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10 Apr 2020 13:31 |
I am searching for more information about my Great (x2) grandfather William Howell. The only confirmed reference is his marriage to Livinia JENNINGS (b1839) in Rochester in 1864. On the cert he is recorded as being 29yrs old, a ships cook and his father's name is Evan. Evan is/was a cabinet maker. Evan is not recorded as deceased. I know that William fathered two sons in 1865 and 1868 but he then disappears again. His spouse went on to have more children by another man but there was no marriage.
I have searched for his birth record given the above info and found nothing. Neither does he definitely appear in any census returns before or after: not even 1861.
In case he lied about his age, I tried opening out the search to +/-5yrs but no luck. I also searched for a census entry with no male head. I found a couple but closer inspection showed them to be dead ends.
I then considered if he was a cook in the Royal Navy. I did find a ship's census return for a William HOWELL, but he was a bombardier. Further digging revealed his birth certificate but the wrong father.
I think I have exhausted the search in the UK and am now wondering if maybe he was born overseas. Of course he may have lied on his marriage certificate, but that's really a show-stopper.
Any advice on further UK search strategies is welcome. Also, if he was born overseas, how do I go about trying to find him?
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ErikaH
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10 Apr 2020 13:45 |
1871 census shows Lavinia as a Commercial Traveller's wife
She's been transcribed as Daughter to the head of the household, but she is sister-in-law
Her sister's marriage Name: Emma Jennings Gender: Female Record Type: Marriage Marriage Date: 6 May 1849 Marriage Place: St Giles without Cripplegate, City of London, England Father: Matthew Jennings Spouse: Jonathan Henry Hicks
Not the answer to your query about William, I know
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Maddie
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10 Apr 2020 14:28 |
not sure if this is relevant
Frederick Evan Last name Howell Age 27 Occupation Painter Marital status Bachelor Birth year 1869 Marriage year 1896 Marriage year 1896 Marriage date 08 Jun 1896 Marriage place Sittingbourne, Holy Trinity Father's first name(s) William Mathew Father's last name Howell Father occupation Cook ---------------- Spouse's first name(s) Florence Jane Spouse's last name Penney Spouse's birth year 1877 Spouse's age 19 Spouse's condition Spinster Spouse's father's occupation Ship Wright First witness William George Howell Second witness Elizabeth Geomans
FREDERICK EVAN Last name HOWELL Birth year 1869 Birth quarter 1 Registration month - Mother's maiden name Jennings District Camberwell County London Country England Volume 1D Page 629 Licence or banns Banns County Kent Country England Archive Kent History & Library Centre
could it be they are the same william and george who are with livinia in 1881 census
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ArgyllGran
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10 Apr 2020 15:51 |
Yes, that will be the correct Frederick Evan, Maddie.
Lavinia Howell in the 1871 England Census Name: Lavinia Howell [Lavinia Hick] Age: 32 Estimated birth year: 1839 Relation: Daughter Gender: Female Where born: St Mary Scilly Ireland Civil Parish: Minster Ecclesiastical parish: Minster Town: Sheerness County/Island: Kent Country: England Registration district: Sheppey Sub-registration district: Minster ED, institution, or vessel: 13g Household schedule number: 101 Piece: 987 Folio: 13 Page Number: 19 Household Members: Name Age Jonathon H W Hick 45 Emma Hick 44 Lavinia Howell 32 William Matthew Howell 5 Frederick May Howell 2 [ Frederick Ivan on image ]
HOWELL, WILLIAM MATTHEW mms JENNINGS GRO Reference: 1865 S Quarter in SHEPPEY Volume 02A Page 686
Evan Howell sounds like a Welsh name - though I don't see an Evan Howell who is a cabinet-maker. There's one who is a carpenter, but no sign of a William among his children in any census. That's this one, just for elimination:
Evan Howells in the 1841 Wales Census Name: Evan Howells Age: 35 Estimated birth year: abt 1806 Gender: Male Where born: Carmarthenshire, Wales Civil Parish: Llandebie Hundred: Iskennen County/Island: Carmarthenshire Country: Wales Street address: View image Occupation: View image Registration district: Llandilofawr Sub-registration district: Llandebie Neighbors: Piece: 1384 Book: 11 Folio: 5 Page Number: 1 Household Members: Name Age Evan Howells 35 Ann Howells 35 John Howells 15 Tubal Howells 14 David Howells 10 Thomas Howells 6 Mary Howells 3 Jestina Howells 1
He's also on 1851 and 1861 censuses.
