Genealogy Chat

Bit odd also!, when Charles Married Lottie 1908, his Father, John Cooper occ. Gardener...


But when Charlotte Eliza Cooper Marries William Godfrey 1904 Lambeth, and Susannah Julia Cooper Marries Charles Grimwood 1891 Lambeth, both say Father, John Cooper occ. Painter (Deceased)...

There is a John Cooper Death 1887 (37) if him...

Chris :)

(something just not adding up, methinks, lol)


Edits (and below was Mother!)

Marriages Mar 1905 (>99%)
---------------------------------------------------------
Cooper Charlotte Eliza Lambeth 1d 342a
LLOYD Henry Lambeth 1d 342a


(1911, 21 Malmsey Place Kennington S E, Lambeth, London & Surrey, near Daughter Charlotte Godfrey)

RE
"John Cooper=Elizabeth Wilson (1875 Kingston).
Obviously the year has to match but should the Vol and the Page also match plea"

Basically everything has to match - e.g.,

Marriages Mar 1875 (>99%)
COOPER John Kingston 2a 404

says John's m.cert can be found on p404 in vol 2a of the 1875q1 set.

If he wed Elizabeth Wilson, then she must appear on the same entry as John, and we know his cert is on p404 in vol 2a of the 1875q1 set.
.
However, this is not necessarily sufficient to say they wed, since there are two entries on that page (4 entries pre-1852), and we actually need them on the same entry, not merely the same page,

On the FreeBMD hit I posted above, I can click on the page number to see all the names on a page (this works for Bs and Ds too), so here I get:

Marriages Mar 1875 (>99%)
COOPER John Kingston 2a 404
Foquett Emily Owen Kingston 2a 404
SUTTON Martin John Kingston 2a 404
White Kate Kingston 2a 404

and there's nothing here to say who wed whom.

(well for info. above Marriage, John Cooper (Surrey Marriages, Ancestry) was Kate White, 1881 Census Croydon.

Chris :)

(below was a Daughter)

Births Mar 1879 (>99%)
------------------------------------------------------------
Cooper Louisa Elizabeth Croydon 2a 221

Hello Chris Ho and mgnv thank you for your contributions.

Think this is tiying me up in knots a bit I will take a bit longer look later on.

In the mean time thank you again Will.

Yes Chris that is correct: (Will)

1939 Register (Find My Past)

4 Vicarage Road , Twickenham M.B., Middlesex,
Charles H Cooper 25 May 1879 Male Public Work Contractor Labourer (Heavy Worker) Married
Lottie H Cooper 14 Sep 1878 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married
Lillian L Dudman (Cooper) 22 Sep 1911 Female Daily Housemaid Single



1911 (Find My Past)
Charles Henry Cooper Head Married Male 32 1879 Surbiton Surrey Odd Man Domestic
Lottie Harriet Cooper Wife Married Female 33 1878 Teddington Middlesex
Stables Oakfield Somerset Road, Wimbledon, Surrey

Chris: Its a different Cooper has to be!

Will.

(it's a case of seeing below I think...(as said earlier, you can view Show images, but in order to see it properly, costs £3.50 to download)

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7768366

(his Marriage states R.M.L.I)

Chris :)

(been screwing eyeballs up trying to decipher, lol)

MGNV yes this is exactly where I am getting tied up in knots Im just muddled now???

Will

Whose marriage are you actually trying to prove?

Keep it simple

4 Vicarage Road , Twickenham M.B., Middlesex,
Charles H Cooper 25 May 1879 Male Public Work Contractor Labourer (Heavy Worker) Married
Lottie H Cooper 14 Sep 1878 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married
Lillian L Dudman (Cooper) 22 Sep 1911 Female Daily Housemaid Single

Does the birth cert you have for Charles H match the date of birth above?

If Yes, given that it states Charlotte Eliza and John as parents then

the marriage for John and Charlotte is the right one.


Births Dec 1911 (>99%)
Cooper Lillian L Greenfield Kingston 2a 746

Marriages Dec 1908 (>99%)
COOPER Charles Henry Kingston 2a 798
GREENFIELD Lottie Harriet Kingston 2a 798

COOPER, CHARLES HENRY WILSON Order
GRO Reference: 1878 M Quarter in LAMBETH Volume 01D Page 394

That birth does not tally with the 1939 census

Are you 100% certain that you have the correct birth cert?

This birth is a better match for the 1939

COOPER, CHARLES HENRY DARLING Order
GRO Reference: 1879 J Quarter in POPLAR Volume 01C Page 662

According to 1911 census he was born in Surbiton, for which the registration district is Kingston, which is where he married

(saw below earlier for Poplar one, if him)

Chris :)

Deaths Jun 1882 (>99%)
----------------------------------------------------------
COOPER Charles Henry 3 Poplar 1c 387

Thanks, Chris

There isn't a birth to match other records for Charles Henry- assuming any of them are accurate, which I rather doubt.

He said when he married on Christms Day 1908 that his age was 30 - which it couldn't have been if the birth date given in 1939 is correct.

I wonder if in fact he wasn't a Cooper at birth.........

I think we need specific info from the poster about what he's looking for - and what he actually knows to be 100% factual.

First name(s) Charles Henry
Last name Cooper
Birth year 1878
Birth parish Lambeth
Birth town London
Birth county Surrey
Birth country England
Service number 6585
Regiment -
Year 1896
Attestation date 20 Nov 1896
Attestation age years 18
Attestation age months 4
Attestation service number 6585
Attestation corps 4th Bn East Surrey Regt
Document type Attestation
Series Wo 96 - Militia Service Records 1806-1915
Archive The National Archives
Archive reference WO 96
Box 577
Box record number 139
Record set British Army Service Records
Category Military, armed forces & conflict
Subcategory Regimental & service records
Collections from Great Britain, England

Gives age as 18 and 4 months
adrees Dolland street

Possible for father H Cooper 82 new Cut lambeth

So the matching address from the military record is 82 Cut St in 1901 is for a Henry (j?) Cooper and wife Lillian.

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
82, New Cut, Lambeth, London & Surrey, England

Henry J Cooper Head Married Male 41 1860 Lambeth, Surrey, England Dining Room Keeper
Lillian Cooper Wife Married Female 31 1870 - -
Bessie Moore Servant Single Female 34 1867 Brighton, Sussex, England Waitress
Edward Stevens Servant Single Male 29 1872 Lambeth, Surrey, England Porter Dining Room
John Aygolhem Servant Single Male 29 1872 Lambeth, Surrey, England Porter Dining Room

So unless I've lost the plot that Henry can't be the father , it just is in the category of 'previous master' on military record with the soldier number WilD has given.

So ?? maybe related? :-S OR is the military record not the same Charles

Charles was in the Royal Marine Light Infantry when he married


Name: Charles Henry Cooper
Birth Date: 24 Mar 1879
Enlistment Date: 8 Apr 1896
Division: Royal Marine Light Infantry: Chatham Division
Register Number: 8939

(yes Erika, as I keep saying!, lol, could be names and addresses, but it needs downloading!)

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7768366

Chris :)

Rose, I found the same, with New Cut!...(didn't posted, but saw this morning)

Will - if a groom's m.cert is on one page and a bride's m.cert is on another page, I'm very puzzled as to how you imagine they could be the bride and groom on the same m.cert.