Find Ancestors

That’s great Greyghost. Thank you
Glyn

And whilst a common name, a possibility for John

Glamorganshire Baptisms

First name(s) John
Last name Davies
Birth year 1833
Birth date ? ? 1833
Baptism year 1833
Baptism date 17 Dec 1833
Place Llansamlet
County Glamorganshire
Country Wales
Father's first name(s) Thomas
Mother's first name(s) Elizabeth
Page 193
Record set Glamorganshire Baptisms
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Parish Baptisms
Collections from Wales, Great Britain

from image - Father a Collier

Marriage cert shows Margaret resident at Pentreengine which fits with 1851 census address of Pentre Engine.

Marriage cert. shows Father as John Roberts a Smith

Witnesses John and Thomas Roberts

Although the marriage certificate shows her as aged 22 so born c1834 the census appear to show her as b 1836/37 so am wondering about this -

1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census
White Pit, Llansamlet, Lower, Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales

First name(s) Last name Sex Age Birth year Birth place
Elizabeth William Female 45 1796 Glamorgan, Wales
John Robert Male 13 1828 Glamorgan, Wales Smith
Thomas Robert Male 11 1830 Glamorgan, Wales Driver
Margaret Robert Female 5 1836 Glamorgan, Wales
Elizabeth Robert Female 2 1839 Glamorgan, Wales

1841 census gives no relationships but probably can assume the Robert children are siblings?

Whilst her Father could still be a John and a Smith it would not be unusual to name an older brother as "Father" to save face etc. Here John is a Smith as per occupation of the Father on Marriage cert.

???
Possibly John and Margaret in 1851, but neither with parents unfortunately

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Pentre Engine Higher, Llansamlet, Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John Lewis Head Married Male 50 1801 Coal Miner Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
Margaret Lewis Wife Married Female 54 1797 - Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
Evan Lewis Son Unmarried Male 20 1831 Coal Miner Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
John Lewis Son Unmarried Male 17 1834 Coal Miner Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
Thomas Lewis Son Unmarried Male 13 1838 Coal Miner Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
John Davies Step Son Unmarried Male 17 1834 Coal Miner Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales
Margaret Roberts Servant Unmarried Female 18 1833 Servant In Dore Llansamlet, Glamorgan, Wales

Well that’s fantastic . Thanks to Grey ghost, Mary, And Argyllgran. I’m sure this is the same family, and I’m delighted to have that connection sorted out so I can carry on with that thread of the family.
You’ve even found the next generation back as well, ie Ceridwens grandparents, which I didn’t expect.
I knew you could help.
Many thanks
Glyn

???

Deaths Mar 1881 (>99%)
DAVIES John 49 Bridgend 11a 339

???
Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Mar 1856 (>99%)
Davies John Neath 11a 514
Jenkins Mary Neath 11a 514
Roberts Margaret Neath 11a 514
Sims William Neath 11a 514

------------------------------------

which would be this OPR

Glamorganshire Marriages And Banns

First name(s) John
Last name Davies
Age 23
Birth year 1833
Event year 1856
Banns year -
Marriage year 1856
Marriage date 02 Feb 1856
Marriage place Llansamlet, Glantawe
Father's first name(s) Thomas
Father's last name Davies
Spouse's first name(s) Margaret
Spouse's last name Robert
Spouse's age 22
Spouse's birth year 1834
Spouse's father's last name Robert
Spouse's father's first name(s) John
County Glamorganshire
Country Wales
Event Marriage
Page 36
Record set Glamorganshire Marriages And Banns
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Parish Marriages
Collections from Wales, Great Britain

From original -
John - Bachelor - a Collier - residence at Glanwern at time of marriage. Father a Collier
Margaret - spinster resident at ? Pentrerengine. Father a Smith

For any Robert on transcript read Roberts on original

By banns.
Both made their mark
Witnesses - John Roberts signed and Thomas Roberts his mark

???

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Pentre Cawl, Llansamlet, Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John Davies Head Married Male 29 1832 Hulter man Llansamlet, Glamorgan
Margaret Davies Wife Married Female 27 1834 Hulter Man Wife Llansamlet, Glamorgan
Margaret Davies Daughter - Female 3 1858 - -
Ann Davies Daughter - Female 1 1860 - -
Elizabeth Davies Daughter - Female 0 1861 - -

All children said the be born Llansamlet

Ann ? Sarah A in 1871

I can't read what John's occupation is, but don't think it's "Hulter" man

These 2 census should show that these are the same family (unfortunately Ceridwen shown only as 'C')

Father John is a Coalminer 1871, deceased by 1881 and therefore fits the Marriage certificate name / occupation / deceased

Ceridwen age 4 1881 right age for 26 at marriage.

