General Chat

Lol Sally F... that is what I was trying to say in a nutshell!!

Here here Susan!

It was all going along so nicely and with no personal attacks until then... definitely going to play somewhere else, lol!!

lol .... I am definitely NOT a bleeding heart nor pc brigade (hands up to a Health and Safety level 3 certificate though, for my sins, lol)

There are some things where I agree, you have a point... but not, for me, for a general NS call-up.

Yobs..detox, then retrain, bootcamp style, NOT within the military structure, BUT within the penal system... that is certainly not a pc stance, wmsl!!

Those youngsters who are not wanting to be in the military, but quietly going about their daily lives and putting something back into the system via their hard earned taxes, their work in our institutional infrastructure... that is JUST as vital to the economy... we NEED the youngsters who are working... like it or lump it, they are paying taxes, their university education is no longer free.... so many of them spend many years paying that back... to put them into NS would take away their income for a couple of years, and deprive the community of their skills and their taxes... puts back when they have cleared those debts... and then voila!! They then have their own kids to put through uni... their parents to pay for in the nursing homes etc!!

Why spend more money via NS re-training those youngsters who have already spent, or are prepared to spend, years of their precious time and money learning and training in a huge variety of skills, anyway??

Love

Daff (whose brain is hurting with all this serious stuff... so is going to love you all and leave you, MWAH!!)

xxxx

I don'y see how National Service would work now really. If a young person finished their education and gets a stable job is it really the right thing to do by taking them away from the stable job, where they are paying taxes and contributing to society?
And why should the services be expected to take the yobbish element, which is what most people talk about National Service as being needed for, to spend time and money on people who have no intention of doing the job properly.
The Armed Forces are a professional outfit these days and needs to be staffed by people who want to be there, not by people who are forced to be there.

well said susan
lol John all I can say is enjoy :-)))))))))

JUST received a telegram - being called up for my National Service - they asked what service of the armed forces do i want to join - I said WRNS !!!!
"Happy Days Are Here Again", la, la, la, la la, la,,
Lol John

I hope you are not refering to me pablo1513

am not a bleedy heart or PC brigade.....I think I may have pointed out some reasons it may or/would not work but am certainly not from those two brigades you mention.....sorry I haven't agreed with you totally.....I thought it was a debate where one threw in ideas or different points of view.....who knows what the answer is.....but you did ask a question and I take offence at being called names just because my views were not exactly to your liking.

Susan
:-)

update

I don't usually join debates, but this seemed such a civilised one I couldn't help but join in......such a shame you decided to spoil a good thread, and your own at that...... with uncalled for remarks when others disagree.

John I think all other things aside you hit the nail on the head with joe public we have spent to long not suporting or armed services for the job they do .I am from the portsmouth area originally and have had to watch the army go then the marines and the navy is just about holding on they are under paid under staffed and don't get the recognition they deserve .I remember the faulklands well and the local schools were given the day off to see them out and also when they came back that would not happen today

Not ALL youngsters have an easy time I have a 19 year old nephew who drives an ambulance and is training to be a paramedic.
Two of my cousins boys did there stint in Iraq in the Army and every generation of my family have been in the military including my nan in WW1.
If the chips were down we would all still defend our country and as Daff says we are still having an inland war and I lived and worked in central London during the 70's when the IRA were terrorising us........but I still dont believe bringing back the NS would solve our modern day problems.

AND Im neither pc nor bleeding hearts!

On the plus side if we were ever invaded by aliens theres a whole generation who have been training on playstations ready to fight back lol

George you are right it doesnt work but who says so It has not been tried.
and it wont get done because of the PC birgade and the bleeding hearts club that seem to have appeared on this thread

Well i did 2 years National service and it was the best time i ever had, well apart from some occasions. Todays military is a far cry from my days and i am sure they do not want the YOBS that plague our society. These people need to be sorted out with strong discipline and punishment, but I'm afraid in our pussy foot legal system does not allow for this, you immediately get the old cry of "deprived Childhood" and all that rubbish.

Yes i am one of the old brigade and believe in an "eye for an eye " method lets inflict the same pain on them as they dish out.No doubt someone will tell me that doesnt work, but neither does the daft measures that exist today IE Asbo's What crackpot dreamed that one up.

Rant over

George

I think tory, the main reason for members of the armed forces wanting to be out, is that there are so few.
The reason why there are so few, is that the 'youngsters' have such an easy life, doing something or nothing, so why should they put themselves out - money coming in for strolling around the clubs/pubs/streets/ and in return - sweet naff all !!!!!..
Those men in the forces have had enough
of 'looking' after the afore mentioned, and with very little thanks from Joe public.. No wonder they are leaving - streched to the limits in every country on this earth - not just Iraq and Afhgan... but anywhere this mindless government has a mind to send them.
And when they are all gone ??? I dread to think.. John..

I Am an Army brat, Son Navy other members Army and Navy.

Not that I am saying this gives me any more knowledge or rights......just saying hello to other military inclined peeps :-)))

Susan
x

i have spent many years around all the serives except the raf although not as long as you or daff and have always found them to be no different to any other person

lol MGH... I have been married to one for 36 years, lol!!

Yes, he would kill if he had to... but his role is to protect as he sees it... he is not naturally aggressive.... controlled or otherwise!!

Or at least... no more so than is intrinsic in any other *normal* human being, such as you or me.

Love

Daff xxx

John, lol.... if anyone wanted to attack my country.... I would take up arms myself... and before you say anything.... I am rated Markswoman!! Almost got to Bisley, but there was a war somewhere that hubby had to go and play with and no-one to mind the children!!

Oh... and we ARE at war... people have been bombing us on these shores for the last 40 years, nearly... people we have educated, housed, fed, nurtured and lived alongside!!

~~~~~waves to Susan.... it was your post that reminded me, actually, thank you!!

Love

Daff xxx

I think I know what you are saying now John. A good Idea if put into place as an option earlier in their lives.....

something to aspire to for those who couldn't make it normally maybe?.

There may be many youngsters out there who would give their eye teeth for such training and opportunities.....Not sure it would work with hardened Yobs though.

What of those on drugs.....rehab first...which would take an awful long time.

Then there are those who are mentally screwed up for any number of reasons....lots of psychiatric help needed there.

And so on

As I said before....there would be a lot more to it than just the suggestion, which in itself sounds like a good idea.

Susan
x

Eldrick - of course I would... And as I have said - these people would be given a trade - something which they are NOT being given in civvy street.. I do not see any problem...
Thanks Old Geezer we seem to have a bit more in common that just being in the RN....

sorry Kate... didn't see you there... and you are spot on... we each of us have a natural talent and aptitude... we are all needed, required, vital in our society... we all have a contribution to make... and those who CHOOSE to soldier, or paint or preach or teach, beautify us, nurse and care for us... we are all vital elements of society.

John... I still don't feel that ALL our young should be forced into NS.

I DO however, agree that a change in the penal system which would incorporate a Bootcamp-type training would be an area that could work, and could turn some young lives right around! But not in the *real* military environment... for me, that must be kept totally separate...

lol John... my husband trade trained too..... once out of basic training, the nervous Newbies, and then they had to pass various courses to reach each rank up to Staff/Sgt.

Me? I worked with youngsters some adults had already described as *uneducable* at the tender age of 5 to 11!!

So I can see this from different angles, I hope!

Love

Daff xxx

so then look into why so many are leaveing the services and why there not joining in the first place and address that John

Dont worry John we can always send in the football yobs ; )