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Re young Frances -

posting this just in case - a death transcribed in two different ways:

From FreeBMD:

"Deaths Mar 1904
EUSTACE Frances. 37 Kingston 2a 259 freebmdcc
#COMMENT Correction Reference 2013-05-2681 caused this entry to be added. Claimed Source was "FreeBMD Scan Image - Printed"
EUSTACE Frances. 57 Kings L 4b 259 JWhitmore

Although the above transcriptions are different it has been determined that the first is correct and is hence the one that appears in the results"


From Ancestry:

Frances Eustace
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915
Name: Frances Eustace
Estimated birth year: abt 1847
Registration Year: 1904
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 57
Registration district: King's Lynn
Inferred County: Norfolk
Volume: 4b
Page: 259


Her age is clearly 37 on the mage for the GRO Index, viewed via Ancestry and FreeBMD.- not 57.

Your Frances would have been 37 if she died before her February birthday.


From the GRO website:

EUSTACE, FRANCES 37
GRO Reference: 1904 M Quarter in KINGSTON Volume 02A Page 259

Thank you, one down, three to go.

Name: Frances Foy
Death Age: 80
Birth Date: abt 1840
Registration Date: Mar 1920
Registration district: Prestwich
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8d
Page: 523

dob 5 yrs out

Name: Martin Foy
Estimated birth year: abt 1840
Registration Year: 1892
Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun
Age at Death: 52
Registration district: Manchester
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8d
Page: 150

or

Name: Martin Foy
Estimated birth year: abt 1836
Registration Year: 1910
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 74
Registration district: Goole
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume: 9c
Page: 493

Marriage: 1 Nov 1887 St Peter, Middleton, Lancashire, England
Guilelmum Nash - Tonge
Mariam Eustace - Tonge
Groom's Father: Roberti Nash
Bride's Father: Joannis Eustace
Witness: Michaele Patritio Donelan; Brigitta Anna Cass
Married by: Joannes W. Wigman
Notes: Cum dispensatione super imped. Mixtae religionis, necnon super trina
publicatione Cannorum.
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

Oh thank you thank you thank you, now this solves all the problems, Sheila will be so pleased. So they married after the birth of their firs child... You're amazing,

hi
its not on free bdm

or lancashire bmd

it was found here

https://www.lan-opc.org.uk/

Thank you to all the amazing people who have replied to this thread.
I am quite overwhelmed.
its going to take my poor brain a while to absorb and sort out who is who though so forgive me if I miss anyones info just now.
Sheila B

This marriage posted by safc earlier names Mary's father as Joannis (John)<<<<<<<

Marriage: 1 Nov 1887 St Peter, Middleton, Lancashire, England
Guilelmum Nash - Tonge
Mariam Eustace - Tonge
Groom's Father: Roberti Nash
Bride's Father: Joannis Eustace<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Witness: Michaele Patritio Donelan; Brigitta Anna Cass
Married by: Joannes W. Wigman
Notes: Cum dispensatione super imped. Mixtae religionis, necnon super trina
publicatione Cannorum.
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

but you say here that you got a birth certificate from you brother for Mary Eustace
naming her parents as Denis and Jane Eustace (nee Norton)<<<<<<

My own research came to a brick wall until I got a birth certificate from my brother,
which is for MARY EUSTACE. Born 17 December 1864
Parents DENIS Eustace and JANE Eustace nee NORTON<<<<<<<<<
The address on the cert. is Howards Lane, Roundtown, Rathfarnham South Dublin.
Pretty exciting stuff!

Could this birth certificate be the wrong one?

This looks like the birth reg for Mary Eustace daughter of Frances (nee Ross) (BUT her father is Michael NOT JOHN)

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1864/03617/2335193.pdf

Michael dies before 1870

Possible death:
ame MICHL EUSTACE
Date of Death 1869
Group Registration ID N/R
SR District/Reg Area Dublin North
Deceased Age at Death 38
Returns Year 1869
Returns Quarter 2
Returns Volume No 7

2nd marriage for Frances to Thomas Hand in 1870:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1870/11393/8183163.pdf

I suspect the Mary that you have the birth certificate for died as an infant. The parents (Dennis and Jane) had another daughter named Mary 2nd September 1866 (born Howard's Lane).

But as Tiggit suggests it is unlikely to be the correct Mary if her father is recorded as John on her marriage.

There is a baptism of a Maria Eustace on the church records link given by tiggit,
3rd January 1865, address 17 Up Abbey Street, Dublin, St. Mary's church.

Father : Johannes Eustace,
Mother : margarita Bruce.
Sponsor: Mary Byrne

Is this likely?

Siblings for the above ..
Jacobus Eustace,, bz. 22.1.1864, St. Mary RC, ADDRESS. 3 Abbey Street Dublin
Robert Eustace, bz. 20.12.1867, St. Mary. 80 Capel Street,Dublin

Parents Johannes Eustace and Margarita Bruce.

