Genealogy Chat

Visiting Matlock Records Office this Friday (17th July)

Derek

Hi again Derek, I will definately keep watching,

thanks again.

Annette

Hi Derek, read you are going to Matlock, so can I add to your workload please.

I have a Robert Hall born c1786 who married Grace Robinson born c1790. I think I have found all their children.

If you could confirm that John Hall born c 1760 who married Ellen Kinder born c 1760 is Robert's father I would be very grateful. Pushing my luck here, but if you should come across any other info, that would be great.

Good luck in Matlock, think you are going to be very busy.

Hi Derek,
Would you be so kind as to look up the following for me please......if they are there to be found?

I have a William Birkin Born 1740 from Aston upon Trent, whom I found on BIVRI, with his siblings and mother Elizabeth born abt. 1720. Film 1042080 1690-1812.

William married Hester Burrows born abt 1742 on 5/12/1763. I found this on the Breadsall parish registers.

This is just background.........as I would like you to try and find a marriage for Williams mother Elizabeth..........On IGI, I did find the following........... One James Berkin born abt 1720 Derby, who married an Elizabeth Ashton born abt 1720 from Aston upon Trent.

So far I have worked back to William finding just his mothers given name and birthplace but, I would appreciate it greatly if you could find some confirmation of a marriage for her so that I can try and confirm or discount the above couple. Elizabeth had 6 children whom I know of (Bivri).........so anything you could discover would be helpful.
Thankyou in advance Derek.

Jen

Steven..was not suggesting for one moment that He married both Hannah's..after all Hannah Sturland was heavily pregnant with Thomas when they married........and Thomas was born just after they married. he certainly did not die before they were married...so i just have to find the other son for you...I just added the hannah Binge as a curiosoity

Derek

Hi Derek, that's okay. Many thanks for your time.

It is interested that John Waters married to Hannah Sturland and Hannah Binge in same year. Must be two different John Waters.

I wonder which Hannah that she had first son, with John, Thomas who died in 1782 before their marriage.

I hope my Thomas' mother would be Hannah Sturland because he had two sons, named Sturland in their middle names in Westminster, London.

Cheers, Steven.

Hi Annette..I have week off work next week, during which i shall visit Matlock..watch this space!!

Derek

Hi Derek

I just read that the next time you go to Matlock you'll be having a look at the Kirk Langley records for Chris. I did post on page two of this thread with my query and wondered if you'd be able to have a look for me. My query was

'Hi Derek, thanks for the offer of help. Two things I am looking for, the first is the birth/christening for Ellen Gregson around 1782. in all the census she says she's from Longford but her age is never quite so certain. She married John Sherratt 1807 Kirk Langley, Derbyshire.

The next one I'm looking for is Samuel Sherratt who is living with the above Ellen and John in Kirk Langley on the 1841 census aged 6. I've not found a birth for him although all their other children can be found on the IGI. so a birth/christening for him would be great plus a mention of who his parents might be????'

I've since got Samuels marriage certificate to Lucy Inkerson and where the name of the father should be, it says 'Ellen Sherratt" single woman.

I still can't find a baptism for him and I also wondered if there'd be a Bastardy order for him?

I appreciate your help and love reading your thread

Many thanks

Annette

hi derek

WOW

Thanks for the info on the wraggs can you find out abot job and alice plz also would like info on tomesia b 1771 alice b 1765 and hannah 1766

many thanks

Hi Sarah..yo0u have to be very careful with the WRAGG name..a very common Derbyshire name.
I have been researching Derbyshire families for several years and WRAGG is one of the most difficult to accurately trace from generation to generation.

I have the parish records for Matlock. Matlock Cromford and for Darley Dale..........among many others........so i am in a position to give you more accurate info than those who rely on IGI and Census records.

So......the FACTS are these:

The only John Wragg born at Darley Dale in the 1730's was norn 1736 son of Samuel and he died in 1736.........Samuel named his `next child John in 1737. This often happened.so John is not the brother of Dennis.
which is not to say that there might be a John Wragg born Darley Abbey Derby.....but I can't find him.....he would obviously be of a different family anyway.

DENNIS WRAGG 06.03.1742 was one of the children of JOB WRAGG and ALICE nee YATES

DENNIS married JANE SMITH 23.04.1764 and one of their children was DENNIS WRAGG 19.06.1774

For your information.....Dennis and Jane had the following additional children:

TOMESIA 13.10.1771
ALICE 03.07.1765
HANNAH 20.07.1766

Please let me know if I can take this any further

Derek

hi derek

can you lookp up dennis wragg b abt 1774 father dennis mother jane also lookup dennis wragg b 1742 mathlock (father) and see if he had brother john wragg b abt 1730 darley or are they two different famillies

many thanks

Hi Sarah...........after some more investigation I have discovered that John Shaw married ANN OATS not Allcock........I missed a Codnor marriage..sorry

Ann Oats was born Codnor 1813..no parenst found yet
John Shaw born Codnor 1809 son of John and Ann

Sarah Shaw born Codnor 1834 and ELIXA 1841

Eliza Shaw married Thomas Wheeldon and on the death of her mother she and her family were joined by her widowed father.

They married at Codnor 28.01.1858 when he was 22 and she 17

They had the following children:

John 1859
George 1862
Thomas 1864
Ann S 1870

These are all on the 1871 Census.

