General Chat

Studies of ice cores from both ice caps indicate that global warming started with the widespread use of coal for industry, transport and heating in the early C17. Since then the only marked pause was 1940-1946 when warfare failed to match peacetime levels of energy use.

It is only in the last 20 years and esp the last ten that there have been computers with sufficient power to analyse the weather, both today, going back wards and of course looking at future inconveniences. The analysis, based on a vast quantity of data, show that natural processes can only be held responsible for a tiny part of global warming. Indeed without man another Ice Age would eventually come about.

The main environmental impact of satellites is the launching of powerful rockets not the satellites in orbit. Evenso as Kense says the emissions of cargo ships are far more signficant. Same for civil air transport. Accurate weather forecasting makes a lot of use of dedicated weather satellites.

Even if there was a total shutdown of carbon based energy production tomorrow and sources of methane production halted too the built in dynamic would still generate significant global warming over the next century.

Thus people are going to have to make large scale changes to their way of life either voluntarily or they will be foced on them. Denial is not an option.

After taking away govt subsidies for oil and coal extraction it is now more economic to generate power from solar , geo and wind sources than carbon or nuclear.

The current global economy of manufacture and production of industrial products (esp concrete) depends on VLCC & LPG tankers, bulk container ships and large jet transports. Although transport pollution has been reduced there is so far no sign that pollution levels can be reduced to the required levels.

Thus the extension of the global economy along the lines assumed by China, D Trump and the current junta in Whitehall will end one way or another.

If we go on as we are there will be serious shortages of food and means of heating. As buildings can be designed to have minimal net energy use and there is more than enough egricultural land in "the West" to feed everybody we may be looking at really poor government which will in the custom of such errors be terribly punished.

The generations born since 1950 will experience lifestyle changes not seen over such a period since the Industrial Revolution. If the past is any guide denial, resistance and armed insurrection are quite possible. OTOH communities can seize the opportunities which a greener planet will offer.

Overall the EU is slowly adapting itself to the future and its opportunities as well as problems. The main laggard is the UK which is on course for nul points though there are bright spots.

Although the hottest years have been since 2000, the most recent of the ten coldest years was 1963 (I remember it well) . That implies that the warming has been going on for much longer than twenty years.

I don't think you need worry about the number of satellite launches. Last year there were about 114, which is minimal compared with say Heathrow which has several times than number of departures every day.

Once in orbit the satellite has virtually no interaction with the Earth's atmosphere until its orbit decays and it returns to Earth. They presumably cut out some sunlight when they transit the Sun but that would have a cooling effect if it was measurable.

Container ships are among the most polluting things around. One big one is as polluting as 50 million cars.

In addition to Rambling's list we can help by limiting the number of children we have and cutting back on long distance flights,

We can see the effects of climate change all over the world.

Right Whales are endangered, only about 700 left.

7 have been killed so far this year around the Gulf of St Lawrence on the east coast of Canada. Most have been killed either by large ships hitting them or by getting entangled in fishing gear left by trawlers.

They never used to come as far north as that, the furthest north was the Bay of Fundy.

The scientists think that the reason is that the sea is warming. this is drawing tiny sea animals further north, the whales feed on these animals so they also are coming further north, right into the major sea lanes for ships entering the Gulf of St Lawrence.

The glaciers and ice sheets in Greenland and the arctic are melting faster than previously. This results in more and water entering the seas, and therefore the sea levels along coasts everywhere will rise.

According to the TV news last night, there are literally hundreds of sharks being seen around the beaches of Florida and further north as Maine ............. most unusual as they prefer warmer water. People are annoyed because they can't go swimming!

The crops countries used to grow will no longer grow because it is becoming too hot, so different crops will have to be chosen ........ but that alos means different weeds, insects and diseases will appear.


There are things one can see happening, even a lay person can see it, but there are also things that only scientists can see MIGHT happen.

Whack job!

‘End of the world’ by Herbert W Armstrong (1892-1986) in ‘Mystery Of The Ages‘:

‘Mankind is nearing the end of his rope. Today man’s world is reeling on its last legs. Wars, violence, destruction & terrorism engulf the entire world. Half the world exists in ignorance, illiteracy, poverty, living in filth & squalor.

