General Chat

"www.kctmo.org.uk"

Says they do 10,000 buildings and the tenants are welcome to join a separate board??

8 residents (as I expected), 4 council-appointed and 3 independent, Caroline.

I can't speak for Rollo but my brother serves on the Board voluntarily after being asked to join the other members. He has done so for several years even before he retired.

So, no big bucks there Caroline.

Is the Ken and Chelsea Tenant Management Organization made up of its tenants? It sounds as though it could be.

All the papers are saying this building; along with many others; is run by a private company called Kensington and Chelsea tenant management organisation.
Some are calling for Corporate manslaughter charges to be considered.

Doesn't sound like just board members doing it in their spare time.

"The budget small powderfire extinguishers sold retail for about £20 are a good idea to have around for small domestic accidents."

Can't stress enough how much I agree on this, one small one probably saved my bungalow from going up, it was just enough to control a fire in the tongue & groove clad boiler/airing cupboard. I'm just going to order one.

Managed, Caroline? Or do you mean Board members?

Strange how social housing is managed by highly paid groups, they raked in the money and the tenants should be grateful.

The budget small powderfire extinguishers sold retail for about £20 are a good idea to have around for small domestic accidents. Few homes whether social or private have one though.

From the point of view of a social or private landlord though free provision is a non starter. Why?
1 they can only deal with small fires and then only if used quickly.
2 they are not catch all leaving the landlord open to civil action; similarly tenants would have to be trained in use as "common sense" is a weak defence in English civil law
3 strong chance of being resold on eBay , car boot
4 strong chance water type being used for games
5 landlords would have to replace them every five years as replacement cheaper than inspection
6 cost for landlords inc overhead costs far too high

In any case no hand held extinguisher of any sort could deal with an external fire especially of the ferocity at Latimer Rd.

World wide large building fire security is built in the concept of secure safe areas, firewalls and doors allowing time for evacuation. Sprinklers can be very destructive in themselves esp in old buildings but properly installed are a plus with post 1950 buildings.

If large scale refurbishment and construction methods are seriously compromising the safe area rule then there is a very big and very expensive problem. If the insurers decide that cladding is potentially unsafe for instance. Just a physical inspection would run into millions let alone a fix.

The hurt and loss of life are terrible. That it should take the death of over a hundred people to bring some honesty to our building codes is extraordinary.

I just hope that the inevitable changes will not drive smaller organisations out of renting esp non social and old property. Few of our tenants could afford the brutal rents commonly demanded in London and few qualify for HB. Mr Peabody must be turning in his grave.

<3

I think its best to wait for the qualified people to try andpiece things together and fire experts will offer the most credible I think.

Inflated stories will float about. :-)

It is a desperately heart-wrenchingly sad situation and I fear we may discover that the causes of deaths are down to a number of factors.

For example, I read this morning that it could have been due to a defective electrical appliance. In that instance, who was at fault, store, manufacturer or owner.

In addition, who wrote that in the event of fire, remain in your apartment?

Then again, the cladding must have been approved by building inspectors but who checked the cladding fire rating and its method of manufacture?

Again, who was the architect who thought one stairwell was enough in a building of such capacity? Who, at the local authority passed the plans?

I think you'll get my drift .... the list goes on but can blame be apportioned?

I feel heartily sorry for those who died or who were injured and for the friends and relatives of all. It is something that will haunt them for the rest of their lives, I'm afraid. I sincerely hope that they may all find a kind of peace eventually but I fear it will be hard to do so.


Rollo, it is admirable that you took care of your colleague. You wrote that you were on the board of a property company (you aren't my brother?) and I am pretty sure that you, like my brother, will be double-checking everything now and in future. It's times like these when the responsibility of board members comes to the fore.

I wonder if the story is correct that the person packed a bag of clothes before raising the alarm? If so you have to think they had no idea what could happen, even the experts didn't think this would happen.

I have a domestic dry powder one on the kitchen wall bought when our local fire station did a safety awareness and demo about 8 years ago it cost from the stall about £15 and doesnt have a shelf life nor needs any checks...many stores sell them such as B&Q etc

How much have the authority lost on the block.......£85.000000 and the guilt for ever of what has happened.

Kay, it costs money to check on fire extinguishers every year . :-(

Well I see Rollo RR threads came back amazingly fast.....a bit much RR them but still of course Rollo was involved.

That said this genuine situation is unquestionably awful and no amount of enquiries will bring these poor people back but will hopefully stop it happening again to others.

I've never understood why in highrise especially social housing why a fire blanket and a couple wall mounted fire extinguishers are not installed in the flat or any /house.

Infact it should be made a compulsary law in all rented property..imo.

The aftermath of this awful tragedy .just shows when people are just in the business to make money never mind safety issues ..to late now for the poor souls who have lost their lives & others injured & lost all their treasured belongings .lets hope & pray lesson are learned .God Bless each & everyone involved <3 (why RR Rollo ) ? Barbra

What on earth did Rollo write that made someone RR him twice on this subject of all things?

Well put Sue.

My heart goes out to all involved.

Double glazing was installed in the refurb - possibly replacing metal 'Crittal' windows.
Plastic double glazing frames would melt if the cladding was on fire.

There's also the possibility that, as it was a hot night - windows would have been open - fire gets into flat through burning cladding..

I just hope we hear the whole truth about how this happened. :-(

As a layperson having no knowledge about construction materials all I can observe is that I have never seen any fire move so quickly on the outside and then move inside with such horrifying speed.

I have seen reports of overseas tower blocks on fire and this reminded me of ones abroad but those fires didn't enter the individual apartments on this scale.

I cannot adequately express my concern for all those affected, I know that goes for other GR friends.

Sue