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Added by Danuta Morsley on 24/07/2006 09:49:44 If you're not too busy can you find me anything about a long- term dead end of mine? John James Morsley m Mary Hinton 26 Oct 1823 St Dunstan's, Stepney. I think their children are Mary Maria Morsley b 26 Jan 1825 Woolwich, John b 1829 Lambeth, Emily b 1836 Stepney and Charles Robert b 25 Nov 1845 East End of London. The children seem rather spreadout and the birth places move about a bit so it would be lovely to find them in 1841, 1851 or 1861 or anywhere! Many thanks in advance Danusia Morsley *************************************************************************** Hi Which of the above have you linked to your tree and have a confirmed sighting of please? As you are not sure if the children are right - should I be concentrating my efforts on locating their parents or a particular child? Pen x

Amanda Have had no futher luck locating Eliza on the 1891. Did you see message before asking you to confirm the name of the son of Charles (occ. comedian). Pen x

Mike Still no luck. Don't give up though, I have BROWNS in my tree - my great grandmothers line. I have manged to get 'paper proof' of the line all the way to 1841 and some parish records. I had William Brown, born 1873 London, lol. Do you know when and where Thomas Henry Brown born c1883 died. If so please supply this info, or closest guess that you can make. Pen x p.s found my first grey hair yesterday and I'm a meer 33, lol. but having red hair - it's well hidden.......will I soon be having senior moments ???

hi Pen, Thanks for your reply. The witnesses at the wedding were Florence Liddiard and Albert Liddiard, and both Thomas and Thomas Henry were Labourers. I made a bit of an error in my first request - Thomas Henry was my Grandfather, not Gt Grandfather. As you willbe able to work out, I'm no spring chicken - call it a senior moment, please. Mike

Rebekah Markham 1891 Annie Waine abt 1888 Bascote Heath, Warwickshire, England Daughter Long Itchington Warwickshire View Record Charles Waine abt 1855 Barcote Heath, Warwickshire, England Head Long Itchington Warwickshire View Record Elizabeth Waine abt 1860 Radford, Warwickshire, England Wife Long Itchington Warwickshire Source information: RG12/2487 Registration district: Southam Sub registration district: Southam ED, institution, or vessel: 11 Folio: 109 Page: 8 (click to see others on page) GSU Number: 6097597 Civil parish: Long Itchington Ecclesiastical parish: Ufton Town: Bascote Heath County/Island: Warwickshire Country: England Address - cottage Occupation of head - Agricultural Labourer Pen x

Hi Penelope, The only firm info I have re my Gt Grandfather Thomas Henry Brown is from his marriage cert. He was married in St. Mary's Church, Tottenham , Edmonton Reg. Dist., on 2nd Sept. 1911, aged 27 years, therefore born c 1884. His father (deceased at the time) was Thomas Brown. Assuming he was born somewhere in Middlesex/North London, do you think you can locate Thomas Henry for me on the 1891 or 1901 censuses, with any family info. Sorry if this is a toughie with such a common name! Thanks Mike

hi pen i know that margarets father was born in grenada and that his family are in and around holme westmorlands and cockermouth dont know where his wife was born but she died sometime after 1871 smoking a pipe in bed the margaret born 1823 married after 1841 and the only marriage i can find that links her is the one to lawson will check and make sure she didnt die tracy

NOTES ONLY - TRACEY What if her parents met abroad or travelled back to fathers homeplace ? 1881 View Record Betsy Drew abt 1857 Gt Malvern, Worcestershire, England Servant Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Elizabeth Jinks abt 1858 Upton On Severn, Worcestershire, England Servant Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Emily Margaret Lawson abt 1825 Bombay, East Indies Wife Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Lucy Maria Lawson abt 1851 Offenham, Worcestershire, England Daughter Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Robert Lawson abt 1822 Richmond, Yorkshire, England Head Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Frederick George Owen abt 1865 Pershore, Worcestershire, England Servant Upton On Severn Worcestershire View Record Lucy Roberts abt 1860 Severn Stoke, Worcestershire, England Servant Upton On Severn Worcestershire 1851 View Record Ann Havill abt 1827 Tibenham, Gloucestershire, England Servant Offenham Worcestershire View Record Ann Hunt abt 1851 Tredington, Worcestershire, England Nurse Offenham Worcestershire View Record Emilly Margaret Lawson abt 1825 Romhay, India Wife Offenham Worcestershire View Record Infant Lawson abt 1851 Offenham, Worcestershire, England Daughter Offenham Worcestershire View Record Mary Caroline Lawson abt 1850 Offenham, Worcestershire, England Daughter Offenham Worcestershire View Record Robert Lawson abt 1822 Richmond, Yorkshire, England Head Offenham Worcestershire View Record Ann Lucas abt 1835 Bosbury, Herefordshire, England Servant Offenham Worcestershire View Record Sarah Treston abt 1828 Barrington, Gloucestershire, England Servant Offenham Worcestershire will check the 1841 to rule her out .............

