General Chat

Sylvia will you stop accusing me of something I am not doing. I Did not want to see Janey deleted and I didn't say I did.

I and my husband caught the ten oclock bus into Gloucester and got home again at 1pm I am not a liar. Anything that went on the thread in that time I did not see I was not here. and that is just what I mean by stirring. you are very good at it.

Quote “Oh thats good now you can all tell Janey what you think now shes here ... lol especially seeing as it was hoped she was deleted ...”

SRS: "Being so close to Remembrance Day and with so many soldiers away who are related to members on here, your post was bound to stir emotions on the board."


And the offensive, fascistic, militaristic tripe to which I responded STIRRED EMOTIONS too. Mine (and I have had a thoughtful PM from someone not comfortable expressing them in this place).

What makes someone else's more important, more deserving of consideration, and my expression of mine deserving of SUPPRESSION?

WHAT?

Not freedom of speech, that's what not.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/11/11/remembrance-ceremonies.html


Following the wreath-laying ceremony, Rabbi Reuven Bulka, the honorary chaplain of the Canadian Legion, delivered the benediction.

"We who ride on the coattails of our heroes can best show our gratitude by standing up for the values they continue to defend by nurturing in Canada an enveloping culture of respect, of harmony, of inclusion, a great country worthy of their great sacrifice," Bulka said.

"This is our sacred trust, our unshakable perpetual obligation, our way to actively remember."


None of this obnoxious freeedumbbb noise. None of this empty thanking.

Bulka is not one of my favourite people, but even he got this right.

Show gratitude by DOING. By respecting. By including. Because what MY society is about is respect and inclusion.

Unfortunately it came across as very bitter and very dogmatic with nothing to temper the accusations against military personnel. Perhaps it is a bit of a sickly poem, most of these e mail poems are over the top but the fact remains that somebody had used it to express their feelings about remembrance day and to attack that was felt to be offensive.

Janey, part of one of my responses was roughly this,

that all our ancestors played a part in giving us the freedoms that we hold dear, mostly by small actions : a random thought by an individual translated into positive action, or a decision made by those with political 'clout' to improve society. ( I said it better the 1st time round)


Of course there are bad apples in every walk of society and proffession, soldiers are no exception, nor are doctors, Politicians , lawyers et al. But 'most' soldiers do their job with honour and make sacrifices for friends, comrades and strangers alike.

Janey I did think at the time that the quote was making generalisations, however, your response was not clear (to me that is) in that it seemed to generalise about soldiers too.

Being so close to Remembrance Day and with so many soldiers away who are related to members on here, your post was bound to stir emotions on the board.

And I'll repeat, Rose -- what a glowing example of the love of FREE SPEECH professed by the author of the tripe in question. (It's amurikkan, btw. Don't you love it when the Brits adopt right-wing Yankee garbage as their own?)

I'll bet all those soldiers fighting for freedom of speech are very proud.


Oh, here go, too.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/nov/14/iraq-abuse-claims-british-troops

Ok Ann..so therefore then my post wasn't aimed at you

i will be totally honest with you as my post was aimed a Nicholas & Pauline as they were the ones that said the word Insult..

Sorry Sylvia, I had not seen that. Well I can't be held responsible for other people's feelings. Julie Ann's OH was in the army so she feels strongly about it, however I don't wish Janey had been deleted she adds a lot of interest to the boards.

I repeat, the thread was reported because what you said WAS offensive to many Janey, no two ways about that... the reporter of the thread said that was their intent.
I wouldn't say you were 'personally ' attacked ( and I read all of it I believe , ) the replies were unusually well reasoned for such an emotive subject IMO

I have a volume of court martial decisions in trials of Canadian soldiers in the occupying forces in Germany post-WWII.

It is replete with cases of rape and other criminal offences by Canadian soldiers against the civilian population.

Any other questions?

I would like to see the comments re rape though, and your replies to those who responded, without that part of the argument the thread is incomplete.

That is a part of what people found so offensive Janey,

I don't remember who it was that actually said they had reported the thread Janey but I don't think it was in your defence.

Sylvia I don't think anyone has suggested that Janey was banned or anything.

I agree with Rose in that I did think you were making a generalisation about soldiers when I read through your posts janey

Meanwhile, maybe someone can tell me.

What is being fought for in Iraq?

Simple question.

Actually Janey you did say that you held US and UK soldiers in contempt. And I think somebody agreed with you about the Campus quote.

Sylvia, will you be getting many wooden spoons in your Christmas stocking or do you have sufficient?

Hmm, I wonder whether the thread was deleted because of the personal attacks and insults aimed at me???

Thank you Janey.

To continue re what Rose suggested, I also said this.



I have sympathy for some people fighting today's wars, oddly enough, especially in the US. Some people in the US live in such enforced ignorance and are so desperate for an income and any kind of opportunity that they take what the military serves up.

I pretty much have contempt for most in the US and virtually all in the UK who are "serving" in Iraq, however. Pure contempt, with a dollop of hatred thrown in.

Surely you weren't suggesting that *that* vile little venture has anything to do with "freedom". Yeesh.

Freeeedumb. Man, how that makes my ears hurt.

Afghanistan, slightly difficult one. There was and may still be some threat to international security. There arguably was and is a basis for humanitarian intervention - but the world hasn't got its act together on that one yet, and if Afghanistan, why not Sudan? Whatever might have been accomplished in Afghanistan wasn't and isn't going to be. All possible good intentions aside.



Yes, I'm so looking forward to hearing opinions about moi. Where are they now??

Sylvia, I was going to delete it but it would be churlish to do so now and not give Janey a chance to respond wouldn't it? I didn't delete it before because I was having a 'conversation' with you and didn't want to be accused of ducking out of it.

Julie, you will see that I only read it as far as 10am, well just before, I was on the bus at 10. and when i returned it had gone. I think people saw the insults as insinuated as against the troops. People are very sensitive about our and all troops at this time of year, particularly with so many deaths in Afghanistan. I did not see Janey insult anyone personally no, and, yes I did see at least one remark against Janey but I honestly can't remember what it was. Like I said people got very hot under the collar, it is a sensitive subject.