Genealogy Chat

Hello,

I searched all death records from 1913-1929 on the scotlandspeople.gov.au website as the relative lived in Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark but found nothing in her maiden name Margaret Mary Rogerson (born 1870) or married name Margaret Mary Lockhart.

What can I search next? Contact police for archived drowning reports? I don't know if they offer such a service? Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated!

If she was assumed drowned but there was no body found then don't think a cert can be issued

After 7 years she would be presumed dead

Did her husband remarry

Hi Anita,
Just had a quick look on Scotlandspeople,

There is a death for Margaret Mary Rogerson age 44 died 1914 in Govanhill,
if your Margaret was born 1870 there is a good chance this is her.
Sorry don't have any credits to look at the certificate.

regards
jean

Here are the ref numbers for that record, in case it helps:

ROGERSON

MARGARET MARY

44

1914

644/16 11

Govanhill

I think that Margaret had a different surname:

FAIRGRAY

MARGARET MARY

44

1914

644/16 11

Govanhill

Anita, why do you think she drowned?

Do you have her husband's death certificate and/ or Will?

Thanks everyone,

Unfortunately I saw death certificate no. 644/16 11 and that is not her.

Good idea about seeing the details on her husband's will dated 1932. As the wills on Scotlandspeople.gov.uk are only available up to 1925, I just emailed the National Records of Scotland about how to get a copy of it.

My other relatives say she apparently drowned but that her father walked the streets looking for her for a long time after she disappeared, so it's a bit of a mystery and I think some relatives do not want to talk about it so I am trying to find out myself.

I have her husband's death certificate which is signed by one of the sons who was also named the executor of his will.

I don't see her on the Glasgow electoral register with Andrew.

Do you have them together in 1911?

Is Andrew listed as widowed on his death certificate?

All Scotland, National Probate Index (Calendar of Confirmations and Inventories) 1876-1936 (Ancestry)

(is he on above?)

Chris :)

(intestate. 940 Sauchiehall Street, Glasgow, to James Rogerson Lockhart, 193, Morningside Street, Carntyne, Glasgow)

AustinQ - I can't see her on any Glasgow electoral register so she may not have been registered/eligible to vote then. Andrew's death certificate states he was widowed and her first child to marry in 1929 lists their mother as deceased.

All of her children were born at the same address (the youngest was born in 1906) and the last photo I have of her was taken with 3 of the children around 1904. My grandmother told me her mother (Margaret) died when she was 10 years old which means 1913-1914 but that was the official story. I checked Andrew's electoral details again and noticed he had a new address from 1909.

Chris Ho: Yes you found her husband's details above and his tombstone photo shows he was buried alone even though he bought a family plot.

Just to confirm- Margaret was still living in 1911 - she's on census at Berkeley Street with Andrew and children.

Not sure if it would help but there is also the will of her father- I notice he remarried in 1920:

ROGERSON JAMES

Age: 86

Year: 1926

644/11 298 Anderston
-------------------------------------------------------

Scotland, National Probate Index (Calendar of Confirmations and Inventories)

ROGERSON, James, Joiner, 133 Berkeley Street, Glasgow died 3 April 1926 at Glasgow testate. Confirmation Glasgow 24 May, to John Rogersonm cashier 56 West End Park Street, Glasgow his son and Isabella Brown or Rogerson 1221 Argyle Street there, his widow Executors. Will dated 9 February 1921 recorded Glasgow 7 May 1926

Just a thought...

Have you looked for any newspaper reports about her drowning/disappearance or presumption of death?

My research hasn't taken me into Scotland so I don't know what newspaper records would be available.

Good luck
Chris

The "Glasgow Herald" archive is online:

http://tinyurl.com/zwuw4wj

But you'd maybe have to trawl through each copy for the years which seem likely - unless you can understand the instructions at "Archive Search Help" near the top of the page.

Shirley: Many thanks for your information and no, her husband Andrew did not remarry.

AustinQ: Thanks for the census tip, but unfortunately that is not them. My Andrew Lockhart was a clerk in the bakery business and his children were William, Jessie, Jean and James.

I could not find my Andrew and Margaret in the 1911 census at all which makes me think he chose not to do one and paid a fine instead as perhaps this is around the time she disappeared instead of the 1913-1914 period I was given by my grandmother? I even tried searching for the children's names in case they were staying with other relatives at the time, but found nothing.

Good idea about having a look at Margaret's father's will as he did leave one according to that entry, but as only wills up to 1925 are available to view on Scotlandspeople.gov.uk, I have emailed them to ask when 1926 might be available, otherwise I will order it from the National Records of Scotland instead.

Chris in Sussex and ArgyllGran: I have tried to trawl the archived newspapers on this website, but found nothing, so will try the Glasgow Herald link on Google - many thanks. I just have to work out how to enlarge the text without it going blurry, so will have a play around with the help section.

Amokavid: Many thanks for trying!

I emailed the National Records of Scotland about Andrew's will and they confirmed he did not have one, but only a confirmation and left everything to his son James.

After considering she may have joined the war effort, found a lover and moved England, there is a death certificate from England that may be hers, so I will try and order that as well.

I am overwhelmed that you have all taken the time to try and help - much appreciated!

I'm not sure what you mean re it not being the right people on the 1911?

It is definitely them on the 1911 at 219 Berkeley Street, and Margaret is with them?? :-

Andrew is a clerk in a bakery aged 44
Margaret M aged 40
William 9 (son)
Jessie R 8 (daughter)
Jane R 8 (daughter)
James R 4 (son)
Margaret Burns 29 (cousin)
Agnes Burns 26 (cousin)
----------------------------------------------------

Andrew is at the same address in 1913 on the electoral register

http://digital.nls.uk/directories/browse/pageturner.cfm?id=86493692

(James also on above 1911-1912)

Chris :)

http://digital.nls.uk/directories/browse/index.cfm

(Scottish Post Office Directories)


16 August 1917 - Daily Record - Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland

DEATH ON SERVICE
ROGERSON - On the 14th Aug., William Pillans, youngest son of James Rogerson, 133 Berkeley Street, Glasgow.

AustinQ: I can't explain why, but I was only able to see the 1911 Census information you mentioned when I searched Margaret and Agnes Burns listed as cousins.

When I searched for Andrew Lockhart, the only result I got was an Engine Fitter in Camlachie with different children listed. Many thanks for finding the right record as I would not have found it without your help!!

I have discovered that Margaret and Agnes were cousins of our Margaret M Lockhart in the 1911 census as their mother was her aunt.

Chris: Yes that is Margaret's father James that you identified and and brother William - many thanks.

William's death certificate stated that he died in Bartloch Asylum with the cause of death listed as General Paralysis of the insane - duration 3 years. I wonder if that was a result of war trauma or he was already afflicted with mental illness.

From what year were were women listed in UK post office or phone directories? Only if widowed?

I found the following information about women being given the vote:

'in 1918, the Parliament of the United Kingdom passed an act granting the vote to: women over the age of 30 who were householders, the wives of householders, occupiers of property with an annual rent of £5, and graduates of British universities' but in 1928 an 'Amendment of the Representation of the People Act entitles everyone over the age of 21 to vote.'

This would explain why I have had trouble finding female relatives on the electoral rolls during these periods.

Anita.....GPI (Williams cause of death) is another term for Neurosyphilis....not a pleasant disease.