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thank you all

Henry wasn’t around to contradict anyone about what they gave as his occupation, as he had died many years earlier

As per Mary's post -

Ellen/Helen married Francis Smith in 1898 (Ancestry has image) and on 1901 census so probably didn't become Mary who married later that year

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census
14, Buckingham Street, St Marylebone, Marylebone, London & Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Francis R Smith Head Married Male 25 1876 Electric Shade Fitter Paddington, Middlesex, England
Helen Smith Wife Married Female 25 1876 - Wantage, Berkshire, England
Lilian F Smith Daughter Single Female 1 1900 - Marylebone, Middlesex, England
Emily Lord Visitor Single Female 21 1880 Housemaid Wantage, Berkshire, England

and
1911 Census For England & Wales
23 Sandringham Road Willesden Green N W, Willesden, Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Francis Richard Smith Head Married Male 36 1875 Shop Assistant Camps And Shade Dealers Paddington
Helen Smith Wife Married Female 36 1875 - Wantage Berkshire
Lilian Smith Daughter - Female 11 1900 - St Marylebone
James Fredrick Smith Son - Male 9 1902 - St Marylebone
Francis Leslie Smith Son - Male 7 1904 - St Marylebone
Doris Smith Daughter - Female 3 1908 - Willesden
Cyril George Smith Son - Male 1 1910 - Willesden

I am thinking that the Lord=Willoughby family is correct. However when Martha married she also said Henry was a Carpenter.

I wonder if Mary Elizabeth changed her name from Ellen Maria who was born 1874 ie the same date Mary Elizabeth gives.

1911 Emma said she had 13 children which matches the earlier census and the official records

Martha Lord 1883 married 1905 to Edward Tyler witness K Lord = Kate/Katherine1885
Dad Henry a carpenter

Ellen/Helen Lord 1875 married 1898 Francis L Smith actually middle name Richard witness E Lord dad Henry Lord a Forman in gas works

Emily lord in 1901 with Helen/Ellen Smith she also had a daughter Lilian like your Mary E
Henry Lord 1836-1885.

Maryb.

And that Mary is Mary J or Mary Jane rather than Mary Elizabeth in 1871/1881

LORD, MARY JANE WILLOUGHBY
GRO Reference: 1870 S Quarter in WANTAGE Volume 02C Page 296

Interestingly, 1891 records a family with sisters whose names match the witnesses.

Deceased father's name was Henry - but he was Labourer

MMN Willioughby

Wharf Cottages, Belmont, Wantage, Berkshire & Oxfordshire, England


Emma Lord Head Widow Female 47 1844 Charwoman Wantage, Berkshire, England
Henry Lord Son Single Male 16 1875 Striker For Smith At Iron Foundry Wantage, Berkshire, England
Thomas Lord Son Single Male 13 1878 Errand Boy Wantage, Berkshire, England
Frederick Lord Son Single Male 12 1879 Errand Boy Wantage, Berkshire, England
Emily Lord Daughter Single Female 10 1881 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Martha Lord Daughter Single Female 8 1883 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Kate Lord Daughter Single Female 6 1885 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England

Henry and Emma married in 1863,

Marriages Jun 1863 (>99%)
LORD Henry Wantage 2c 521
Willoughby Emma Wantage 2c 521

1871

Henry Lord Head - Male 35 1836 - Berkshire, England
Emma Lord Wife - Female 30 1841 - Berkshire, England
Charles Lord Son - Male 7 1864 - Berkshire, England
Louisa Lord Daughter - Female 5 1866 - Berkshire, England
James Lord Son - Male 2 1869 - Berkshire, England
Mary Jane Lord Daughter - Female 0 1871 - Berkshire, England

Mis-transcribed in 1881
Henry Low Head Married Male 45 1836 Labourer At Gas Works Wantage, Berkshire, England
Emma Low Wife Married Female 40 1841 - Wantage, Berkshire, England
Charles Low Son Single Male 20 1861 Ag Lab Wantage, Berkshire, England
James Low Son Single Male 16 1865 Ag Lab Wantage, Berkshire, England
Mary J Low Daughter Single Female 11 1870 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Henry Low Son Single Male 8 1873 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Ellen Low Daughter Single Female 6 1875 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Thomas Low Son Single Male 5 1876 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Frederick Low Son Single Male 4 1877 Scholar Wantage, Berkshire, England
Emily Low Daughter Single Female 1 1880 - Wantage, Berkshire, England

