Genealogy Chat

Just realised the badges etc. could have belonged to my dad who served in Egypt during WW2 and was shot through the knee by an enemy sniper. As it was passed on to me by my Grandmother via my Aunt (dad's sister) I did not connect it to my dad as i assumed he would have kept it.

I don't understand your sentence:
"The correspondence is all addressed to my GGF as both the correspondent and addressee and in different hand writing. "

Both the correspondent and the addressee?


Letters written in old German seem to indicate either a need for secrecy, as old German wasn't in normal use at that time (so Googling tells me), or else that they were written by an elderly, or high-ranking, or academic person. And someone who knew that your GGF would be able to understand them.

You are asking why your GF changed his name.
Perhaps it was your GGF who changed the family name. Both father and son are called de Ros/Ross on GF's army records.

EDIT:
No, I see GGF died as Treble.

That is true. I have got a portrait photograph of him but it does not indicate his height.

I have postcards from Egypt, Australia and various other countries. Some of the correspondence within the UK is written in two languages on the same postcard which i assume means they did not want to chance someone else reading it. it also means i cannot read it either :)

I have tried to copy and paste one to this message but do not seem to have had any luck.

One of the more cryptic messages in English just says " With all haste. It is so. Sincere wishes. then there is the initials "JB" and signed N Treble Esq but is also addressed to N Treble Esq.. Very mysterious

Sorry did not explain the correspondence ( mainly postcards) if signed from N Treble and it is addressed to N Treble. They are mostly in different hand writing.

When are the letters/postcards dated, please?

Could they be from your GF to his father ?
Perhaps during his war service, to tell him things he wasn't supposed to, such as where he was?

Hmm! But he was using the name De Ros during WW1, not Treble.
Maybe he got other people to write on his behalf ?? People in France ?? He did serve in France.

Where were the letters/postcards postmarked?

If you care to send me one or two of the French ones as attachments to a PM, I'd be happy to have a look. Can't help with the German ones!

Hi

The correspondence is all pre WW1 between 1910 and 1912 but mostly 1911. Everything is post marked London. How do I private message you?

I do not know when my Grandfather changed his name as it only became apparent from the war documents.

I have dabbled with this mystery over several years and it would be lovely to solve it. i had thought of putting a request our for a historian on the general chat forum who might know more about "specials" etc.

I will get one of my sons to scan the postcards written in French over the weekend.

Thank you for your help

kind Regards

Christine

To send a private message, just click on my username at the top of one of my posts, and use the form which appears.

"Specials" could apply to many areas of interest - a historian might not be an appropriate person to ask. Hopefully the correspondence will shine some light.

posted on general
https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/general_chat/thread/1378298

Special might refer to Special constable, but in this context it might be a family code for something, really need to see the correspondence in its entirety and get the German translated I think.

Looking at Newspapers, there are references in 1911 " .....that the enrolling of a permanent volunteer reserve of special constables is proceeding in accordance with Churchill's circular...."

"It was devised by Mr Churchill under the stress of the railway strike...."

?

I mentioned Special Constables earlier on the other thread ..... but how about Special Services?

Edit: Special Services would connect him to the armed forces, by the way.

Christine has attached some of the cards to a PM. I will reply to her but the word on one is not "Specials" it's specialists.

So could it mean language specialist (useful in wartime), Rose?

Alternatively, if he was a teacher it could indicate that he was a specialist teacher - more usually found in senior schools, eg specialising and teaching one subject, eg mathematics, science, language etc.

I think that the cards might be back and forth between father and son and so the sense of one depends on what was sent to the other, if you see what I mean.

I've made a stab at the 2 mainly English ones, and will try and look at the German, but the writing is like my old tutors, hard to make out until you have seen a lot of it lol.

If it helps I can add what I think they say on here to compare, if someone else is looking at them ?

I am thinking that the use of German, is a family thing between them ( schoolmaster of languages?) I 'think' it's possible the other card with small amount of foreign language above the English is not German but might be Spanish , (one word translates on google as Basque? ) as it appears to have a 'Tilde' over at least one letter.

Yes, I'm having a go at them too, Rambling.

A couple of them have bits in Latin.

The one where the English part starts "It is as usual" has this Latin above it -

Hora novissima, tempora pessima sunt, vigilemu.

[That's the title of a poem by Bernard of Cluny, and means "These are the last days, the worst of times: let us keep watch."

I think they're cards from Nicholas junior to his father, but for some reason they have been written by (dictated to ?) someone else.

I think the couple of references to police action being needed in Lower Regent Street is in connection with prostitutes soliciting, which (from a thing I found on Google) was apparently rife in lower Regent Street and surrounding area 1903-16.

There's no mention of "Specials", or specialists, in the cards Christine has PM'd to me.

Perhaps it's on one of the German ones, which I said I couldn't help with, and which she therefore hasn't sent.

Ah right Argyll Gran we're looking at different cards. This is what I made of the Regent St one.

"" I think Joan of Arc is delightful. Regent St is rough lately and more like slum people some. The master named is going on and I am wishing that you were here as i wish to see you re the other matter. Please receive my warmest thanks and my heartiest respects, You are worth (the lot of them?) "

Not 100% on the Joan of Arc, but might be in reference to another card or similar?

From the German card I could make this out but the writing is very difficult to read on it,

""Immer forderung entsprechen mit umfasbender" which I believe translates as

"Always demand to speak with comprehension"

That might relate to the other card It reads: "yes of course you did right. These people not being specialists do not understand, of course I am aware of the fact. He is good in his line but leaves all difficult cases to me. My opinion is the one that they go by. So pleased that you liked ? B. It seems they are delighted. Do call and see me soon."

I agree with everything on the Regent Street one, except I think it says, "The matter named . . . . ".

The way the word is written looks the same as the later instance of "matter".

It's definitely Joan of Arc.
There's another card, which maybe you don't have, from someone else, which says, "[Somebody - can't make out the name ] saw Joan of Arc and enjoyed it."

Could well be ArgyllGran, I did wonder. Figured it was either master or matter, and if master might tie in with the school master occupation, depending on who was writing.

That explains the Joan of Arc reference :-)

The two Nicholases mus have had a mutual interest in religious (or maybe just Latin) poetry and/or music, as well as languages.

As well as the poem title I mentioned above, another card includes some Latin, part of which is "Pange lingua gloriosa" which is the title of a Gregorian chant.

Before that it says "O salutaris hostia", which is the title of a hymn written by St Thomas Aquinas.

So far, I haven't deciphered the rest of the Latin on that card - just the odd word here and there.
"(Something) beata Hyarulam (something) expundens vexillo." Which doesn't seem to mean anything so far!