hi pen thats ok thanks alot for looking tracy

Tracey - Sorry unable to find a Margaret Lawson or Craigg/Cragg/Craig in the 1851 or 61. And without the birthplace it makes it tricky to see if she married an alternative groom. I guess really the only thing to do is get the marriage cert for the one you located to Robert Lawson - and hope the father matches. That way you will have addys and occupations to work with for the groom and his family. Best wishes Pen x

hi yes these are the same ones its just that their surnames are spelt differently on a lot of records craig/craigg/cragg i have found marriages for all but margaret tracy

Cheers Tracey 1841 for my ref Dinah Craigg abt 1831 Westmorland, England Holme Westmorland James Craigg abt 1790 Foreign Parts Holme Westmorland James Craigg abt 1827 Holme Westmorland Jonathan Craigg abt 1829 Holme Westmorland Margaret Craigg abt 1792 Holme Westmorland Margart Craigg abt 1825 Holme Westmorland Robert Craigg abt 1837 Westmorland, England Holme Westmorland William Craigg abt 1823 Holme Westmorland 1851 for ref - her parents and sibs Match Quality View Record Name Estimated Birth Year Birthplace Relationship Civil Parish County/Island View Image View Record Alexander Craig abt 1851 Cockermouth, Cumberland, England Grandson Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Dinah Lee Craig abt 1832 Cockermouth, Cumberland, England Daughter Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Elizabeth Craig abt 1849 Holme, Westmorland, England Granddaughter Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Grace Craig abt 1821 Bentham, Yorkshire, England Daughter-in-law Cockermouth Cumberland View Record James Craig abt 1790 Grd British Subject, W I Head Cockermouth Cumberland View Record James Craig abt 1829 Cockermouth, Cumberland, England Son Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Margaret Craig abt 1793 Cockermouth, Cumberland, England Wife Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Margaret Craig abt 1847 Holme, Westmorland, England Granddaughter Cockermouth Cumberland View Record Robert Craig abt 1837 Holme, Westmorland, England Son Cockermouth Cumberland

hi pen on the 1841 she is living with her parents and siblings james craig c1790 west indies margaret c1892 william 1823 james c1827 johnathan c1829 dinah c1832 westmoorlands robert c1837 westmoorlands thankyou tracy

Tracey Is the marriage you have then? Surname First name(s) District Vol Page -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Marriages Mar 1843 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Craig Margaret Carlisle 25 41 LAWSON Robert Carlisle 25 41 Please post the details of her on the 1841 and who she was with Do you have them on the 1861, 71 or 81 together if so please one of those. Pen x

hi could you please do a 1851 look up for me please im looking for a margaret craig/cragg born 1823 noc but on 1841 she is living in holme westmoorlands i think she may be married to a robert lawsonon the 1851 census thankyou tracy

If you're not too busy can you find me anything about a long- term dead end of mine? John James Morsley m Mary Hinton 26 Oct 1823 St Dunstan's, Stepney. I think their children are Mary Maria Morsley b 26 Jan 1825 Woolwich, John b 1829 Lambeth, Emily b 1836 Stepney and Charles Robert b 25 Nov 1845 East End of London. The children seem rather spreadout and the birth places move about a bit so it would be lovely to find them in 1841, 1851 or 1861 or anywhere! Many thanks in advance Danusia Morsley

