General Chat

In all wars there are casualties, The trade unions had declared war on the government and Thatcher did what she had to,

For labour supporters of old remember the words of the labour leader Neil Kinnock in 1985 when talking to his own.

I'll tell you what happens with impossible promises. You start with far-fetched resolutions. They are then pickled into a rigid dogma, a code, and you go through the years sticking to that, out-dated, misplaced, irrelevant to the real needs, and you end in the grotesque chaos of a Labour council – a Labour council! – hiring taxis to scuttle round a city handing out redundancy notices to its own workers. I'm telling you , I'm telling you, and you'll listen, .............you can't play politics with people's jobs and people's services.



Roy

Thanks AnnCardiff and AnninGlos,

I do try to keep a balanced perspective on most issues, especially politics, as a youngster Lawrence Daly and Adam Hunter MP were regular visitors to my grandfather's house, as they all had close ties with the coal mines in the area, they regularly debated the political issues of the day.

I grew up with an interest in politics and from my teens into my thirties I counted people like Tom Oswald MP, Robin Cook MP, and Nicholas Fairbairn MP, as acquaintances, all these people along with my mentors when I worked on Iona, they were the Very Reverend George McLeod and the Very Reverend Ralph Morten, I developed a middle of the road view of what I thought politicians should be doing.

What helped me form that view was the fact that all the aforementioned people came from the mold that put country and people before party and self gain, alas that does not appear to be the case in today's world.

I think Baroness Thatcher initially embarked on implementing policies that she truly believed were in the best interests of the country, alas like many who had gone before her, and those who came after her, she strayed from the path she set out to follow, and lost her way.

Looking at both Baroness Thatcher's and Tony Blair's time in office, I am persuaded to support the view that no one should be allowed to serve more than two terms as Prime Minster. It appears that after two terms complacency sets in, and, for a better phrase, makes them think they can get away with murder.

Paula+ thank you, that was a very informative post

We seem to live in a 'blame culture' now Paula, where many people think the world/country/government owe them a living.
Unlike your late husband who picked himself up and took personal responsibilty with you to work at rebuilding your lives, these people then have to look for someone to blame, usually the government.
Unlike you and your late husband, these people lose their dignity and self respect, and then respect nobody else.
It must have been tough but you did it - respect to you both. :-)

What a lovely well balanced post Paula. Good on you and your husband for being the kind of people, with the right attitude toward life, that Britain needs. :-)

lets see what did she achieve
she sold off the council properties millions of people desperate for decent housing
she sold off the utility companies
now foreign owned
record number of people living in fuel poverty or in seriouse dept to them

some legacy

i was a shop steward and deputy concenor through the misery of the thatcher years
she wanted a return to victorion values
by that she meant the working class knowing their place and being gratefull for it
if she had her way we would all be back to tugging our forlocks and the foreman back in a bowler hat

i celebrated when she died will celebrate again on wednesday i have waited long enough

Terryj

Working people bought council houses,

Sold off utility companies because the state could no longer afford to continue to subsidise them although most did return to profit under her leadership (but for how long)?

Fuel poverty happened under labour

You was a shop steward

Enough said

Roy

Terryj
.... You sound just like my late father in law, I thought he was back from the dead. Such a bitter man

Lets just think about this.

Council houses - weren't they bought by the people already living in them. How did that create a shortage of housing? Same Number with houses after as there was before,

Utility companies - more capital investment under privatisation than could ever have been dreamt possible under nationalisation. Just one example example raw sewage is no longer pumped into the seaside, was only a pipedream under nationalisation.

Railways - Train drivers now earning up to double average earnings

Wages - under MT's stewardship they rose 25% more than prices did.

You could go on and on

Unfortunately it is easy to remember what things looked look behind tinted raybans, whatever colour they are tinted. Reality is often a long way removed.

But yet her own party realised she was unelectable, let alone the rest of us.

She started well but finished badly and divided the country - as divided as we are on here.

