.
We are here any time you need some support. xx


Do you remember our friend Anita? (She had cancer of the pancreas). She died Wednesday. We are so upset. There had been a message on our answer phone and we didn't notice until this afternoon. I just hope she knew how much we love her.
I so wish we could tell her again.


Went to see Aunt yesterday, she was sat in her chair, feet up on her walking frame, and knitting, looking at home. I was so pleased to see her looking so well. Took her a few more things to make her room homely. Went and bought her a new coat, was going to take her with me, but she had other visitors, and said she had the runs!! Seems to accept that we need to empty her house, or she will have to keep paying council tax as well as the £1600 a month for the care home!! She has been telling people if there is anything they want out of the house to take it, so she must be ready to let the house go. She wants to go see it, so I said I'd take her when it gets warmer as it's so cold and damp there. That way it gives her more time to settle into the new care home. She has been getting more visitors as well so she will enjoy that.

Claire, I do feel for you all.
I remember the problems you had before and it is very obvious that the social worker is not doing their job. Your mum had a major problem already and now seems to be developing some kind of dementia. She isn't behaving normally and I think maybe you need to talk with her doctor and explain the latest behaviour and say you are not happy with the attitude of the social worker.
It must be a big worry for you and I know you went there before and helped sort things out a bit. I hope you can get the doctor to put his weight behind more help for your mother in being properly assessed and treated. It sounds to me as though your Mum has Diogenes syndrome:

Diogenes syndrome
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Diogenes syndrome, also known as senile squalor syndrome, is a disorder characterized by extreme self-neglect, domestic squalor, social withdrawal, apathy, tendency to hoard rubbish (syllogomania) and lack of shame

The condition was first recognised in 1966 and 'christened' as Diogenes Syndrome by Clark et al. The name derives from Diogenes of Sinope, an ancient Greek philosopher, a Cynic and an ultimate minimalist, who allegedly lived in a barrel. Not only did he not hoard, but he positively sought human company by venturing daily to the local agora. Therefore, this eponym is considered to be a misnomer , and several other names should be used such as senile breakdown, Plyushkin's Syndrome (after a character from Gogol's novel Dead Souls ,social breakdown and senile squalor syndrome. Frontal lobe impairment may play a part in the causation (Orrell et al., 1989).

References
^ Cybulska E & Rucinski J 'Gross Self-neglect in Old Age' Br J Hosp Med

Ask your Mum's doctor and social worker to look into the above possibility/probability.



Lizxx

It does seem as though something needs to be done, I would have another go at social services, maybe she is crafty and can cover things up when they go to see her. But the bottom line is I think, unless somebody decides she is incapable of making decisions and is not well mentally there is going to be nothing you can do. I guess she will gradually lose her friends if she goes on behaving peculiarly. Sorry not to be much help.

not posted for a while but desperately need some advice.

18 months ago my mum who is now 79 had a fall and broke her hip she waited 3 days before she finally called the ambulance because she didn't want anyone to see the state of her house and the way she was living.

The house has disgusting it was like something off one of those tv shows only worse. To cut a very long storey short we got the house sorted and she went home.

As a result of my various rants/posting on here i came to the conclusion that my mother has a narcissistic personality disorder.

Just before xmas 2009 she had to go into hospital as she had got an infection in her foot that wasnt responding to treatment and to no ones great surprise once again her house was in a disgusting state.

This time she couldnt wriggle out of things and agreed to work with social services who arranged for her house to be cleaned and arrange respite care whilst everything was sorted.

She has been home for just over a week and once again i am starting to get phone calls from here friends saying that they are concerned about her.

Last night a male friend went round to find her wearing nothing but a cardigan sitting in her lounge with the curtains open so anyone walking past could see her state of undress!

The friend went in (the front door was unlocked) and closed the curtains. She seems to be unaware that she was virtually naked so he drew the curtains. She asked him to look for her phone which she thought she had dropped in the bedroom so he went to look for the phone and was appalled to find her bed soiled an that she had made no attempt to change it.

The phoned turned out to be on the sofa and not upstairs and her message inbox is full so no one can leave a message for her and half the time she dosnt answer the phone.

I have been noticing for sometime that her memory is not what is was and that she swear blind we have not told her things when we have.

She wont wear glasses yet she obliviously needs them says she cant afford them and dosnt need them yet her friend told me today that he has seen her holding her hymn book upside down!

Phoned the social worker who has been dealing with her case to tell him of her friends concerns and he seemed to think that she was mentally ok and quite capable of making decisions for herself , but surely it is not normal for someone to leave soiled sheets on the bed and invite their friends in when they are virtually naked!

She has always been stubborn and unwilling to accept that she need help but it now seems to be getting to a point where she really is not capable of managing for herself.

What do I do where do I go for help?

Claire

p.s i live 150 mile away from my mum as do my sister and we are her only family. we have tried and failed to get her top move closers but she point blanked refuses saying her friends and social life are more important than her family

I assume all are OK as nobody has been on here for two days. I too filled in forms as part of my job Sharron but some of today's forms are so ambiguous I have a problem with them.