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Londwater, Sussex Gardens, Margate, Thanet, Kent, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Thomas Breame Bentler Head Married Male 37 1854 Private Tutor India
Maud Bentler Wife Married Female 40 1851 - Bedford, Bedfordshire, England
Gerald Oakley Bentler Son - Male 11 1880 Scholar Chudleigh, Devon, England
Sybil Burston Bentler Daughter - Female 8 1883 Scholar Australia
Charles Burston Bentler Son - Male 1 1890 - Bedford, Bedfordshire, England
Frederick Melburn Tutor Single Male 22 1869 - Leeds, Yorkshire, England
Ralph W Fremlin Boarder Single Male 16 1875 Scholar Teston, Kent, England
Reginald H Fremlin Boarder Single Male 15 1876 Scholar Ealing, Middlesex, England
Frances Wm Cobb Boarder Single Male 18 1873 Scholar Barnsley, Yorkshire, England
Joseph Bott Bende Boarder Single Male 16 1875 Scholar Whitby, Yorkshire, England
Frederick Demmery Wright Boarder Single Male 18 1873 Scholar Nottinghamshire, England
Frederick Macduff Boarder Single Male 16 1875 Scholar Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Stephen Harris Covernton Boarder Single Male 9 1882 Scholar Highbury, Middlesex, England
A G W Fremlin Boarder Single Male 17 1874 Scholar Teston, Kent, England
Arthur Randall Ledbetter Boarder Single Male 18 1873 Scholar Portsmouth, Hampshire, England
Annie Haynes Servant Single Female 28 1863 Domestic Servant Wootton, Bedfordshire, England
Mary Elizth Lord Servant Single Female 19 1872 Domestic Servant Reading, Berkshire, England<<<<<<<<<<
Margaret Ann Richards Servant Single Female 29 1862 Domestic Servant Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Florence Agnes Gurr Servant Single Female 23 1868 Domestic Servant Canonbury, Kent, England

1901
Name: Mary E Lord
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1874
Relation to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Reading, Berkshire, England ------------------
Civil Parish: Ramsgate
Search Photos: Search for 'Ramsgate' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

but 1911
21 Upper Grove Margate, Margate St John the Baptist, Kent, England

Report an Errorge Birth year Occupation Birth place
Richard Stringer Head Married Male 37 1874 Van Driver Mineral Water Manufacturer Littlebourne Nr Dover
Mary Stringer Wife Married Female 37 1874 - Wantage Berkshire -----------
Albert Stringer Son - Male 8 1903 - Margate
Frederick Stringer Son - Male 7 1904 - Margate
Lillian Stringer Daughter - Female 0 1911 - Margate

For our info - the 1901 census you refer to? Says born Reading

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Townley House, Ramsgate, Thanet, Kent, England

First name(s) Mary E
Last name Lord
Relationship Servant
Marital status Single
Sex Female
Age 27
Birth year 1874
Birth town Reading
Birth town as transcribed READING
Birth place England
Birth place other as transcribed -
Birth county Berkshire
Birth county as transcribed BERKSHIRE
Occupation Cook (Domestic)
House name Townley House
Archive reference RG13
Piece number 825
Folio 37
Page 21
Record set 1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census

Is this the 1901 to which you refer?

Name: Mary E Lord
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1874
Relation to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Reading, Berkshire, England
Civil Parish: Ramsgate
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
County/Island: Kent
Country: England

Until 1875, there were no penalties for not registering births.

Have you looked for the witnesses in census records?

Mary was born, according to the 1901 census, in Wantage Berks 1874. She was a cook in Ramsgate in 1901

Her marriage certificate 8/4/1901 to Richard Stringer in Margate tells us that her father was Henry, a carpenter. Emily and Martha Lord were witnesses

My problem is that I cannot find any record of her birth, nor is she in any other census.

Can you find what I can't please?

Gerry

Gerry