FOLLOW UP for Samantha Hi Penelope, thanks for all your help but could i ask a couple of questions?. The 1841 census for Oliver ashmore b 1829 does it show the address?.Does it have an approx age for edward and catherine b 1791 as this is older than i thought. Any idea where i can find marriage details as would be prior to 1837?. Is there any other way to find a mothers maiden name except to order birth cert?. I did not supply Mary Ann b 1826 maiden name as i don't have it-was not even sure if they were married then-but obviously not.Must be somewhere between 1841 and 1851.I will have to look thru them all. Any chance you could do an 1851 for edward and catherine b 1791 to see if they are still alive?. Thanks again for all your help. Samantha *************************************************************************** Hi Samantha 1. 1841 Addy just reads South Street 2. Hard to say as some enumerators rounded up the ages..but looking at the 1851 - I'd say that the ages are correct. (details below) 3. You could try looking on the IGi at www.familysearch.org for a marriage and perhaps any christenings of the children. 4. Ordering a marriage cert would be the way to get a maiden name - unless you can locate the right marriage in Parish records for the parents - and the BMD index for Olivers. 1851 View Record Anna Ashmore abt 1823 Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Daughter-in-law Sheffield Yorkshire View Record Catharine Ashmore abt 1791 Painswick, Gloucestershire, England Wife Sheffield Yorkshire View Record Edward Ashmore abt 1791 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Head Sheffield Yorkshire View Record William Ashmore abt 1824 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Son Sheffield Yorkshire Source information: HO107/2341 Registration district: Sheffield Sub-registration district: Sheffield Park ED, institution, or vessel: 13 Folio: 354 Page: 24 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 100 GSU Number: 87596-87597 Civil parish: Sheffield County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Address - court 20 South St Park Occupation of head - Optician William is also an optician Living next door is this family - Chas Ashmore abt 1813 Portsmouth, Huntingdonshire, England Head Sheffield Yorkshire Mary Ashmore abt 1814 Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Wife Sheffield Yorkshire View Record Mary C Ashmore abt 1843 Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Daughter Sheffield Yorkshire View Record Walter Ashmore abt 1848 Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Son Sheffield Yorkshire Chas S Ashmore abt 1839 Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Son Sheffield Yorkshire Occupation of head of house - Frame maker Pen x

Hmmmm, I think I may have to try and find likely birth certificates of Henry and Harriet so I can find out parents. Is there an easy way to search for BMD's rather than just looking through every quarter for every likely year? Thanks, Paula x

Possible suspect.....lol 1851 - might of been misheard John Greaves abt 1833 Hunshelf, Yorkshire, England Apprentice Hunshelf Yorkshire James Helie abt 1820 Wortley, Yorkshire, England Head Hunshelf Yorkshire Mary Helie abt 1801 Bradfield, Yorkshire, England Wife Hunshelf Yorkshire Henry Holdsworth abt 1819 Ecclesfield, Yorkshire, England Lodger Hunshelf Yorkshire Source information: HO107/2334 Registration district: Wortley Sub-registration district: Cawthorne ED, institution, or vessel: 8 Folio: 453 Page: 24 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 93 GSU Number: 87579-87580 Henry has the occupation of stone mason *************************************************** 1851 - possible need to rule out Ann Birks abt 1788 Wath, Yorkshire, England Wife Wath upon Dearne Yorkshire Harriet Birks abt 1831 Wath, Yorkshire, England Daughter Wath upon Dearne Yorkshire John Birks abt 1777 Bolton, Yorkshire, England Head Wath upon Dearne Yorkshire 1861 - family above - no Harriet with them Ann Birks abt 1788 Wath Upon Dearne, Yorkshire, England Wife Wath upon Dearne Yorkshire John Birks abt 1777 Bolton Upon Dearne, Yorkshire, England Head Wath upon Dearne Yorkshire

Talking about births...Herbert's father - George Hawksworth - I'd found an 1871 census RG10/4656 Ecclesfield which has a 19yr old George (stone mason) [which puts dob abt 1851/52] living with his parents Henry Hawksworth age 51 and Harriet Hawksworth age 40 and siblings Harriet A age 3 and Lucy age 1. I can't trace any of them back before 1871 though. Any ideas? Thanks very much, Paula x ************************************************************************** 1871 for my ref View Record George Hawksworth abt 1852 Ecclesfield, Yorkshire, England Son Ecclesfield Yorkshire View Record Harriet Hawksworth abt 1831 Wath Upon Dearne, Yorkshire, England Wife Ecclesfield Yorkshire View Record Harriet A Hawksworth abt 1868 Ecclesfield, Yorkshire, England Daughter Ecclesfield Yorkshire View Record Henry Hawksworth abt 1820 Ecclesfield, Yorkshire, England Head Ecclesfield Yorkshire View Record Lucy Hawksworth abt 1870 Ecclesfield, Yorkshire, England Daughter Ecclesfield Yorkshire Source information: RG10/4656 Registration district: Wortley Sub-registration district: Ecclesfield ED, institution, or vessel: 6 Folio: 118 Page: 19 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 91 GSU Number: 847219 1861 Unable to locate them at the mo. Will be back later. Pen x