Terryj

God,with your comments i thought i was listening to "Red Robbo" we know what he did to destroy British Leyland, no wonder their cars were generally rubbish, he was always bringing out the workers on strike after strike, so no continuity on quality of the product.
I do accept that the management shared some of the blame for the demise of Leyland at that time
George

The problem with the right to buy was, councils sold off their social housing and the the proceeds from those sales was resticted by central government, until the council(s) had cleared any debts they had.

This meant that local authorities were unable to build new social housing, as they didnt have the funds. They also lost out on the rents that had previously been paid by the 'now' home owners.

Hence.....we dont have enough social housing in the UK to this day. Private landlords have stepped in, but private rents are very different from local authority rents.

I'm not against the idea of people being able to buy their own home, I am against the freeze (on proceeds) imposed on the council(s)

Gins, I agree, but to blame Margaret Thatcher is wrong,

councils had maxed out on their credit card and the debts had to be paid,

When the sun shines its time to fix the leaking roof

New housing stock should have been built once debts where paid back but councils chose not to,

We as genealogist no that the reason we have a census every 10 years is to assess the future need of the population which should include housing so the question is why when the financial situation improved did the councils/government do nothing?

Roy

Terryj, can I ask you to remove that comment or do I need to report it

A reply to posts in response to your earlier comment would be good but your comment implies you don't have any answers

Roy

Not funny or clever terryj :-| :-

Is it so bad to have Victorian values....at least people mainly respected one another.
Manners were taught.
It wasn't the materialistic society that it is today.
Most of the older generation only buy what they can afford,and get more pleasure out of it having saved their hard earned cash.
Many People do not put aside money for a rainy day.
I was brought up during the war.have worked hard all my life.
I would sweep streets rather than have to rely on benefits.
Don't get me wrong,there are a lot of folk who are genuinely unfit for work,but there are also those who have got into lethargy and won't work because they can get benefits that were never available when we worked

People chosing to buy their long lived in coucil houses did cause a shortage longer term,,,,,as NO council houses were becoming empty to house much needed families ,so did reduce in avaliable numbers......10 houses in a street was 10 houses lost forever =10 families who had been on a waiting list for 5 years were put back another 5,and in that 5 years 30 more council houes were sold under the right to buy,,,,,,,,,then after 3 years a buyer could sell it on privately,,,,,,,,,, so it went on.........frozen money with the departments meant no cash ,no new houses bulit by the council.........plus avaliable land was becoming scarce as firms such as Barretts were putting houses up right left and centre........a vicious circle was cause with right to buy,,,,,,but after all the crashes of lost jobs reposessions were at an all time high,

Terry,
Your comments say more about you than they do about Margaret Thatcher.
Move on man for goodness sake.

robinson was the works convenor at longbridge and as such the spokesman for the shop stewards commite
he would not have the authority call people out on strike that would be done by the commitee at the request of the shop steward for the area concerned
it takes 2 to tango the name of the game is industrial relations in 20 years i only called 1stoppage of work because i had to deal with a management that would sit around a table and negotiate untill will found common ground you usually find that where you have a militant union you also have a militant management

ps i dont recall robinson being involved in the design of any of leylands cars or being involved in not investing in new plant and technology at longbridge

From my simplistic point of view, I often wonder why some people are so 'blinkered' in their outlook and seem to have 'inherited' a particular political stance from birth.


Perhaps they have been 'indoctrinated' from a young age and have never taken a step outside their box to experience life from another viewpoint.


When voting time comes round, I tend to vote for whichever party has a manifesto which I feel could be good for the country.


I don't, automatically, vote for the same party time after time - I'm not an automaton!


Anyway, I will leave you all to your "she said, she did, she didn't" deliberations and think about tea.



;-)

After the Conservatives lost the election of 1997 we had13 yrs of Labour Government....they inherited a thriving economy...does nobody ever wonder why houses weren't built or things weren't done differently by them.?