Genealogy Chat

Hi Mike, I need a look-up doing for a post-1837 birth in Rothley, which would have been registered in Barrow. Do you have access to those records at Wigston, or are they kept somewhere else?

Anyone looking for Antliff or all the variations ? I recently had a message via another site from a person in Australia researching Antliff's (and variations) in Leicester as I am shown looking for this name but with one exception mine were all Nottingham. If any one has any Leicestershire names/details I would be happy to pass them on.

Greeting's & Welcome Mary...... If you post the names you are looking for on here Then I'll see what I can come up with using the resources I have to hand. If unsuccesful..... Then I'll have a look at Parish Registers at Wigston Records Office..... MIKE.

Hi Mike, Thanks for offering to help. I haven't bothered you a lot lately because I eventually took your advice and got a subscription to Ancestry, which has kept me busy! I shall have to give you a bit of background information for this look-up - bear with me. My great-grandfather was William North. According to his marriage certificate his father was William Wood North. The censuses give his place of birth as Rothley and his dob as 1855-6. His age is given on his marriage certificate as 23 (he was married in 1879). However, the family bible says he was born in 1854, and it's always proved accurate so far. The problem is that there were at least 3 William Norths born in the Rothley/Syston area at about the same time, and that period isn't very well covered by FreeBMD. I found a marriage for his father William Wood North to Mary Screaton (née Parkinson) at St. Margaret's, Leicester in 1858, but William would have been born at least 2 years earlier. Mary's first husband died in 1852, so she and William Wood would have been free to marry earlier. It seemed unlikely to me that they'd live in sin for years in a small place like Rothley, especially as they were Baptists (I found both their names on the online list of Rothley Baptist births).

Next instalment (I've split the messages to make it a bit more readable): I decided to look for a marriage before the marriage to Mary, and a wife who died, and sure enough I found one that possibly fits the bill - a William North (but no middle name Wood) married Jane Pym in Melton Mowbray in q1 1854, and she died in q1 1855 in Melton (whereas I would have expected the death to be registered at Barrow). William lived in Rothley up to the 1871 census; by 1881 he was living in Leicester. I then trawled Ancestry for possible births, and I found the following: William North born Barrow on Soar q1 1854 William North died Barrow on Soar q1 1854 William North born Barrow on Soar q4 1854 William North died Leicester q4 1854 No William Norths born in 1855 William North died Melton Mowbray q1 1855 William Benjamin North born Leicester q2 1856 William Benjamin North died Leicester q2 1856 William North born Barrow on Soar q4 1856 William North died Barrow on Soar q4 1856 I applied to the GRO for the birth certificate of the William North born q4 1854, with a proviso that the father must be William Wood North, and I've just had a message back from them that they haven't issued the certificate because the father's forenames aren't William Wood. Could you have a look at those births and see if any of the names fit? Sorry to be a bit verbose, but I think you'll need the information to do the search.

Here's the list of pre-1837 Rothley & Sileby General Baptist Births if anyone's interested: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb(.)com/~blanchec/rothleybirth.htm http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb(.)com/~blanchec/rothleybirth2.htm (remove brackets)

