General Chat

Ann and Berona

Although both words are used interchangeably these days, the actual words, shall and will, which are both auxiliary verbs, do have a slightly different meaning

Shall implies futurity ie some time in the future as in I shall do it tomorrow, or in the negative, I shan't do that tomorrow, but perhaps do it next week.

Whereas will implies definite committment: I will do it or again in the negative, I won't do that.

Will is more forceful than shall

Allan

I remember when I was about ten, our teacher explained that
"You will do as I say" is a statement
"You SHALL do as I say" is a command.

I don't know why she bothered, because I haven't used it and haven't heard anyone else use it from that day to this!

Hmmm!

I would have thought that "You WILL do as I say" is also a command :0))

Allan

OMG - not 'shan't'

I will never live down the day my daughters and I were playing Monopoly - they were cheating - I said 'I shan't play if you carry on'

Since then - Monopoly has been known as 'shan't play'!!!

The word 'Shall' is in decline as well, replaced by 'will'.
Not necessarily a command, surely?
eg:' I shall water the plants.'

Peter Piper picked a peck of.........Aww...who cares....too late at night for me :-))))

Shan't ...

I shall, you will, s/he/it will,
We shall, you will, they will.

Proper people don't say "I will" (or "I won't") -- unless it is indicating wilfulness rather than mere future intent.

They don't teach nothing in schools anymore, I guess!

Don't know what AuntyS was doing here. Me, I've spent much of the day on her &%$# Frederick Hill when I should have been working.


Oh my goodness, I settled on "wilfulness" for what I was trying to say, and look here:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shall_and_will

The most influential proponent of the distinction was John Wallis, whose 1653 Grammatica Linguae Anglicanae stated "The rule is... to express a future event without emotional overtones, one should say I shall, we shall, but you/he/she/they will; conversely, for emphasis, willfulness, or insistence, one should say I/we will, but you/he/she/they shall".


Snicker.

Prefer Mars, thanks Janey! lol

Prefer Mars ...................... bars?

I like my Coffee ...................... crisp!

Janey, we must have had the same teacher!

Even in Primary school I remember that there was a Canadian Lady taking various classes.

I am assuming that the Teacher was an exchange person.

:0))

Allan

Ah, when I was young and footloose ... it was our understanding that we could go to Australia and teach, with only high school graduation under our belts. I think this was actually true in the 60s.

I was going to run off with Kevin ... dang, forget his last name ... his father was a jazz musician ... Colin ... forget his last name too. ;) Anyhow, we were going to run off to Australia and be teachers. Kind of a geek version of running off and joining the circus. ;)

(No, wait ... geeks are *in* the circus ...)

But I ran off to university instead, before finishing high school. Geekier version even. Some day, I shall make it to Australia. I *will* make it to Australia!

Janey, I hope that you do!

There will be a place for you to stay in Australind, and if that doesn't appeal, Perth is close enough for us to go for a few days.

If you do make it to west Oz, Fremantle is a fantastic place to stay.

Allan

Budgie,

If you are accompanied by a seabird you are taking a tern around the deck

Allan

I've been in a canoe once. Paddled around an island in a lake in eastern Ontario while at a lodge for some political get-together or other. I sat in the front; I think the back is supposed to steer and stuff (the opposite of a tandem bicycle). Apparently I was about the equivalent of ballast.


Anybody here know and love egg corns?

They get their name from the recipe for "egg corn soup", made from "egg corn squash". People hear things ... wrong ... and make up backstories to make them make sense.

For instance, people write "tow the line" and then insist that the expression has to do with pulling barges down a canal - when of course it's "toe the line" and has to do with military lining up.

Okay. This is pointless, because the egg corn I'm thinking of is something said by somebody at this site today, and of course I can't quote it here! That would be rooooode!!

I'm done now.

Janey,

Toffee Crisp!!!!!

Or Double Deckers, lived on those when I was pregnant, along with Mars bars, oh and I did eat proper food too lol

Have fun, I will paddle my own canoe......

Lizx

Could some of you expert grammarians please tell me the correct grammatical wording for the following sentence?:
"What did you choose that book to be read to from for?"

Huia.

JC, referring to your last comment - people getting things wrong, as in tow the line v toe the line, I just had to add one. A friend of mine uses the term 'power for the cause', whereas, isn't it 'par for the course'.
And I have actually seen this written.... 'on route' whereas it actually comes from the French 'en route'.
Brings me back to thinking about those fruit & veg shop signs I love so very much - Apple's, Banana's, Pear's etc.

I digress, and cannot resist adding my two penn'orth ref: your original thread which was on the use of to and fro, or was it back and forth? So many pages ago now I've forgotten!
Either way, I use both.
I'm not a northern gal or a southern gal, having moved around all my life from north to south and east to west (would that be to'ing and fro'ing or coming and going I wonder), whatever, we moved a lot when I was a kid, and I've continued moving around, into adulthood, and probably won't stop til I'm in my box. I shall continue using back and forth and to and fro!

K

Huia..now THERE'S a sentence to play with!.

I wonder if we are to stick to those specific words....if so I find it difficult.
To be read to, what did you choose that book for? Doesn't sound right to me.
I suppose I could rush off to some of those on-line grammar checker wotsits.


If we don't have to stick to those words, then here's my contribution.

Wishing to be read to, why did you choose that book?
Did you choose that book from which to be read to?

K

I think 'Why did you choose that book, from which to be read?' is grammatically correct.


I've also seen 'tow the line' and ON route on here lots of times. My biggest one is those who don't know the difference between There, their and they're, usually using there all the time.

There = a place, ie, it's over there.
Their = possessive, ie, belongs to them, it's their problem.
They're = They are.

TeresaW,
Yours sounds better than mine, not so clumsy!
K

EDIT:
Correction....not AS clumsy. My old English teacher would have slapped my hand for that one!

Karen, it's a difficult sentence to put together, and probably not the way we would say it out loud, depending on habit and accent. LOL