Genealogy Chat

Hi all, Can someone out there help my confused brain! I have all seven birth certs for the children of Thomas and Alice Proctor between 1885 and 1900. He was actually in 21st Hussars for all that time and I have some muster rolls (all I could get out of Kew) of 1887/8 showing him as such with the corrct birth dates for the children up to then. His regimental no. is given as 1923. On all but one of the birth certs it is shown as 4202!(one shows 1923) It's definately the same man - only his no. is different. He has always been in same regiment so can't understand it. an explanation might help me get some info from Kew at last as it's about all I know of him so far. Hopefully yours, Stella

I would say the misstake is by the recorder some how he has put in the wrong number. A mans army number stays the same even if he reinlists. the only way it would change is if he reenlists under another name, unlikely in this case.

Thanks Peter, Strange that the first birth in 1885 shows 4202 as the regimental no and a birth in 1894 shows what I believe to be correct - 1923. have been able to get no info from kew apart from the muster rolls for two years - they keep saying can't find him! Perhaps I'll try with the other number but it's expensive for them to look and tell me sorry!. Coincidently I'm a Walker too by birth. Also at a brick wall with them! Sigh. Stella

Hi Stella,sorry I can't offer anything constructive re your problem, having a few myself, however have you tried british-genealogy(.)com/forums ? They can give good advice on most problems. Goodluck,JudyNZ

I received my father-in-law's army records recently and he had three different army numbers. He was in two different regiments and also the pioneers (I think this was like our junior army) with different numbers for all of them. Kath. x

Hi I have my Grand fathers medal card which has 2 regiments and 2 numbers on it. I was told it was because during WW1 so many men were lost that they merged differents regiments together and re-numbered. hope this helps, Sylvia

It was not until about 1920 that a uniform (no pun intended!) system of numbering was introduced. Up until then, a transfer between regiments, and even battalions could result in a serviceman' number being changed. This is one of the reasons why medal cards can include more then one number, and even medals from before that date, issued to the same person, can show different numbers. Paul

Hi. I had a great uncle who was a regular in the 14th Hussars before and during WW1, I was told that his number was a regimental number and would have changed had he been transferred to a different Regiment. Records show he died in Mesopotamia (Iraq) in 1916 at a time the 14th was enroute from India? His brother was killed serving with the 2nd/2nd London Regiment in 1918 and according to the war graves commission his army number differs from that on his other records including his medals. It can be confusing and very frustrating, but understandable all things considered.

Stella have you tried getting in touch with the regimentalassociation of the 21st Hussars. Almost all regiments have such an association and before you spend any further money it would be well worth your while. Regards Rupert Bear

Thankyou all for your suggestions. I know the 21st Hussars became the 21st Lancers during the time that Thomas was serving - which was before ww1. I wonder whether he was given a new number when the regiment changed name. The only other possibility that I can think of is that he trf to 20th Hussars for some reason, got a new number and it is this info which has been used on the army returns for births/certificates even though some of the events took place before he changed regiments! Suppose the only way to find out is to try Kew with the new number. Thanks again all. Stella

Kathleen,The Pioneer Corps was originally formed in the 1st great war , and was made up of men who had been returned home in ill health etc . There was no disgrace in this . In world war 2 the Pioneer Corps were engaged in support works to the fighting troops and again there were no disgrace in being seconded to them . Rupert Bear.

Sylvia Your relative in the first great war Would have undoudtedly been an experienced soldier and could well have been transferred to a differnt regiment where his experiencewould have been invaluable particularly if the battalions of his new regiment were made up of recruits of what was termed the new army. Rupert Bear

Micheal, The fact that your relative was in Mesopotamia now Iraq while his regiment was on its way to India waS not uncommon in world war 1 (even in world war2). I would imagine that he was either transferred to a battalion of his regiment alreadyin Mesopotamia or transferred for special reasons ie. to reinforce a regiment in difficuties with troop strenght. My own father( aproffesional soldier )was in the 1st and 2nd battalions of theWorcestershire regiment , was wounded in France in '14 ,trained soldiers o f the "new army"they became 10th batt.went back toFrance Dad was sent to Gallipoli to the 4th batt, and finished up with the 10 th batt in Salonika. You can see how in wartime asoldier could go any where at a moments notice. With regard to your other relative I imagine a mix up occured when the details were given by the War Office to the Graves Commission. Hope that it gives you some idea of the complexity of researching military matters. Rupert Bear.

Hi Stella, In my own research I've come across someone who was in the same regiment in the army for 7 years in the 1850s, but was court-martialled and reduced in rank from Sergeant to Private and given another number which prevously belonged to a soldier who had deserted. Regards. Peter.

Thanks for your further info. I am going to try Kew again for his army records but using the other regimental number, what's another £10! Fingers crossed. Stella

Rupert, We have my father-in-law's army records and there is nothing in them, and nothing that we know of to suggest he was in ill health at any time. He was in the first and second world wars, and was discharged in 1945 as an R.S.M. Kath. x

I have a soldier with the same regimental number, but two different names.............he is listed on the medal rolls......with BOTH names peculiar? or what........