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Unknown
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10 Apr 2020 16:05 |
Thanks for the responses. @Erikah - William has disappeared by 1871, but family sources say he was a commercial traveller. They also say he was killed in a fight, but no way of telling where or when. By then Lavinia was calling herself Lavinia Brace. I am in touch with the descendents on that branch and they insist Lavinia did not marry George Brace
@Maddie - I have Frederick Evan. He's my great grand uncle. His elder brother, William Matthew is my great grandfather.
@ArgylGran - I've pursued that lead of an Evan Howell but I can't see a link.
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Unknown
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10 Apr 2020 16:09 |
Oh, I also tried searching for William as "Evan William Howell"; just in case he was always called William in the family and used this when he married.
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ArgyllGran
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10 Apr 2020 16:09 |
???
William Howell in the Liverpool, England, Crew Lists 1861-1919 Name: William Howell Event Date: 1866 Port of Registry: Liverpool, Lancashire, England Ship Name: Virginia Official Number: 45170 Reference Number: 387CRE/837
He's a Chief Cook. Very good conduct and seamanship.
Voyage began 27 June 1866, going from Liverpool via Queenstown to New York, and back via Queenstown to Liverpool. No date of return given.
Could fit between the births of the two sons 1865 and 1869.
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ArgyllGran
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10 Apr 2020 16:15 |
You say Lavinia was calling herself Brace "by then" - when?? She's still calling herself Howell in 1881.
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Maddie
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10 Apr 2020 16:22 |
1881 19, Cage Lane, Chatham, Medway, Kent, England Thomas Brace Head Married Male 24 1857 Ship Carpenter Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales Lavina Brace Wife Married Female 24 1857 - Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales William Brace Son Single Male 0 1881 - Chatham, Kent, England
birth date rather out if thats the one
son WILLIAM JOHN Last name BRACE Birth year 1881 Birth quarter 1 Registration month - Mother's maiden name Richards ---------------- District Medway
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ArgyllGran
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10 Apr 2020 16:24 |
Lavinia Howell in the 1881 England Census Name: Lavinia Howell Age: 40 Estimated birth year: abt 1841 Relationship to Head: Sister Gender: Female Where born: Scilly Isles, Cornwall, England <<<<<<<<<<<< Civil Parish: Minster in Sheppey County/Island: Kent Country: England Street address: 4 Rose St Marital status: Widow Education: Employment status: View image Occupation: Needle Woman Registration district: Sheppey ED, institution, or vessel: 6 Neighbors: Piece: 978 Folio: 122 Page Number: 16 Household Members: Name Age Emma Hicks 50 Lavinia Howell 40 Will. Howell 15 Fredk. Howell 12 George Howell 2
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ArgyllGran
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10 Apr 2020 16:27 |
Birth of the son George;
HOWELL, WILLIAM GEORGE BRACE mms JENNINGS GRO Reference: 1878 S Quarter in SHEPPEY Volume 02A Page 869
William G B Howell in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007 Name: William G B Howell Death Age: 66 Birth Date: abt 1878 Registration Date: Oct 1944 [Nov 1944] [Dec 1944] Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Registration district: Sheppey Inferred County: Kent Volume: 2a Page: 1380
He also married on the Isle of Sheppey.
