Genealogy Chat

I'm so confused...

....received a birth cert for 1902 which confirms parents details as expected. BUT - according to the 1901 census, mum was widowed, yet birth cert has her husbands name as the childs father??? As I only have census record showing that mum was a widow, I've tried to find details of the death for the father to check dates, but can't find it. I came up with two possibilities: 1. as there were 6 years between this child and the previous one, the husband was indeed dead, but mum used his name anyway as wasn't married to father of this child 2. husband had done a runner or was in prison or some such thing during 1901 census, and wife said she was widowed 'cos it sounded better Please - does anyone have any suggestions where to go from here?

I've definitely had a man describing himself as a widower on one census while his wife was in prison. There are also plenty of instances in parish registers of women who have been deserted by their husbands, yet continue to have babies. If the child reached adulthood and married, there might be a different story on the marriage certificate, or you might find directories or electoral rolls which list the husband at the address at a later date. Sexist question: if there's no man on the scene, how is the woman supporting herself and her family? Might she be getting some support which requires record keeping somewhere? It sounds as if you may never get to the bottom of this little quandary. Good luck Brenda

Thanks Brenda - from family gossip I believe the child in question was raised by another family member, which would make sense if there was no father around. I'm just not sure where to look for more information - free BMD only goes up to around 1911 for the most part, and the next census of course isn't due till 2011! Does Ancestry.com have later BMDs listed? I'm wondering if its worth going for the quarterly subscription...? And where would I find old electoral lists?

Ancestry BMD is based on Rootsweb FreeBMD so you wont find any different there. For electoral registers you should go to the archive nearest to where the person was living. As you havent given any names or locations impossible to give further help.

Sarah, Picking up on your Electoral Registers bit ... if you phone the local studies dept at the relevant library they can tell you which years they hold registers for - and where others might be. If you know the street address and name, sometimes a kind archivist will do the look-up for you - and they often enjoy a bit of historical gossip! Regs Jane

Hi, There are pay to view sites which will have the reference for the birth. 1837online or familyrelatives.org. Gwynne

You can search the GRO index at Record Offices or even some libraries if they have it - it's kept on fiche and can take an age but often it's worth it. Best of all - usually no charge! Some local family history societies also have one. Jan

Thanks to everyone for the help. Georgina - the person I am looking for is James Finch, listed on 1891 census in Sedgley, Staffs with his family. He doesn't appear with his family on the 1901 census, and I can't find any trace of him anywhere on his own either. His birth was registered Dec quarter 1865 in Upton, but the family were at various times in Staffs, Worcs and Wales. Thanks again Sarah

LOL - a friend of mine was born in 1961, 18 years after her sister. Her sister's father died when her sister was a toddler, yet my friend has his surname. She didn't work out until she was grown up that she had the surname of someone who had been dead for 15 odd years.

Thanks for all the help - the James Finch on the 1901 census in Worcester isn't the same one but I'll keep looking.

when was the baby born? it could be possible she got pregnant before he died?

My GGrandmother had 9 children (I've managed to find so far!) the 1st 4 are definitely with her husband, he then died in WW1 and the 5th child is 'iffy' as to whether she was concieved beofre his death. A further 2 out of the 9 have his surname. I think it was anything to save face when registering the births. Regards Sam

Hi Sarah My gggrandfather was born March Qtr 1859. Father had died Sept Qtr 1858! Have yet to get the certs to establish WHEN in those quarters each event happened to see whether it is possible/iffy/downright impossible for George Snr to be George Jnr's biological father! Lou

Lou Don't be too hard on them. Even if the father had died at the beginning of the Sept. Q. ie c. 1st July 1858, it would be perfectly possible for his son to be born 31st March the following year.

According to the birth certificate in front of me, the baby was born 6th Dec 1902, so the father had to have still been alive around March 1902 - not possible if he had died by the time of the 1901 census....but I can't find a death for him either. The only other thing I can think of is that he has been wildly mistranscribed on either the death register or the census...and suggestions what I could look for? Oh, and just to complicate the issue further, this child was born in Wales rather than sedgley, staffs where all her siblings were born, so it look slike the family moved shortly after the 1901 census :o)

Can you find a baptism for the Dec. 1902 baby? The vicar may have recorded something about the father.

Gwynneth - I just took your advice and had a look to see what churches were in the area when lottie was born...looked at kelly's directory and got slightly sidetracked (as you do) but excellent - if totally unconnected - news: I found the details of the school my GG Grandparents taught at, with their names listed!!

Hi Sarah, Any child born to a married woman is deemed to be the child of her husband so she was entitled to put her husband down as the father. I suspect he was dead and not the father but by giving birth outside her home area she could maintain the fiction that he was alive for the purpose of registration. Does that make sense? Gwynne

Perfect sense Gwynne - of course it doesn't help that on a marriage cert for 1910 James is listed as the father, with his profession as collier, and nothing to indicate he was deceased. I have found a James Finch on the 1901 of the correct age, married to a Sarah Ellen, and the child living with them is listed as stepson - the dates seem to agree, and I'm wondering if its him. I haven't found record of a marriage yet between James and Sarah Ellen, but if it IS the one Im looking for, chances are they wouldn't have actually married 'cos he still had a living wife. It all seems a bit far-fetched so I think I need to carry on digging to get to the bottom of this one lol