Genealogy Chat

I have two dilemmas. One, I think my ancestor Hannah Blacknell b.1826 may have married a William Tudbury b.1825. Both of Hucknall Nottinghamshire. I can't find marriage record though. The 1861 census shows they are working a farm in South Shields together with William's parents. They have a George Blacknell b. 1834 working for them and named as brother-in-law (hence my reason that Hannah is a Blacknell). I can't clarify this because mother's maiden name is not shown on the children's birth records.
Second query, the 1871 census shows that William has died and I have found a death record Oct-Dec 1864 for a William Tudberry of South Shields. I have also found a death record for a George Blacknell at the same year and quarter of South Shields yet he appears on the 1871 census still working on the farm.
Can anyone give me guidance on how to solve these dilemmas i.e. Is Hannah Blacknell married to William Tudbury or Tudberry and did George Blacknell die in 1864?

Carol, it's quite unusual not to have mother's maiden name on a birth cert. - is she just recorded as Tudbury?
Jan

Yes on the 1861 census but Tudberry on the 1871 census.

I don't mean the census, but the children's birth certs?
Jan

This must be her 1871, and George is named as a servant rather than brother as you would expect, so very possible he was brother-in-law to her husband but not a relative of Hannah:

1871 England Census

Name: George Blacknall
Age: 36
Estimated birth year: abt 1835
Relation: Servant
Gender: Male
Where born: Hucknall, Northamptonshire, England
Civil Parish: Boldon
Ecclesiastical parish: Boldon
Town: West Boldon
County/Island: Durham
Country: England
Registration district: South Shields
Sub-registration district: Westoe

Hannah Tudberry 45
William Tudberry 16
John Tudberry 15
George Tudberry 12
Eliza Tudberry 13
Hannah Tudberry 10
Elizabeth Tudberry 9
George Blacknall 36
George Robinson 23

Still not clear whether you have a child's birth cert, if not this looks like Eliza:

Births Sep 1857 (98%)
TUDBURY Eliza S. Shields 10a 470

Sorry for misunderstanding. The mother's name is blank on the birth records of all her children although I haven't sent for a copy of the birth certificate yet? Would it show on the certificate if it is not on the record which I have viewed?
Carol

I am still a bit unclear - do you mean blank on Freebmd? MMN not shown till 1912. It will be on the actual cert.
Jan

????

Name: George Tudberry
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 07 Sep 1859
Baptism/Christening Place: St. Stephens, South Shields, Durham, England
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: William Tudberry
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Anna Tudberry
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C00587-4
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 1894184
Reference Number: yr 1857-1905 p 166
Collection: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975

Another thing - George born in the wrong place to be Hannah's brother.
Jan

I am getting very muddled now because of all the name changes. I am related to the Blacknell family who originally lived in Hucknall, Nottinghamshire. I have both a Hannah Blacknell on my tree and a George Blacknell is her brother. Sometimes the records show it as Blacknall or Blackwell to confuse matters. I think Hannah may have married a William Tudbury also of Hucknall, Nottinghamshire. Tudbury is sometimes spelt Tudberry to confuse me even further. My direct ancestor is Hannah and George's brother Joseph Blacknell1836-1874who also travelled to the north-east and died there.

The 1861 census states that George is brother-in-law to head of household which at the time is William Tudbury but Tudberry when he is dead. I am only sumising that Hannah is a Blacknell and that George is her brother although their birth year tally and Hucknall was a small place then

Sorry, he does give same birthplace, apologies.

No joy as yet. You must have seen this - might be worth hanging onto as possibly some family link though not your couple:

Marriages Mar 1896 (>99%)
Blacknell Mary Jane Basford 7b 265
Bradley Allin Basford 7b 265
Euehby Margaret Ann Basford 7b 265
Tudbury William Basford 7b 265

Yes many thanks I will save that.
Carol

I can see your reasoning, and it seems pretty sound, but for life of me can't see a marriage!
I see they were both single in 1851 which narrows it down a bit.
Jan

I've trawled the marriages but haven't found anything. I am only filling in wider parts of my tree as I have managed to complete my direct ancestors on the Blacknell family as far back as Richard 1760-1823. I keep leaving it then returning when feel like a good delve.
They were illiterate, I believe, until my great-grandfather George Blacknell 1867-1926 had a little education so that is probably when the name mis-spellings arise as I assume they are speaking the names to the officials and are unable to correct mis-spellings.

Thanks for your help Jan.
Carol

I suspect you won't solve this without a child's birth cert and that might be a bit much for a peripheral family member. Annoying though - you would think these names would make it easier!

I am going to post the 1911 for the couple overleaf as they must surely be related to you somehow - just another headache, sorry!!

TUDBURY, William Head Married M 37 1874 Carter General Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, Mary Jane Wife Married
15 years F 36 1875 Hucknall Torkard VIEW
BLACKNELL, Dola Son Single M 16 1895 Coal Miner Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, Martha Eliezebth Daughter F 14 1897 At Home Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, Edna Daughter F 10 1901 Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, John Son M 8 1903 Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, Joseph Albert Son M 4 1907 Hucknall Torkard VIEW
TUDBURY, Sarah Daughter F 1 1910 Hucknall Torkard VIEW
RG number:
RG14 Piece:
20443 Reference:
RG14PN20443 RG78PN1224 RD429 SD4 ED9 SN310

Registration District:
Basford Sub District:
Hucknall Torkard Enumeration District:
9 Parish:
Hucknall Torkard

Address:
23 Orchard St Hucknall Toryard Nottinghamshire County:
Nottinghamshire

Many thanks Jan. I am sure it could fit part of my wider tree somewhere.

I also think I will splash out on a birth certificate and a couple of death certificates to see if it clarifies things a bit. At Christmas I may ask for small donations from family members who wish to view my tree and for the expense and time my sister and I have spent!! Just joking of course.
Carol

????
this could be worth thinking about

Marriages Sep 1852 (>99%)
xxxxxx BLACKBURN Hannah Tynemouth 10b 177
DOUTHWAITE Eleanor Catharine Tynemouth 10b 177
Douthwaite Eleanor Catharine Tynemouth 10b 177
DOUTHWAITE Eleanor Cathriane Tynemouth 10b 177
DRYDEN John Tynemouth 10b 177
xxxxx TUTBERRY William Tynemouth 10b 177

If you do make sure you let us know the result!
Jan