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ErikaH
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10 Apr 2020 16:46 |
1901 Name: Lavinia Howell Age: 62 Estimated birth year: abt 1839 Relation to Head: Sister Gender: Female Birth Place: Lcilly Irles, Cornwall, England Civil Parish: Sheerness Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul County/Island: Kent Country: England Registration district: Sheppey Sub-registration district: Minster ED, institution, or vessel: 09 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 813 Folio: 133 Page Number: 15 Household schedule number: 85 Household Members: Name Age Emma Hicks 74 Lavinia Howell 62 William Howell 22
1911 Name: Lavinia Howell Age in 1911: 72 Estimated birth year: abt 1839 Relation to Head: Mother Gender: Female Birth Place: Isles of Scilly, Cornwall Civil Parish: Sheerness County/Island: Kent Country: England Street address: 51 Maple Street, Sheerness Marital status: Widowed Registration district: Sheppey Registration District Number: 62 Sub-registration district: Minster ED, institution, or vessel: 05 Piece: 4455 Household Members: Name Age William Howell 32 Edith Howell 27 Ivy Howell 5 Hilda Howell 2 Lavinia Howell 72 Emma Hicks 84
Name: Lavinia Jennings Registration Year: 1839 Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar Registration district: Scilly Islands Inferred County: Cornwall Volume: 9 Page: 293
and finally..................
Name: Emma Hicks Gender: Female Age: 64 Relationship: Head Birth Year: 1827 Birth Place: Ireland Civil Parish: Minster in Sheppey Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul Residence Place: Sheerness, Minster in Sheppey, Kent, England Registration district: Sheppey Sub registration district: Minster ED, Institution or Vessel: 9 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 721 Folio: 21 Household Members: Name Age Emma Hicks 64 Louisa Howell 52 George B Howell 12
Not once does she appear under the surname Brace
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alviegal
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10 Apr 2020 17:45 |
England & Wales Government Probate Death Index 1858-2019
First name(s) William George Bruce (written as Bruace) Last name Howell Death year 1944 Death date 23 Dec 1944 Probate year 1945 Probate date 23 Feb 1945 Residence town Sheerness Registry Llandudno County Kent Linked persons Edith Olive Howell
I think you should probably get a copy of William's birth certificate to see who his father is.
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Unknown
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12 Apr 2020 10:46 |
Thanks for all the wonderful digging.
@erikah I have seen family letters in which she starts to refer to herself as Lavinia Brace. She moved to Glasgow in about 1915 and died there in 1918.
@argyllgran - That's an interesting find and would put him in the merchant navy rather than royal. I've not searched those records before. Where can I access them?
@alviegal That's what I trying to get to. Unfortunately, I can't find a record of his birth anywhere. His marriage cert says his father is Evan. William George Bruace/Bruce Howell is actually William George Brace, the illegitimate son of Lavinia and George Brace. At various times he is referred to as BRACE or HOWELL. I know his descendants and have seen their letters.
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ErikaH
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12 Apr 2020 11:36 |
I posted what was there
Her death
HOWELL LAVINIA 78 1918 644/12 7 Hillhead
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ArgyllGran
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12 Apr 2020 12:25 |
The record I posted from the crew list is on Ancestry, Gareth, under "Immigration and Travel".
Re William's birth, bear in mind that it wasn't compulsory to register a child's birth at that time, and many people didn't. If a child wasn't baptised, or if the records haven't survived, there will be no record to find. Could be just one of those unresolved mysteries which we all have in our trees!
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Unknown
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12 Apr 2020 15:16 |
@ErikaH Ihave a lot of info on Lavinia's life and ancestry: including her death cert and photos of the grave. I'm picking up from where my mother got to in her researches. She travelled all over the UK and Germany researching Howell, Stiltz and Dunn. No internet searching for her! I recall spending ages (to me) searching indexes in Somerset House when I was a child.
@ArgyllGran Thanks for that. I do some digging.
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Unknown
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13 Apr 2020 13:31 |
@ArgyllGran I don't think that is my William. He appears on the lists for the SS Virginia on several occasions. I found the Ship's Log with him signing on but his age is recorded as 48, making his DoB sometime around 1820-21 - 15 years before the William I am looking for. In another, earlier, one he is recorded as being 45.
Thanks for the lead though.
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