Genealogy Chat

And we all know the reputation doctors have for handwriting... Heck of a lot easier in countries where you have identity numbers - then it just can't be wrong - you put in the number and up comes the official name of the person. I live in Sweden where death certificates apart from the obvious stuff like cause and date of death, address, date of birth also have the name and address of spouse and all previous spouses and all children and their dates of birth.

I have no knowledge of alterations to birth or death certs but I certainly know that a margin note alteration was made to my grandparents marriage cert - and not for some months after the marriage. Possibly they couldn't read very well back in the 1890s or just didn't notice at the time. My grandmother was recorded as Emma Adelaide instead of Adelaide Emma. A margin note has been recorded by the registrar recording the mistake. Having said that, I think I would be horrified if a Doctor couldn't even be bothered to correctly record the name of one of my parents especially at such an important time; and that there was no censure for that Doctor if he/she did make such a mistake. There's something wrong with our system that needs sorting out. It isn't satisfactory to say in Law it can't be altered, what sort of Law is it that is quite happy to accept recording the wrong information. How far do we go with that - does that also include Law Enforcement. It's ludicrous, a mistake has been made and it should be rectified - or at least rectifiable. Sorry, I'm on my soapbox again. My sympathies to your friend. Jan

Just reading what Brian said. My Grandfather was called Indolph and on the census it says Randolph even my dad says its Indolph, and on the gravestone its Indolph and death certificate. Now my dad is thinking that his father might have had another son but the dates are wrong. Regards Yvonne

The Doctor didnt register the death! He filled in the Death Certificate (that is the certificate to say the person has died and what they died of). My friend arrived at the Care Home the day after her father died, collected the Death Certificate and went to the Registrars to register the death. In the rush she had not looked at the death certificate issued by the Doctor until then. (I mean the piece of paper the Doctor signs to say that a person is dead. You need this before you can register a death, the Registrar then issues you with a Death Registration Certificate which corresponds with his entry in the Register). Hope this clarifies things.(Huh! More than that entry in the Register will anyway!) Marjorie

My wife's ggrandfather was registered Thomas William Dennis, but so far as we can see he NEVER used the Thomas and appears on censuses, marriage and death as William Dennis.

Why did the doctor register the death? The doctor issues the certificate to say that the person is dead. That is all they do. When my mother [also Alzheimers] died in 2003 the doctor attended her late at night to declare her dead. Next day I went to the care home, and found out who had attended her. It was a Bank Holiday! so I was told to go to the doctor's surgery on Tuesday to get the certificate of death. When I went, they had no record!!!! To cut a long story short. they eventually found the record and the doctor had [thankfully] recorded that she died of dementia. I I had to take that certificate from the doctor to the registrar to register mother's death!! I had to register the death, not the doctor, and I had to give details of name, birth etc, So how did a doctor do this? A member of the family surely has to, if at all possible, or at least a friend or neighbour, someone who knew the deceased? PS Remember this when you trust age on a death cert---how did they know?

An 'orrible warning to all of us looking for ancestors who don't have a fund of 'oral history' to draw on. My birth grandmother seems to have changed her first name between getting married and having a baby ( a period of all of 4 months!) so her death a tragic 2 weeks later is also under the wrong name. She also seems to have lied about her age to get married (she wasn't 21). I cannot find her birth certificate on the indexes and have been working on the assumption that her FIRST name may have changed - now I am wondering if it is the SURNAME which is wrongly recorded???? I get my name spelt wrong all the time by people, and I have just had a reply back from an archive in which they get the name wrong (have they been looking for the right woman?) - I did at least used to trust the registrar but now I shall go back and look for the right first names under possible mispellings of the surname . . . ho hum.

My friend has today taken advice from her Solicitor, who let off a few rockets, but told her that it is in fact THE LAW that a Registrars Certificate of Death, the entry in the Register and the Doctors Certificate of death must all agree, even if they are wrong! Even the Solicitor did not think thee was much to worry about because it is only the given name which is wrong and not the surname. The upshot is, as several of you have said, that she has to produce his Birth Cert, his National Insurance number and a declaration given to her Solicitor,that the man who died was the same man on the birth cert! The Solicitor will now approach the Registrar General on her behalf (she will be returning to her home abroad soon). The Registrar General will then rule as to whether a "note in the margin" can be added to the Death Entry in the register (erm, can anyone see why not?)But neither the certificate nor the Entry in the Register can be altered. Yes, I too remember registering the death of my Father and the Registrar asking me to carefully read the Cert before I signed it, but I think any mistakes on that would only have been corrected as far as they didnt agree with the Doctor's certificate of death. Fortunately, in this case, her father had long since handed over his financial affairs to her so there are no bank accounts to close etc, but can you imagine some sniffy little bank clerk faced with Bert Smith's relatives trying to get money out of Fred Smith's account? This has been an eye-opener, I can tell you! Marjorie