The developed half is sick with ill-health, disease, mental stress, fear & frustration, wracked with crime, alcoholism, drug abuse, perverted & misused sex, broken homes & hopelessness‘.

With respect to Mr Durrant Dermot, he probably wrote that at some time before some of the newly industrialised nations were churning out their current spew and before scientists worked out what was likely to be the result.

Climate change is not just about the planet warming up, so it's nice and toasty, its about plants which are nec' to the circle of animal life not growing when and where they are needed, it's about flooding on areas now above sea level, it's about getting to the point from which there is no recovery for the wildlife that depend on certain environments...sure cockroaches will do well, but a world without polar bears and penguins, without butterflies and bees? No thanks I wouldn't want to be here ( and won't be).

Apologies if that sounds a bit 'testy' but I have just been listening to someone babbling on about having stripes in their lawn and wanting their shrubs cut back because they can't see the main road properly so they can see next doors comings and goings :-| and moaning because they have to sort one person's waste ( very minimal) for recycling .

Sorry about that, had to go off and didn't notice it had posted twice, it's doing that a lot on here lately.

Rambling so good you said it twice ;-) things are in our hands to be more enviromently friendly we have trees in our garden lawns.A woodland at the back of house Petrol car .trying not to use plastic were possible plants flowers for butterfly & bees .areas in garden left for wildlife.can we all do our bit for generations to come Barbara :-)

‘Certain factors condition civilisation & may encourage or impede it. Civilisation is just an interlude between the ice ages.

At any time, the current of glaciations may rise again, cover with ice & stone the works of man, reducing life to some narrow segment of the earth.

Or the demon of earthquake, by whose leave we build our cities, may shrug its shoulders & consume us all indifferently’.

(*A small excerpt from ‘The Story Of Civilisation’ by Will Durant 1885-1981).

Deep breath...

One thing we could all do, is read about it and try to understand it as far as possible for a lay person, which obviously I am ( esp when it comes to science!) . To become aware of what small things you can do now, that added together may make a difference.

The second thing and it's something most of us can manage is to stop covering our gardens in concrete, gravel etc. Have a tree (if you have room have lots :-) ) have shrubs that insects like, have a pond if you can, have grass and don't be obsessed with mowing, have nectar plants. Think whether you really need another bit of 'stuff' made of plastics or any of the things that have to be dug out of already suffering ground. Think about cutting down on meat/palm oil. any of the things that lead to forests being chopped down or land laid to waste.

Someone ( D Trump for eg) will add that there have always been climate changes ( the ice age etc, other periods of continued cold or heat) , and so it's nothing new just 'fake news', but what is not true of the past is the extent to which we have added to it by our actions and what is not true of the past is how many more people will be affected by climate change if we continue regardless.

We here will almost certainly be dead before the worst of it comes, but I can't understand why people who have children or grandchildren shrug it off as too much trouble to think about. The same applies to anyone who has ever taken pleasure from watching nature, feeling the fresh air of a winter's morn, looked at the first early flowers... surely you'd want future generations to experience the same, even if they are not your family.

I personally think we will probably destroy the planet, in terms of nature and a decent place to live, as too many people make too much money out of the status quo to want to change things.I'd LOVE to be proved wrong :-)

I was just saying exactly the same thing to my son last night. Too many satellites etc. put into space.

It was also reported on the news that the 10 hottest years recorded have been since the year 2000. To me that seems like it is what we are doing at the present time that is causing climate change and not what happened in the last 100 years. Perhaps all the pollution from industries in the past and old "dirty" cars were what blocked out the sun's harmful rays and kept us cooler than we would otherwise have been. Perhaps not good for people in general but better for the earth itself.

Don't want to get into an argument with anyone, just an observation.

Kath. x

Everybody is going on about climate change & it is awful all the storms flooding .I myself believe a lot of of our problems are to do with objects being sent up in our sky's. Not being scientific just a lay person but surely something is very wrong with our atmosphere .need changes asap most important in our lifetime to sort it out for future generations Barbara