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Are these Grace's siblings?
West Ham covers Leyton where May is said to be born and Albert born Hackney
Name: Mother's Maiden Surname:
CARNELL, ETHEL MAY COOPER
GRO Reference: 1896 M Quarter in WEST HAM Volume 04A Page 311
CARNELL, ALBERT HENRY COOPER
GRO Reference: 1898 S Quarter in HACKNEY Volume 01B Page 602
But why Grace with mmn Ellis.
Sometimes, depending on how the question was asked the maiden name of the Mother's Mother was given
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As Grace's Mum came from East Grinstead, could this then be the marriage of Grace's parents?
Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Dec 1892 (>99%)
Carnell Henry E. Grinstead 2b 297
ELLIS Harriet Ellen E. Grinstead 2b 297
HODGE George E. Grinstead 2b 297
Pattenden Adelaide Caroline E. Grinstead 2b 297
A tree on Ancestry has her Mother as Harriet Ellen Cooper HOWEVER -
the marriage certificate is on there and -
Married 25 Dec 1892 at St Swithuns Church, East Grinstead.
Henry 26 Bachelor Gardener, living in St Mary's, Leyton, Essex at time of marriage, son of James Carnell a deceased Labourer.
Harriet Ellen 21 spinster of East Grinstead no Father's name entered.
witnesses - Edith Kate Clifton and Robert Cooper
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Sadly+++++GUARD FOUND DEAD ON LINE GUARD FOUND DEAD ON LINE The body of a miway passenger guard, Jesse Folly Baldwin. area about 55. of Ramby. Ftetfard Nottinghamshire. was found, early today, on the line near Lula° Central Station. It is believed that he was over by a locomotive.
Halifax EvningCourier
10-June 1952.
and many other paper editions same date
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Again via the ancestry tree - the witness may well be her "Father". Harriet's Mother is shown as Jane Ellis 1855 - who married Robert Cooper in 1876 East Grinstead.
So married after Harriet's birth. Harriet has married under her birth name of Ellis, given that correctly for GRace's birth but used Coper for the earlier births as she would hab=ve known Robert Cooper most of her life as her Father. Perhaps he even was ??
i can't see a birth reg. for Harriet but registration was not fully legal until later in the 1870's
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Robert and Jane in 1891 - Harriet not with them but William and Thomas show on the Ancestry tree
1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census
22, Lower Glenvue Road, East Grinstead, Sussex, England
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Robert Cooper Head Married Male 37 1854 General labourer East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Jane Cooper Wife Married Female 37 1854 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
William J Cooper Son Single Male 14 1877 Paper boy East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Thomas J Cooper Son - Male 13 1878 Scholar East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Percy A Cooper Son - Male 9 1882 Scholar Oxted, Surrey, England
Sarah A Cooper Daughter - Female 7 1884 Scholar East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Emily E Cooper Daughter - Female 5 1886 Scholar East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Florrie K Cooper Daughter - Female 3 1888 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Frederick C Cooper Son - Male 0 1891 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
and 1881 when Harriet is with Robert and Jane
1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Merle Common, Oxted, Godstone, Surrey, England
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Robert Cooper Head Married Male 26 1855 Head farm lab East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Jane Cooper Wife Married Female 26 1855 Head farm lab wife East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Harriet E Elliss Daughter Single Female 8 1873 Scholar East Grinstead, Sussex, England
William J Cooper Son Single Male 4 1877 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Thomas J Cooper Son Single Male 3 1878 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
Allan R Cooper Son Single Male 1 1880 - East Grinstead, Sussex, England
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Grace in 1921. She is 20 years and 5 months old, b Stapleford, Essex. have submitted corrections.
1921 Census Of England & Wales
East Mangosted, Blanford Road, Reigate, Surrey, England
Household members (9 people)
First name(s) Last name Relationship to head Sex Birth year Age in years Birth place Occupation Employer
Sidney J Hose Head
Male 1886 35 Forest Gate, Essex, England Insurance Broker -
Violet Carrie Hose Wife
Female 1896 25 Hooe, Sussex, England - -
Robert Michael Hose Son
Male 1918 2 Reigate, Surrey, England - -
Peter Graham Hose Son
Male 1920 1 - - -
Alice F Wilson Visitor
Female 1867 54 London, Middlesex, England - -
Daisy Coldman Servant
Female 1893 27 Reigate, Surrey, England - Private
>>Grace Carnell Servant
Female 1891 30 Essex, England - Private
Sarah A Sharpe Servant
Female 1853 67 Sidlesham, Sussex, England - Private
Emily Bilton Servant
Female 1880 40 Kent, England - Private
and her parents
1921 Census Of England & Wales
Priory Farm, Nutfield, Charlwood, Surrey, England
Household members (2 people)
First name(s) Last name Relationship to head Sex Birth year Age in years Birth place Occupation Employer
Henry Carnell Head
Male 1866 54 London, England Stockman On Farm Private
Ellen Carnell Wife
Female 1873 48 East Grinstead, Sussex, England Home Duties -
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*First name(s) Grace Ellen Victoria
Spouse's father's last name Baldwin
*Last name Carnell
Spouse's father's occupation Carman
*Age 21
First witness Henry Curnell
*Birth year 1901
Second witness Ethel May Budd
*Marital status Spinster
Third witness Lilian Grace Baldwin
*Marriage year 1922
Fourth witness Thomas Alexander Pringler
*Marriage date 05 Sep 1922
County Surrey
*Marriage place Nutfield, Ss Peter & Paul
Country England
*Father's first name(s) Henry
Archive Surrey History Centre
*Father's last name Carnell
Archive reference P26/5/7
*Father occupation Bailiff
Register type Marriages
Spouse's first name(s) Jesse Folley
Year range 1837-1924
Spouse's last name Baldwin
Page 244
Spouse's age 26
Record set Surrey Marriages
Spouse's birth year 1896
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Spouse's occupation Railway Porter
Subcategory Parish Marriages
looking at the M/C he was resident Ranby, Notts and she was Priory Farm, Nutfield.
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Thank you again to alviegal, greyghost and to Kay for the sad bit of news
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