Greeting’s Again Mary……… Here is the transcript for that Marriage of William Wood North to Mary St. Margaret’s Cathedral / Parish Church. Entry No.429, FEB 21, 1858, on Superintendent Registrar's Certificate WILLIAM WOOD NORTH, 27, Bach. BUTCHER, of BRUNSWICK St, Son. of WILLIAM NORTH, CARRIER MARY SCREATON, 35, Wid. of BRUNSWICK St, Dau. of WILLIAM PARKINSON, FARMER Wits: GREGORY NORTH, ANN NORTH. You’ll see that it was conducted under Superintendent Registrar’s Certificate. So…. There will be an Index card in the Records Office at Wigston. Giving extra details which might just help. Using the resources to hand. & Trying to match up to details from the transcript of that marriage at St. Margaret’s Church. North,/ Wood,/ Carrier / & Rothley I have come up with the following :- I think the below Baptist Christening In Rothley matches the above William Wood North ? WILLIAM WOOD NORTH Male Event(s): Birth: 22 JUN 1830 General Baptist, Rothley And Sileby, Leicester, England Christening: Death: Burial: Parents: Father: WILLIAM NORTH Family Mother: ELIZABETH And this could well be the Marriage to match the above Parents ? William North.~ Elizabeth WOOD. Loughborough. 1812. BY LICENCE. If you look at the 1841. Census returns for Rothley HO 107 / 595. / Book 17. / Folder. 7. / Page. 6. Keyword = North Rothley. Church-gate. William North 61. Carrier. Elizabeth Wife. 45. WILLIAM Son. 10. Gregory. Son. 7. ( same one as witness ? ) Also within the same Household William North 20. Male Servant. All Born within the County. The above are still there in 1851. I think this is that William North aged 20 from that 1841.Census But in 1851. 1851.census HO 107 / 2088 / 458./ 25./ Leicester. 100 Humberstone Road. TIMOTHY ORAM HEAD M 46 M CURRIER LEI LUBBESTHORPE MARY A ORAM WIFE M 47 F LEI ALST JOSEPH JOHN ORAM SON U 21 M LEI SMRT HENRY A ORAM SON U 16 M LEI EAST NORTON CHARLES S ORAM SON 8 M SCHOLAR NTH ST GILES NORTHAMPTON WILLIAM H ORAM SON 5 M SCHOLAR LEI SMGT JOHN BURDETT HEAD M 70 M CORDWAINER DBY CAULDWELL MARY BURDETT WIFE M 63 F LEI SUTTON CHENEY WILLIAM NORTH LODG U 32 M PORTER LEI ROTHLEY I did look up those Christening’s you found on Free BMD William North Christened 28th. Jan 1854. Died 1st. Feb. 1854. Syston. Father :- David North......a Gardener. Mother Alice. William North. Christened 15th. Oct. 1854. Syston. Father :- Joseph North.....a Bricklayer. Mother :- Eliza. Syston came under Barrow – Upon – Soar District. Search continues latter today. Time to blow out the candle me thinks… Chow…….. MIKE.

Thank you, Mike - my goodness, you are thorough! So William Wood North was a bachelor when he married Mary. What a shame - I liked the sound of Jane better than Mary as a great-grandma :-) I see Mary took 10 years off her age when she got married (according to the censuses, she would have been 45, not 35). The marriage of William Wood's father to Elizabeth Wood is very interesting - I'd missed that. I had expected a Wood surname to account for William Wood's middle name, but I obviously didn't look far enough back. I had his mother down as Elizabeth Biddle, because her mother's maiden name was Gregory, which would account for William Wood's brother's name. I'm still a bit doubtful about Elizabeth Wood - she and William were married in 1812, and William Wood wasn't born till 1830, which seems like an awfully long gap. I wonder if there's a missing generation? A child of William North and Elizabeth Wood born c 1812 could be the parent of William Wood North born 1830. I'll have another look at the IGI. Don't know who the witness Ann North was - Gregory's wife was called Milley. The only sibling I've found for William Wood is Gregory (a Rachel and Benjamin born 1825 and 1829 have the same IGI batch number, but they're living with a different Wood family on the censuses, so I don't think they were siblings of William and Gregory).

OK, I've had a look on the IGI, and there's a William North christened on 10/4/1814 in Loughborough. The entry says that his parents were William North and Elizabeth Wood, but it's an entry submitted by a member of the LDS church, not extracted from Parish Registers. There are 9 more christenings with the same batch number, presumably siblings. If the date of birth was 1814, this William would be just about old enough (16) to have fathered William Wood North in 1830.

