Genealogy Chat

Hi Derek

The only baptisms for Thomas that seem about right are in 1800 in either Monyash or Chelmorton, born to Joseph and Mary. I cannot find such a Thomas on the 1841 or 1851 census living in those villages, only the fella in Tideswell. So we are a bit stuck there.

I wonder if you could look at the burial records for Thomas d 1877, William (mine) d 1885, Edward d 1895 and possibly George, b 1765, d after 1806. Might these tell us who else is buried with them?

Many thanks

Margaret

Hi Margaret.Your friend's THOMAS NEEDHAM was not baptised at Tideswell..unless he was born either 1785..or 1815..there is no Thomas in between.

By the way.no Needhams in the catholic Church..

Derek

Margaret .all the stuff I have sent you so far has been from the parish records of St john the baptist.Tideswell

.and i have them. complete....what i am sending you are the relevant entries from them...so just ask......
As for burials..there are 52 burials of needhams in St Johns churchyard...none of them have a stone any longer,,becasue i also have data on most of the memorial inscriptions in derbyshire.....that still exist..
I have now moved on to Beeley..findings to follow

Derek.

Hi Derek

You are confirming our findings so far. We believe that the Thomas who married 3 wives is the same one as the children appear with him and whichever wife at the time. My friend's ancestor is son Edward, born to Margaret. I don't recall if my friend knew of baby William but I think he had the death of Margaret.

It seems possible that St John the Baptist was their church - are there any records I can access?

Many thanks, and for your PMs too, I have probably repeated myself!

Margaret

Margaret..Yep....just as i suspected...a little 19th century tragedy..oft repeated.....Wiliam died 08.07.1833 aged three days.his mother Margaret died 12.07.1833 aged 33.....clearly the two events are related..

Edward needham born 29.09.1822 died 21.08.1895 aged 72

Thomas needham b 1802c died 1877 aged 75

Edward DID marry MARY VIGO.....Tideswell not bakewell.08.04.1844

More soon

Derek

Margaret..hope you've Bookmarked this thread!

Ok..I am able to confirm the THOMAS NEEDHAM info you sent me.except6 his birth, that i have not yet got around to
I try to be very accurate...and although there are three marriages for Thomas as you say....there is nothing to say that they are the same Thomas Needham..and you have to corroborate that foryourselves.....
Thomas Needham m. Margaret Hill 11.12.1820
Thomas Needham m Mary Swindell 25.12.1833
Thomas Needham m Eliza Rice 14.11.1850

Children of Thomas and margaret:
Edward 29.09.1822
Marianne 04.12.1825
William 05.07.1833
Thomas 19.12.1830
Sarah 07.06.1827

Ruth Swindell presumably dr of Mary b 16.1.1837

Since William died 1833..just going to checkj for you when Margaret died..

Derek

Hi Margaret.have just had a quick look at Tideswell...hundredds of millions of Needhams of various spellings.....but seriously even if we tick to NEEDHAM there a huge number....and there are about 50 buried in the Church yard of ST.John the Baptist Tideswell!!!
I'm having a preliminary look at the names you have given me,because i have to out and about today..
More later
Derek

Hi Margaret......let me look at this tomorrow......I have loads of parish registers.....and i know i will have at least somne of your answers..but right now I'm watching cricket from the West indies!!

Derek.

Hi Derek

Hope you can help.

My gg grandfather was William Needham b 1796 in Tideswell, died 1885 in Windmill. He had two wives (1) Sarah Gregory m 17 Sep 1817 in Hope, who died before 1824 when he married (2) Hannah Downing in Nov 1824 also in Hope. My ancestor is his first child with Sarah, Mary, b 1818 in Tideswell, though on census records that gets altered to Windmill, Bakewell or Cressbrook. She married Abraham Oldfield in Macclesfield, and there the Needham line ends for me.

In 1861 and 1881, William is living in Little Hucklow. In 1851 in Litton, and in 1841 the same. He died in 1885 in Windmill, Little Hucklow.

As far as I can determine, William's parents were George Needham b 1765 in Beeley and Rebecca Drabble b 1765, married 1791 in Eyam. No other records seem likely, but there is no evidence to say that this one is correct.

