Genealogy Chat

Hello
I'm looking for information regarding Robert Batty Threlfall (20 May 1898 to 14 Feb 1983), son of Mary Agnes Threlfall (1869 - 1898) and father unknown, but grandparents on fathers side James Batty (1846 - 1912) and Isabella Bowker (1849 - 1920), any information regarding his father would be appreciated. James and Isabella had ten sons between them, and four daughters, but as to which son his father is eludes me.

Hope someone can help.
Steve

Just for ref

THRELFALL, ROBERT BATTY -
GRO Reference: 1898 J Quarter in LANCASTER Volume 08E Page 783


1911 Census For England & Wales
20 Spring Garden St Lancaster, Lancaster, Lancashire, England

James Batty Head Married Male 64 1847 General Labourer Lancs Lancaster
Isabella Batty Wife Married Female 62 1849 - Lancs Lancaster
Robert Batty Threlfall Grandson - Male 12 1899 School Lancs Lancaster

it would be an assumption only that the son Robert was the father? but he would be perhaps a bit young. Can you see if any of the other sons may be likely, eg were any of them married at the time, or might have died before Robert Threlfall was born ?

from 1891 census
Robert Batty Son - Male 7 1884 Scholar Lancaster, Lancashire, England

edit

England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007
Possible
First name(s) ROBERT
Last name BATTY
Gender Male
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1884
Age 13
Death quarter 2
Death year 1897
District Lancaster
County Lancashire
Volume 8E
Page 527
Country England
Record set England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Civil Deaths & Burials
Collections from Great Britain, England

1939 registers

) Threlfall's life in 1939
26 West Road, Lancaster M.B., Lancashire, England

s) DOB Sex Occupation Marital status Schedule Schedule Sub Number
Robert Batty Threlfall 20 May 1898 Male Store Labourer Married 100 1
Nellie Threlfall 30 Nov 1892 Female Seaming Gas Proof Garments Married 100 2
Elizabeth Jeziorkowski (Bradley,Courtney) 12 Sep 1918 Female Domestic Servant Single 100 3
Joseph Threlfall 09 May 1924 Male Bank Tenter Graining Single 100 4
Robert Threlfall 12 Feb 1929 Male At School Single 100 5
View 1 more occupants
Ref: RG101/4802H/014/27 Letter Code: NVMZ
© Findmypast Ltd



ROBERT B
Last name THRELFALL
Marriage quarter 1
Marriage year 1920
Registration month -

MarriageFinder ™
ROBERT B THRELFALL married one of these people
Nellie Smith
Spouse's last name Smith
District Lancaster
District number -
County Lancashire
Country England
Volume 8E
Volume as transcribed 8E
Page number 1722
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Civil Marriage & Divorce
Collections from Great Britain, England
© brightsolid online publishing ltd

Robert Batty
Last name Threlfall
Birth year 1898
Birth date 20 May 1898
Event year 1904
School name St Thomas's Church of England School
Town Lancaster
County Lancashire
Country England
Parent name(s) James
Book type Admissions
Archive reference SMLR/5/3/2
Folio / page no. -
Archive
Lancashire Archives
Record set National School Admission Registers & Log-Books 1870-1914
Category Education & work
Subcategory Schools & Education
Collections from Great Britain, England
DC Thomson Family History

First name(s) Robert Batty
Last name Threlfall
Age 18
Birth year 1899
Birth town Lancaster
Birth county Lancashire
Birth country England
Service number 33118
Regiment King's Own (Royal Lancaster) Regiment
Unit / Battalion 1/5th Battalion
Year 1917
Series WO 363
Series description Wo 363 - First World War Service Records 'Burnt Documents'
Archive
The National Archives
Record set British Army Service Records
Category Military, armed forces & conflict
Subcategory First World War
Collections from Great Britain, UK None
brightsolid online publishing ltd.

Ancestry transcription

1920
View British Army WWI Service Records, 1914-1920

View Packet Cover
Add Alternative Information
Report issue
Name: Robert Batty Threlfall
Gender: Male
Birth Date: abt 1898
Enlistment Age: 18
Document Year: 1916
Residence Place: 20 Spring Garden Street, Lancaster
Regimental Number: 33118
Regiment Name: King's Own Royal Lancaster Regiment
Number of Images: 26
Form Title: Record of Service
Other Records: Search for 'Robert Batty Threlfall' in other WWI collections
Family Members:
Name Relation to Soldier
Robert Batty Threlfall Self (Head)
William Batty Father

Hi Shirley

Thanks for the digging, I think the James from the school admissions is actually his grandfather, rather than father, though it looks like James did have a son called James born in 1870, who was a soldier in 1901 and an oil cloth manufacturer in 1891. As to when he became a soldier is not known and who he served with I haven't been able to find out.