And the only possible marriage on IGI is William North to Elizabeth Biddle, Rothley, 1829. However, the William North christened in 1814 would only have been 15 then (if he was born in the year he was christened), whereas Elizabeth would have been about 34 (born c1795). Seems a bit unlikely. Anyway, I was forgetting that according to the censuses, William Wood's father and mother were born in 1780 and 1795 respectively. The 1851 census shows his mother Elizabeth as born in Mountsorrel South, which fits with Elizabeth Biddle, christened in Mountsorrel 1796, daughter of William Biddle and Alice Gregory.

Greeting's Again Mary.... There were two other Marriages from my Marriage index disk. William North. ~ Elizabeth SHARP. Rothley. 1829. By Banns. and the one you already have.... William North . ~ Elizabeth BIDDLE. Rothley. 1824. By Banns. MIKE.

Yes, I saw the Elizabeth Sharpe marriage on the IGI. I thought Elizabeth Biddle was more likely, because she came from Mountsorrel, which fits with the 1851 census information. I didn't find an Elizabeth Sharp(e) of about the right age from Mountsorrel.

Greeting's again Mary..... Getting back to your original question re :- birth for a William ( Wood ) North 1854 + - ( Gr Gr Grandfather ) Using the 1837 site have you explored these ? Jan.~ Feb.~ Mar. Qrt. 1858. William North. Barrow - Upon - Soar. Cert No. 7 a. 147. (So the above only puts his age out by 2 for his marriage 1879 ) Also might answer why his parents married in Leicester Feb. 58. by Licence ? Rothley Baptist Minister not wanting to marry her ' with child ' ? Apr.~ May. ~ Jun 1858. William North. Melton Mowbray. Cert. No. 7 a. 211 or 24 ( not too clear ) I see that the FREE BMD is not complete for this year. MIKE. Re Elizabeth Sharp I read it that she came from SOUTH Mountsorrel.. which puts it close to wards Rothley .....

Hi Mike, The William North born c1854 doesn't have the middle name Wood as far as I know - only his father, born 1830, was William Wood North. I hadn't looked at births as late as 1858 because William's shown as being 6 years old on the 1861 census, and I thought it was unlikely that a 3-year-old child could be mistaken for a 6-year-old. I did wonder why William Wood North and Mary Screaton got married in Leicester instead of Rothley, and a pregnancy might be one answer. I assume the 1837 site contains the same BMR details as Ancestry? I got the birth entries I listed in my earlier message from the Ancestry beta index, because none of the Barrow births for that period seem to be on FreeBMD, although the deaths are. By the way, it's interesting that William Wood gave his address as Brunswick Street, Leicester when he got married - I think that must be where he had his butcher's shop. There's a William North, butcher listed at 55 Brunswick Street in the 1887-8 trade directory, and William junior was living there with his family by the time of the 1891 census.

OK, I've now looked at the Ancestry complete index for 1858. I think we can discount the birth in Melton, because a William North died in Melton in the second quarter. That leaves the birth registered in Barrow in the first quarter as a possibility. Can you check out that birth and the one registered in Barrow in the last quarter of 1856 to see who the parents were? Thanks for all your help!

Mary Just wondered if this site was any good to you http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb(.)com/~blanchec/EMidBaps.htm If you scroll down the homepage you will find the Leicester references Elaine

Thanks Elaine, I already had that page - in fact I posted the address of the Rothley births further upthread. Unfortunately they're all pre-1837, whereas my current problem is post.

Whoops Mary, Found the site from a mailing list the other day and popped on here, have you by any chance come across the surname PAUL whilst looking into Rothley? Elaine

No, never heard that surname, although I grew up in Birstall and went to school in Quorn, so a lot of the surnames on the Rothley births site are familiar to me. Have you tried this Rothley site? http://www.leicestershirevillages(.)com/rothley/17920.html (remove brackets)

Hi Mary Got the Leicester Villages site, have not looked into the Pauls really but my aunty said she was at their farm in Rothley and it is where she ended up with TB because she had drank the fresh milk produced on the farm. My great aunt did retire there in a house just down from the crossroads as you came into Rothley off the A46, her name was Doris Lyner and her sister Nora, who married a Paul lived with her along with Doris's husband. I used to visit every week, wonderful memories Elaine