Name: John Eustace
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 13 Oct 1862
Marriage Place: St Thomas, City of Dublin, Ire
Father: James Eustace
Spouse: Margaret Bruce
FHL Film Number: 101436
Reference ID: 2:3G9HZRS

her father

Name: Robert Bruce
Estimated birth year: abt 1817
Date of Registration: 1873
Death Age: 56
Registration district: Dublin North
Volume: 17
Page: 386
FHL Film Number: 101586

I wonder if this baptism posted by Gillikins could be this child registered as Christina but baptised as Maria :

Quote
There is a baptism of a Maria Eustace on the church records link given by tiggit,
3rd January 1865, address 17 Up Abbey Street, Dublin, St. Mary's church.

Father : Johannes Eustace,
Mother : margarita Bruce.
Sponsor: Mary Byrne

Birth reg for Christina 1865 (birth 4th Jan)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03586/2321936.pdf

Other children of this couple:

Robert 1867
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1868/03455/2268545.pdf

John 1870
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1870/03336/2222827.pdf

Possible death for John 1897:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1897/05856/4659779.pdf

Peter 1872
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1872/03236/2186133.pdf

Marriage for Peter in 1896
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1896/10500/5823884.pdf

Death for Peter:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1900/05753/4625104.pdf

Margaret 1876
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1876/03058/2120980.pdf

Mary J 1878
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1878/02966/2086587.pdf

Eliza 1879
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1879/02897/2061520.pdf


1901 irish census:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/North_City/Little_Denmark_Street/1332959/

1911 irish census:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/North_City/Denmark_St__Little/36449/



Death for John 1914

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1914/05295/4472478.pdf



Death for Margaret 1918

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1918/05195/4435353.pdf

Its looking ever more likely that the birth cert. that I have for Mary, from my brother cant be the right Mary. (The cert was among mums effects after mum sadly died in 2005). Mum had been doing the family tree for some years.

Gill found info which showed that Denis and Jane had TWO daughters named Mary (17:12:1864 and 22:9:!866) but BOTH of them died as babies, and although Denis and Jane had a son - Joseph who married a Mary Ann Peggs this also seems unlikely to be my Mary.

Michael Eustace born 1:3:1830 in Rathfarnham wed to Francis nee Ross are looking like good candidates for the parents of my Mary

They had two children.... MARY 1864 and Francis junior 1866
So I'm hopeful that this is my elusive Mary! The date is right and the place.
I have several birth certs of her and Williams children, and also. the 1901 and 1911 census lists.
So if Michael and Francis ARE my nans Grandparents that's another piece of the puzzle.

Or have I got it wrong again! :-S

Sheila,

On the marriage posted by safc, Mary Eustace lists her father as JOHN.
-----------------------------------

I think it unlikely that your Mary is the daughter of Michael Eustace and Frances Ross, as i suspect that Mary married Edward Dillon in 1883 Manchester.

I agree with AustinQ, Sheila, the marriage address, St. Peter's church, Tonge, is exactly where they were living three years later in 1891,

and one of Mary's children (although her birth perhaps registered as Christina, father John and Margaret, and baptised as Maria, father John and Margaret ) is John Robert born 1890. That would be after her own father John Eustace, and William's father Robert Nash.

<3 :-D

I'm a bit worried.
We must remember that Sheila's Mary gave birth to lily in Manchester, Oldham in 1885, placing her there.

The above John and Margaret, he a silver plater, mostly of Denmark Street,
seem to be at 11.5 little Denmark street in1901, according to the link above....

John Eustace RC age 50, read and write, silver plater
Margaret wife. 50 read and write
MARY daughter 23 (so Mary Jane b. 1878)
Margaret 19 read and write (b. 1876?)
Mary eustace, servant. 30 unmarried

Have we got the wrong John Eustace marriage?


:-( :-( :-(

among mums papers I have found a wedding cert. for a John Robert.
wed to Betty Rothwell 17 july 1915 In the presence of Luke Nash at Guardian Angels Church, Elton Bury.

I remember my Gt Uncle Luke. He lived with my nan Kate for a while during my childhood.

And yes from the from the 1901 census John Robert is listed as one of William and Marys children. at 63 Sanford St. Radcliffe. So he would have been about 24/25 at this wedding.
And on the 1911 census also, from 170 Church St. Radcliffe. also Kate and Luke listed on both although Kate is listed as Katherine on the 1911

So am I looking at Guilelmum (William) Nash and Mariam (Mary) Eustace as being the right ones?
Sorry to be so dim!
And thank you for your patience.

I have found a marriage cert for a John Robert Nash (son of William and Mary Nash) to a Betsy Rothwell. 17 April 1915 among mums ancestry stuff-. and also a death cert for a John Robert Nash for 8th August 1965 (the informant being Betsy Nash widow of the deceased)….again among the stuff from mum. It all seems to tie up nicely …..
but am not sure now how accurate mums research was. :-S