Derek

hi derek

Thanks for the info can you find for me where john shaw was born in 1809 also his wife anne allcock

also more info pllz on eliza their other daughter b1841 and her child john

many thanks

Steven de Gussa..Hi Steven..sorry about that..I must have meant to answer you and forgot..mea culpa!

YES..Phillimore Marraiage registers confirm the marriage of a heavily pregnant(!) HANNAH STURLAND to JOHN WATERS 01.05.1785

just in time for the confirmed birth of son THOMAS 22.06.1785.
Source Wilne parish registers.

If you have access to IGI you will find all sorts of submitted dates for the marriage..including the name HANNAH BINGE!!..mild amusement.

But my information is entirley accurate.

Sorry to keep you waiting

Derek

Hi Sarah........

DENNIS WRAGG Matlock 10.12.1826 son of John and Sarah

married SARAH SHAW (born Codnor 14.07.1833 baptised 02.10.1833) daughter of JOHN SHAW and ANNE ALLCOCK(married codnor 20.06.1831) Marriage took place Codnor 03.02.1853

JOHN SHAW was an Iron Miner and in 1851 was living at 134 Dakins Row Codnor with his wife ANNE,,,,daughter SARAH and ELIZA(b1841)

JOHN was born 1809 and ANNE 1813

If you want anything else just shout.


ADDITION 13.10 Saturday........some more info that you might find interesting:

1861...John Shaw is living with his wife at 43 Daykins Row.
Thomas Wheeldon is living next door at 44, having married ELIZA, dsughter of John.and they have a 2year old son called John

1871....JOHN SHAW is now a widower and is Head of Household that includes Thomas and Eliza and FOUR children

All the best

Derek

dennis wragg b 1826 matlock

can you lookup his marriage to a sarah shaw 1853 codnor derbyshire and see where she was born plz

many thanks
sarah

Hi Margaret..just an initial quick answer..for the moment.
I know i did a lot of sortingout of the Twiggs for you.....and i'll have to scroll back for ages to find what I sent you. Will do that later.

All the SLEIGHS are at Hartington...but the Twiggs came from somewhere else.and there are only five marriages of Twiggs at Hartington...two Elizabeths and three Williams...........

Judith Sleight daughter of henry and mary 06.10.1762 I can confirm.
Only one other Judith Sleigh 20.09.1828.

So I have to go back and find where i got all the Twiggs from
I do have pretty well all the records from the area so i'll sort it ouit for you..probably this evening.

ADDITION: 10.18 am.........Of course! John Twigg married Judith Sleigh at EAST STERNDALE not Hartington (29.06.1785) and have found at least some of the twiggs at East Sterndale...but the ES records only start at 1765...........

More later xx

Derek

Hi Derek

Back on the Twiggs. We found John Twigg b 1753 marrying Judith Sleigh at Hartington. No more on the Sleighs (parents Henry and Mary, 3 other kids), but anything you can add is greatly appreciated.

Re John Twigg, I have recently contacted a group of people on GR who have him, and they have gone back to 1606. It is very tempting to assume they are correct and just load the info into my tree, but I can't do it. Most of their assumptions are based on submitted records to familysearch and they don't seem to want to discuss their findings with me.

I just wondered if you were able to check them out for me.

They have:

John Twigg b 1753 parents Benjamin b 1714 and Mary Slater b 1713, died 1781. Married 3/4//38 in Ashford (a place dear to your heart). They have various siblings of Benjamin but I am not worried about them. If they have the right parents, I am prepared to accept the siblings.

Back to Benjamin Twigg's parents, they have John b 1690 marrying Ellen Dakin/Ellen Wildgoose/Ellen Ford, and someone has John marrying an Elizabeth. Can you help here?

Parents of John are Benjamin 1658 and Grace Barber.

Parents of Benjamin 1632 are Benjamin and Hannat Bott

Father of the last Benjamin is John b 1606.

Parents of Benjamin are Benjamin 1632 and Hannah Bott.

Father of Benjamin is John Twigg 1606.

Are you able to tell me if any of this reliable? Submitted records are usual dubious aren't they?

Best wishes

Margaret

Hi Jill..what you actually get depends on how old the records are.......as a general rule.Baptisms upto about 1700 just give the parents name..often only the father..then later you get both parents.and after about 1800 you get father's occupation

Burials early on only give that date....then later.after about 1800 you get the relationship to whoever survives..John died..... husband of Ethel....

Marriages are where you get the most information........scanty in the 18th century, but again from about 1800 you get wife's maiden name..husbands occupation....often his father and the fathers occupation..and either OTP..of this parish, or where either party originated.....and witnesses, which can often lead you to other memberso f the family'..

Derek

Hi Derek, back in April I asked you about Harriet Todd listed as Fodd. Can I ask what you get to see when you look at the parish records? ie Is it a name and page no or do you get to see the whole baptism details?.
I have to tell you that this woman had delusions of grandeur! Despite leaving Derby at the age of 2 she apparently always spoke with a Derbyshire burr! She told my aunt that all the family were buried there and so my aunt spent many an hour there when on holiday looking for graves that didn't exist! I'm hoping that she was just a fibber and that she wasn't adopted....stranger things have happened!....sorry for the ramble it must be the heat in the south.....jill