Links with the Williams family 1881 through 1901

Sister 'Mattie' and then a daughter 'Mattie'

Brother Albert/ Herbert witness at marriage shown 1881 / 1891 census

Fathers are named and occupation given on marriage certifiicates along with whether deceased or not (open to wrong completion) but there will be no mention of his address or age.

I think you have enough evidence to confirm this is your family but you need to decide for yourself.

The 1871 she referred to when Father John is with family -

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Tynewydd Row, Langeinor, Bridgend, Glamorganshire, Wales

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John Davies Head - Male 38 1833 - Monmouthshire, Wales - Coalminer
Margaret Davies Wife - Female 35 1836 - Glamorgan, Wales
Sarah A Davies Daughter - Female 12 1859 - Glamorgan, Wales
Eliza J Davies Daughter - Female 9 1862 - Glamorgan, Wales
Margaret Davies Daughter - Female 7 1864 - Glamorgan, Wales
Herbert Davies Son - Male 5 1866 - Glamorgan, Wales
Martha Davies Daughter - Female 0 1871 - Glamorgan, Wales

Mary posted this 1881 census earlier

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
2, Commercial Street, Llangeinor, Bridgend, Glamorganshire, Wales

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Margaret Davies Head Widow Female 44 1837 - Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
Elizabeth J Davies Daughter Single Female 19 1862 - Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
Albert Davies Son Single Male 15 1866 Engineer Artiz Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
Martha Davies Daughter Single Female 11 1870 Scholar Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
Thomas Davies Son Single Male 8 1873 Scholar Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
C Davies Daughter Single Female 4 1877 - Llangeinor, Glamorganshire, Wales
David Williams Boarder Single Male 19 1862 Coal Miner Merthyr, Glamorganshire, Wales
Henery Williams Boarder Single Male 15 1866 Coal Miner Merthyr, Glamorganshire, Wales

And made the following comments -

Elizabeth J married David Williams
Think Albert is Herbert on 1871 census
Martha - Mattie on 1901 census

Right so the Marriage Certificate came today.
They married 11th April 1903 in a church called Ruhamah? Baptist church in Bridgend.
CERIDWEN is 26 years old and a school teacher. She lives in 9a, Corbett Street, Ogmore Vale, and John has been living in 21 Glyn Street, Ogmore Vale. He’s assistant schoolmaster.
CERIDWEN father is given as John Davies, deceased. He was a Collier.
One of the witnesses is Herbert Davies ( possibly a brother or uncle?) and the other is Margaret Ann Williams ( one of Ceridwens sisters marries a Williams from Mary’s post.
That’s all the information as far as I can see.
I think that helps but no mention of where John Davies lived or age he died on the marriage certificate.
Glyn

Yes, I’ve just looked back at that. I think I meant same place, ie Welsh town, not address. My apologies Grey ghost

Ahh! - you said you had her at the same address 1891 and 1901 in your OP

If she knew her father, his name will certainly be on her marriage cert

Hi everyone,
Sorry for delay in answering your questions.
So, on the 1939 census that is definitely Ceridwen. I’ve been to the house and spoken to the neighbours, so it’s correct.
The 1891 census found by Tiggit is also her. She was a servant in the Rees household.
I then had a gap in the censuses until she married John Milton Churchill, and the 1911 census is correct. She was living with her husband and family in Tregare .
Thank you Greyghost. You have found the 1901 census, and I’m sure that is correct, because John M Churchill was headmaster at Tregare f, and Ceridwen taught the infants. That would tie in with her being an elementary teacher in 1901. It’s interesting that Ceridwen calls her daughter Mattie, and her sister was Martha, known as Mattie, so that’s another link.
So yes to 1901 and 1911 censuses you found Greyghost.
I’m sure you’re on the right track too Mary with the 1871, 1881 and 1911 censuses for Margaret Davies.
It looks as though Ceridwen’s father died between 1871 and 1881, but he may well be on the marriage certificate.
Yes, I’ll send off for it, and Yes I’ll definitely post what I find.
Thank you all so much. It’s a minefield with Davies in Welsh censuses!!
But I think you’ve found the right ones, and the marriage certificate should verify it.
Great work,
Glyn

Which of the census posted are the correct ones - you haven't answered the questions posed. If my 1901 is right, not finding her in 1891 at that address. Can you post?

Please come back to this thread Glyn when you have the certificate and post all the information from it.

Wow you are all amazing. Some great leads there, and as you rightly say, now I have some ideas I will get the marriage certificate to be sure.
Thanks very much

As already posted ................

you're going to have buy the marriage certificate to get the information on her father (if he is on there). Plus the witnesses might be family members.

This is the ONLY way to be sure.

£11 from GRO

Was looking at that one Mary, but had to go out very soon after posting the 1901/1911 so no time to follow through and post.

Marriage certificate needed as others have already said.