It is possible that if he was away on active duty then Robert would have possibility been looked after by his grandparents. But without James' military record I can't find if he was abroad at the time of Robert's birth.

I'm a wee bit stuck as to Robert's father.

Baptism entry While we have made all efforts to correctly record the information in the original document there may be different interpretations of the written words. If you have access to the original document and believe we have made a mistake you are encouraged to report this to us. Report an Error in this Data Field
(only fields with a value are shown) Value
County Lancashire
Place Lancaster
Church name Lancaster Methodist Circuit
Register type Parish Register
Register entry number 191
Birth date 20 May 1898
Baptism date 05 Jun 1898
Person forename Robert Batty Threlfall
Mother forename Mary Agnes
Mother surname THRELFALL
Person abode George street
Notes Child's third forename is the same as his surname and may be an error in the register / This record from the United (Free) Methodist (Brock St) chapel register / Lancaster Methodist circuit also includes the Wesleyan Methodist circuit and the Primitive Methodist circuit
Transcribed by Keith Hayton
File line number 163

Could his mum have died soon after his birth

Mary Agnes Threlfall
Estimated birth year: abt 1869
Registration Year: 1898
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at Death: 29
Registration district: Lancaster
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8e
Page: 525

As Mary did not name her child's father on either the birth registration or baptism, you don't have any way of finding out which Batty it was.

Seemingly, different forenames were given for the father at various times, which isn't helpful

Just adding the 1901 to the mix.

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census

9, George Street, Lancaster, Lancashire, England

James Beatty Head Married Male 54 1847 General Labourer Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Isabella Beatty Wife Married Female 52 1849 - Lancaster, Lancashire, England
James Beatty Son Single Male 31 1870 Soldier Lancaster, Lancashire, England
George Beatty Son Single Male 20 1881 Labourer Oil Cloth Works Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Elizabeth Beatty Daughter Single Female 19 1882 Cotton Weaver Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Henry Beatty Son Single Male 14 1887 Break Minder Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Sarah Beatty Daughter Single Female 11 1890 - Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Robert Beatty Son Single Male 2 1899 - Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Stephen Anderson Boarder Single Male 21 1880 Labourer Oil Cloth Works Preston, Lancashire, England

James.

British Army Service Records

First name(s) James
Last name Batty
Birth year 1870
Birth parish Lancaster
Birth town Lancaster
Birth county Lancashire
Birth country England
Service number 2040
Regiment Loyal North Lancashire Regiment
Year 1891
Attestation date 09 Jun 1891
Attestation age years 21
Attestation age months 5
Attestation service number 2040
Attestation corps 3rd Battalion North Lancs Regiment
Document type Attestation
Series Wo 96 - Militia Service Records 1806-1915
Archive
The National Archives
Archive reference WO 96
Box 819
Box record number 155

Tree on Ancestry has this.
Robert Batty Threlfall born 20th May 1898
Father - William Batty
Mother- Mary Agnes Threlfall ( not married )
Mary Agnes - Death 25th Sept 1898
Death Cert- Acute Phthisis, Cardiac Debility Syndrome.
seems to be a type of TB or Bronchitis leading to Heart failure

swo isabella batty was the sister of mary agnes threlfall


Mary A Threlfall
England and Wales Census, 1871
Name:
Mary A Threlfall
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1871
Event Place:
Lancaster, Lancashire, England, United Kingdom
Sub-District:
Lancaster
Enumeration District:
13
Gender:
Female
Age:
1
Relationship to Head of Household:
Daughter
Birth Year (Estimated):
1870
Birthplace:
Lancaster, Lancashire
Affiliate Image Identifier:
GBC/1871/4231/0320
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Thomas Threlfall Head Male 44 Thurnham, Lancashire
Mary Threlfall Wife Female 41 Ulverston, Lancashire
Isabella Threlfall Daughter Female 9 Thurnham, Lancashire
Mary A Threlfall Daughter Female 1 Lancaster, Lancashire

Mary A Threlfall
England and Wales Census, 1881
Name:
Mary A Threlfall
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1881
Event Place:
Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England
Registration District:
Barrow In Furness
Residence Note:
Sutherland St
Gender:
Female
Age:
11
Marital Status (Original):
Single
Occupation:
Scholar
Relationship to Head of Household:
Daughter
Birth Year (Estimated):
1870
Birthplace:
Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Page Number:
44
Registration Number:
RG11
Piece/Folio:
4291/71
Affiliate Record Type:
Household
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Thomas Threlfall Head Male 54 Thurham, Lancashire, England
Isabella Threlfall Daughter Female 19 Thurham, Lancashire, England
Mary A Threlfall Daughter Female 11 Lancaster, Lancashire, England
Joseph Threlfall Son Male 9 Lancaster, Lancashire, England

No James Batty married Isabella Bowker - they are the parents of William Batty who was, the father of Robert Batty Threlfall