Thats probably why I cant find any dates of some of my relatives. Oh well back to the church yards. Yvonne

Hi Marjorie I think this person should be named and shamed so we are all aware if we have to visit that office even a location might make us all aware. Death is a very difficult thing to deal with and the beareved need all the help and understanding possible. Margaret

Marjorie OMG is right what is going on? when my Dad passed away I had to take the receipt for his funeral to the bank in Australia before they would close his bank a/c's and put them into my Mothers name, well when I went back to the bank to do what the manager had told me to do, the young bloke who served me said we can't do that because you do not have the death certificate with you ,I lost it and said" Well do you think we cremated him alive" as I had the receipt for his funeral, me screaming and crying did get results I think that they thought I was nuts. But surely the wrong name on the death certificate would cause all sorts of Legal complications that your friend could well do without at this sad time the GP who did the certificate wrong should have to do or be able to do a statuary declaration or whatever it would take to enable him to do new certicate Laraine

When I recently registered the death of an acquaintance (surrogate next of kin) the pains the Registrar went to - to ensure everything was correct. Checking the details very carefully - even to the extent of what his occupation was. All I knew was that he'd been a labourer but the Registrar was adamant that I put in more details than general labourer (as stated in the Registrar's bible). As I couldn't he had to speak to the Senior Registrar who allowed it. So if they went to such pains just for previous occupation then I would have thought it doubly or triplerly more important to get the name right.

My grandmother's death 20 years ago required an inquest which we, the family, were unable to attend because of distance. The resulting death certificate got her name wrong. My mother complained to the Coroner's Office and got a corrected certificate. My Nan is now listed twice in the deaths index! In this particular case, I am at a loss to understand why the doctor and registrar are taking such a laidback attitude. I just hope that the wrong name on the certificate doesn't cause any problems for the deceased's executors when they sort out his estate. (e.g. when trying to get Probate) Dave

Marjorie, Sounds like the medical board needs to review its practices and make sure doctors consult the next of kin where possible before issuing deaths certs. Crista

Well, the poor old chap had nothing to leave, but anyone want to bet there WON'T be a problem with cancelling his pension! The Registrar would only enter the details exactly as they were shown on the death certificate, despite my friend desperately begging her to alter the given name - the Registrar said she was not allowed, by Law, to enter anything other than the information on the Doctor's Death Certificate, even if it was wrong! It makes me wonder how many times this has happened, particularly if someone dies without any close relatives to oversee things - what a nightmare, for instance, a hundred years ago, someone dying in the Workhouse, suffering from Alzheimers. Or even today, someone dying in a Home and a Care Assistant giving the details, as she knows them, to the attending Doctor. Marjorie.

I've no idea but there must be issues with wills, claiming pensions and other financial stuff if the name is wrong on the death cert. Crista

Maybe this is why I can't find any trace of my grandfather's death, even though I've been through 30 years of the St. Catherine's Index about 6 times. MAYBE IT WAS THE DOCTOR'S FAULT. :-) Kath. x

I have a death cert which has a correction written in the margin and a note by the registrar saying he made the amendment in the presence of the original informant. The death cert is for my great-grandmother Emma and the amendment is the addition of her second husband's (who died before her) occupation. Don't know why their son felt the need to have this added, but there you go. It gave his former address so I have yet another ancestral home to track down and see if its been demolished! nell

My great-grandfather's birth certificate was corrected after his death! The place of birth had been recorded as Elmore End but should have been Elmer's End. I would love to know who got it corrected and why! This was in 1918.

I believe the form the doctor fills out is separate from the death cert issued by the registrar which would hopefully be correct. My grandfather died in 1972 and was registered by my uncle, who is also now dead. When my mum gave me the cert I noticed that my grandfather's year of birth was out by a year and that his place of birth had been misspelt. I contacted the register office and they told me that it can be altered like this: I have to send copies of the birth and death certs to the register office. They then send them to the GRO requesting permission to alter the death registration. GRO then hopefully say yes, and then I have to go to the register office in person and re-register it. Makes me wonder just how accurate the certs I have are! nell