General Chat

Merlin I can think of something better!

A very large "Zip" comes to mind. :-|

:-S :-S @ Merlin

:-S :-S @ John

You,re right Rose, He,s off with th Fairies again. trying to comandeer the Post.Be interesting to know where the Pits were Coseley,In Gornal there was Baggerage Colliery and Brickworks and another was Featherstone Just outside Wolverhampton. Coal was delivered in 1cwt sacks not 56lb .Lots of Myths surrounding his posts.

And sometimes I helped in pater's shop
Rude customers would have me on the hop
I then studied science and law
And became even more of a bore
Married a rich divorcee
And family and Finchley for me
Forgot all the working classes
Like me, they should get off their butts
They never vote Tory anyway
So none of my friends will rue the day
When the smart suburbs of the south
Worship every word from my sainted mouth

It's true I haven't spent any time down a pit, or in the coal mining area of S Wales...but I spent a long time listening to a man who did, whose father, grandfather etc were miners, and I lived through the same politically charged times, so I think I probably have about as good a grasp as you John, you weren't born there, didn't come from that background apparently, certainly did not go down the pit, haven't lived there all your life and are only basing your observations ON observation not actual experience....just as I am.
.

Your blinkered generalisations are getting on my nerves almost as much as Mrs Thatcher did ( and that is really saying something, as I bow to no one in my dislike of many of her policies nor do I underestimate in ANY way the divisions she caused, nor the strength of feeling of those who still feel she was the worst thing that ever happened to them).

I am not patronising you when I say you do not comprehend what I am suggesting, it is a conclusion I have reached over the course of many threads based solely on your misinterpretation of what I have said ( or in the case of Max Boyce's song ) NOT said!.

Rose, I liked that poem, this poem by Joe Corrie is a favourite of mine, as i have witnessed on several occasions, women in the village where I was brought up, rushing to the pit-head.

I think a few of it's lines have relevance today as to how, politicians of all parties and some business leaders, past and present, have behaved over the years.

Women are waiting tonight on the pit-bank,
Pale at the heart with dread,
Watching the dead-still wheels
That loom in the mirky sky,
The silent wheels of Fate,
Which is the system under which they slave.
They stand together in groups.
As sheep shelter in storm,
Silent, passive, dumb.
For in the caverns under their feet,
The coffin seams of coal
'Twixt the rock and the rock,
The gas has burst into flame,
And has scattered the hail of Death.
Cold the night is, and dark,
And the rain falls in a mist.
Their shawls and their rags are sodden,
And their thin, starved cheeks are blue,
But they will not go home to their fires,
Tho' the news has been broken to them
That a miracle is their only hope.
They will wait and watch till the dawn,
Till the wheels begin to revolve,
And the men whom they loved so well,
The strong, kind, loving men,
Are brought up in canvas sheets,
To be identified by a watch,
Or a button,
Or, perhaps, only a wish.
And three days from now,
They will all be buried together,
In one big hole in the earth.
And the King will send his sympathy,
And the Member of Parliament will be there,,
Who voted that the military be used
When last these miners came on strike
To win a living wage.
His shining black hat will glisten over a sorrowful face,
And his elegantly shod feet will go slowly behind the bier.
And the director of the company will be there,
Who has vowed many a time
That he would make the miner eat grass.
And the parson, who sits on the Parish Council,
Starving the children and saving the rates,
Will pray in a mournful voice,
And tear the very hearts of the bereaved.
He will emphasize in godly phrase,
The danger of the mine,
And the bravery and valour of the miner.
And the Press
That has spilled oceans of ink
Poisoning the public against the 'destroyers of industry',
Will tell the sad tale,
And the public will say,
'How sad.
' But a week today all will be forgotten,
And the Member of Parliament,
The coal owner,
The parson,
The press,
And the public,
Will keep storing up their venom and their hatred,
For the next big miners' strike.
Women are waiting tonight at the pit-bank,
But even God does not see
The hypocrisy and the shame of it all.

Robert,....my thoughts exactly....you put it so well.

They have always left a mess for the next government to clear up,and then the cuts that have to be made make that party unpopular.

Once you give away ,and thats what happens to make the party popular....it is so hard to take away ...

I don't think anyone has suggested that the miners didnt have a hard and dangerous job and we admired them ,but there are also other dangerous jobs .what about firemen,fishermen,scaffolders etc etc.

You cannot compare mental stress with the physical and so many people die young with that if they have a lot of pressure from bosses,and self employed ones have to weather the economic climate to make ends meet.

The car workers in the 60s were so well paid.They used to come bragging into my beach cafe ,showing off their new cars.They had it very good then.

Don't please blame all this on Mrs T.
She may not have been perfect,but she did her best for the country....and you certainly can't blame her for what's happened since 1997..

John, I don't want to be rude but you are SO pompous!! You must be a nightmare to live with! always right, whether it's work, God, or just about everything else. I just can't have a discussion on this thread. You're just so POMPOUS!!!

Slightly unfair, John!

Merlin I have been toying with the idea of a new wardrobe for the spring but the thought of Stalin having me by the Gulags is making my eyes water

Not so bad Errol,However I,m rather disgusted at some of the postings on here.Bye the Bye, I think its time you got yourself another Hat. :-D :-D Wonder What Comrade Stalin would have thought about these remarks if they were made against him? 0ff to the Gulags no doubt.

Merlin. The thread is about what Errol said. "She may have been unpopular but she is a part of history". And Errol has caused a lot of comments, claims and counter-claims. Mrs T would have loved it, according to her biographer and her colleagues.

Thread has been monopolised by people who want to say what a lot she did for them and what a lot she did against them. Fair enough. It is broadly a thread that is positive to her memory. Unlike threads on other social media and a lot of newspapers.

Her place amongst great Prime Ministers is not assured yet - not by a large tranche of the population that she was attempting to unite (words of St Francis when she took office). The jury is still out as to whether she achieved her own objectives in 13 years of premiership.

Merlin I totally agree (how are you doing as well ? )

John please keep it pleasant. Thank you

Whats this site all about?at the moment not what was originally Posted,More like the Vitriolic Ramblings by discontented people against a Woman who has just Died,You should be ashamed of yourselves. it could be The Guardianistas Credo.**M**.

Lindi. You are quite right. This process of closing communities down with little hope for a future for the young people was happening much earlier than Mrs T. She simply ploughed in and wiped out whole industries and communities and they are still really struggling a generation later. Despite a lot of European funding and hard effort.

Max Boyce was lucky. He got out after less than 10 years in the pits. And he communicates what whole villages felt about the men from London and their clipboards.

Not happy with you, Rose :-( :-( And patronising me is well below your usual standard..

John should go an recheck his facts, the decisions to close coal mines, steels works and ship yards were taken by the labour government prior to margret thatcher. I live in Northamptonshire and the decision to close corby steel works was made in 1975 by Harold Wilson. it was labour who throw all these men out of work, when thatcher came into power, it was to late to stop many of these closers...in short it was labour goverments have put more people out of work than any other goverments, it was labour governments that spent more money than the country earn , , and it was labour goverments that has caused the debts our grand children will have to pay off, when tory left office there was a surplus of cash

:-D :-D

John I fear whatever I may be "suggesting" is too far beyond your comprehension for me to be bothered to explain today.

Gets my back up as well Muffy. She made some mistakes but she does not deserve what is happening today.
I saw a photo in a paper earlier taken in North Korea of a child dying at the roadside from starvation. That's poverty!