I get a bit worried about them all dashing about between Hope, Eyam, Tideswell, Cressbrook, Beeley, Windmill and Bakewell. Although all those places are in the locality they are not particularly close for a family in the late 1700s with no transport. I live in North Derbyshire myself, so I know the locality, indeed my daughter has just booked her wedding venue for next year in Hope.

Given the Tideswell connection, I have scoured Tideswell Church cemetery and there is not a Needham in sight. If you look at the cencus records for Tideswell in 1841-1861 at least, the place is full of Needhams, yet none are buried in the "Cathedral of the Peak" churchyard. There is a Catholic church in Tideswell, I wonder if that is worth a search? I have tried the one just out of town off the main road, but those are later deaths (Municipal graveyard).

I have made VERY good friends on Genes with a chap whose ancestor is Thomas Needham born around 1800 in Tideswell. We can find no connection between the two of us at all.

I feel that cemetery records are likely to give us some information - do you have any?

For some reason the screen is not now letting me go back to FTM to give you further information on these families, but I do have some.

Are you able to help at all from what I have said?

Can add more later if need be.

Margaret

Hi Sharon....just a quick update....Benjamin Brentnall senior apparently died 1886 in Notts.

Benjamin Brentnall junior married Ann fourth quarter of 1859 in Nottingham..and had six children

In 1871 Father benjamin was living with them.

In 1861 Father benjamin was living at Saxondale Village on his own.

1851 living at Bingham with his son John aged 10..who clealry had moved on by 1861
And don't forget that Ben senior was widowed by 1851, and since i can't find his wife asnywhere she probably died 1841. perhaps in childbirth..remember also benjamin junior was born 1834..and john 1841.
Good hunting

Derek

Thankyou Derek yes benjamine was a game keeper !he died in nottingham in 1886 as far as I know he did marry in Nottingham an in 1871 was living with one of his sons Benjamine.
Thankyou for your help not knowing the area at all I know have a better idea of the area.
Not knowing Nottingham at all would you know where I should look for a possible place of marriage if his son was living in Barker Gate Nottingham in 1881?
Again many thanks Sharon

Karen.you're an Angel ...it's people like you that make itworth while.Sadly there are loads of people who
never even bother to answer....... thank you Derek

Hi Derek,
If it wasn't for 'stars' like yourself, people like me who , live Down Under.. would have lots of trouble tracing their trees. All help is greatly appreciated.

Cheers for now....
Karen of Brisbane

You probably are breaking the rules but wouldn,t life be boring if we all did as we should , nighty night,gillx

Hi everybody..hope I'm not breaking the rules..cos i do have a thread on "Records office" about Derbyshire...........just to let you knoe that i am now able to offer a much wider portfolio than before.My speciality has been North Derbyshire..but now i am now able to offer help in South Derbyshire as well.....less comprehensive perhaps..but maybe useful

Derek

I wouldnt be surprised if all the baptisms you found were their children
Thanks for all your help
Mary

Hi Saron.........not easy chasing a St >ary's church in Derbyshire.........however....
Looks like your Benjamin might have come from Denby near Ripley in Derbyshire.....and if he married there..he moved later to Nottingham.because his son John was born about 1841 in Carlton Nottingham.
Was Benjamin a Game keeper?? If so, by 1851 he was a widower in Bingham..a few miles outside Nottingham....I know it well because i live in Nottingham....
But by 1871 aged about 66/7 he is in Denby as a lodger with a load of Brentnalls who can only be his relatives children and grandchildren...I'm guessing he died in Denby..and there are memorial inscriptions to BRENTNALL..in the church yard of St. mary the Virgin..in Denby......

I hope this is some help.......and i do know from my records that there were a large number of Brentnalls in derbys, from.but i don't have any
recordsfor Denby.......
Let me know if i can be of any further help

Good luck.
Derek

Hi Mary..they do and he was an Ag Lab....lol

Derek

Hi Derek
I am looking for baptism of Benjamin Brentnall c1803 I believe family was connected to a St Mary's church in Derbyshire he married there on 12 July 1827
Any information would be great Brentnall's are causing me many head aches
Regards Sharon

Hi Derek,
do the records show fathers occupation? Thomas Hudson was an ag. lab.
Thanks Mary