Find Ancestors

There are very partial censuses for 1841 and 1851 - much was destroyed.

Available here:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

I don't see Michael or Patrick on either census.
And no Larners or Lamers.

What Irish census are available. If Michael married in 1862 I wonder if there is a census before then with Michael and Patrick on ? Or am I just clutching at straws
Thanks again every one for your help
Linda x

Perhaps Michael and Sabina were just visiting in 1874 for the baptism.
Looks like we will never know the connection to Patrick o'neill.

If they lived their lives in Ireland, and died before 1901, they won't appear on censuses.


Following on from that 1862 marriage in Ballina, posted by Dea - I think this is the same Sabina /Sibby:


Sabina O'Neill
in the Ireland, Civil Registration Deaths Index, 1864-1958
Name: Sabina O'Neill
Estimated birth year: abt 1838
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1922
Death Age: 84
Registration district: Ballina
Volume: 4
Page: 1
FHL Film Number: 101735


Sabina Oneill
in the Web: Ireland, Census, 1911
Name: Sabina Oneill
Gender: Female
Age: 73
Birth Year: abt 1838
Relation to Head: Mother
Residence Date: 2 Apr 1911
Townland/Street: Knockegan and Cloonagh Beg
District: Ballina Rural
County: Mayo
Household Members:
Name Age
John Oneill 45
Bridget Oneill 29
Elizabeth Oneill 2
Sabina Oneill 73

Bern trying to find Michael and Sabina on a census but not much luck

Sarah's sister Mary's baptism, though it doesn't match the age given in 1911 census:

Mary Larner
in the Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915
Name: Mary Larner
Baptism Age: 0
Event Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 1833
Baptism Date: 22 May 1833
Baptism Place: Tuam, Galway, Ireland
Diocese: Tuam
Father: John Larner
Mother: Margaret Coney

Could this be Michael and Sabina???

Name: Michl O'Neil
Marriage Date: 26 Dec 1862
Marriage Place: Ardnaree, Mayo, Ireland
Other Parish Name: Ballina
Spouse: Sibby Langan
Witnesses John Timlin ?? and Mary Clarke
It looks like 'TUAM' is written after the names ?

Dea x

Dea and ArgyllGran

Thank you so much.
I appreciate all the help I get from you guys.

I'm working late tonight so wont be home till after 9.
I will check in on my break and if I find anything or remember anything I'll let you know

Many many thanks
Linda x

Gosh, I have been chasing Langan, O'neills and Larners all night in my dreams - I am exhausted.................................. I have several hundreds of the little beggars now and still can't fit them all together !

I am back on the case now............................. speak later!!

Dea x

Still no further ahead with Michael O'Neill and Sabina O'Neill. These O'Neill's are a nightmare :-\

It certainly does look that way.
What a tangled web
Thank you

So Catherine may have been a sister of Sarah, if the 1841 baptism I posted above is Sarah's ???

Cath Larnar
in the Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915
Name: Cath Larnar
Baptism Age: 0
Event Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 1831
Baptism Date: 16 May 1831
Baptism Place: Tuam, Galway, Ireland
Diocese: Tuam
Father: John Larnar
Mother: Margt Carney

just found this

this is the toole family that sarah and her parents lodged with in 1851 and then lived next door to in 1861

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1850
Surname
Forename(s)
Surname
Forename(s)
Church / Register Office
Registers At
Reference
LAMER
Catharine
TOOLE
Thomas
Leigh Register Office or Registrar Attended
Wigan & Leigh
ROL/2/168

All I know about Margaret Carney before she married Patrick O'Neill is her father was John Carney and her mother was Mary O'Gara

Does this fit in anywhere ??

The document is damaged so that the sex and first name of the child can't be seen.

Sarah Larner/Roach was born c1841, and her mother's name was Margaret, per 1881 census.

By coincidence Margaret Carney was Patrick O'Neill's mother's name , but I suppose there would be a lot of intermarrying of families in a rural area at that time, and the same names cropping up over and over.

Larner
in the Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915
Name: Larner
Baptism Age: 0
Event Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 1841
Baptism Date: 14 Nov 1841
Baptism Place: Tuam, Galway, Ireland
Diocese: Tuam
Father: John Larner
Mother: Mag Carney

Sarah Roach nee Larner had a sister Mary - but I can't see her birth or marriage either.

Sarah Roach
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Sarah Roach
Age in 1911: 69
Estimated birth year: abt 1842
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Tuan Co of Galway, Ireland
Civil Parish: Leigh
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address: 8 Albert Dukenfield St Leigh
Marital status: Widowed
Occupation: At Home Parish Pay
Registration district: Leigh
Registration District Number: 460
Sub-registration district: Culcheth
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Piece: 23195
Household Members:
Name Age
Sarah Roach 69
Mary Leigh 74 - sister, widow, Tuam, Galway
Alice Mannion 37 - niece, widow, Leigh





??? (Probably not the one below - ages too far out )

Mary Lee
in the 1901 England Census
Name: Mary Lee
Age: 58
Estimated birth year: abt 1843
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Co Fudus, Ireland [ image says "Tuam", I think ]
Civil Parish: Bolton
Ecclesiastical parish: Bolton le Moors Emmanuel
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:
Registration district: Bolton
Sub-registration district: Great Bolton
ED, institution, or vessel: 16
Neighbors:
Piece: 3626
Folio: 47
Page Number: 52
Household schedule number: 332
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary Lee 58
Alice Lee 29 - daughter, Leigh, single, cotton weaver.
Edward Lee 13 - grandson, Leigh

I don't see Edward's birth to check mms.

I had forgotten all about these records. A friend got them for me when she visited the Lancashire records Office some years ago

Dea

Also grandads sister Bridget sometimes known as Delia

her godparents are PETER AND SARAH ROCHE/ROACH


Baptism
24 Feb 1889 • Leigh Lancashire
Bridget O'Neill Parents Patrick and Margaret Priest H. Cowell SJ Godparents Petrus ( Peter ) Roach and Sara Roach

Dea

Also the baptism records of my grandads sister Margaret Ann known as Polly

Again Edward and Sarah Roache/Roach

Baptism
24 Jun 1881 • Leigh Lancashire
Father Patrick O'Neill Mother Margaret Carney Priest Jacobus Fanning Godparents Edward Roche ( Roach ) and Sara Roche

Dea
Ive just found I had the baptism records of my grandads brother Patrick O'Neill known as paddy

Baptism
16 May 1880 • Leigh Lancashire
Catherine and Patrick O'Neill ( Twins ) Patricus O'Neill Father Patrick O'Neill Mother Margaret Carney Priest Jacob Fanning SJ Godparents Edward Roche ( Roach) and Sophia O'Neill

one of the godparents has the surname ROCHE / ROACH

so the marriage of sarah and peter roach might be the one

what do you think ?

I have no idea who Sophia O'Neill was

Linda x