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Generally speaking, post 1920 & WW2 records are still with the MOD. They cost £30 for a copy to be sent to you. Unless you're sure of the A.G.Luke relationship, it probably isn't worth it.

This is the link for obtaining UK service records:
http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/service_records.html

Although it might have been previously mentioned, you should be aware that about 70% of WW1 records were destroyed during WW2 bombing.

Sounds likely to be him. I've requested the marriage certificate from 1918 so I'll come back to this line of enquiry in a few weeks when it arrives. Fingers crossed for something useful in that.

On another note, my mother just dug out a treasure trove of old photos and other documents relating to relatives of her mother. Membership cards to social clubs, postcards from a soldier to his wife from France just before the first world war. All kinds of things. I have two questions for you experts about your own experience, if that's ok with you?

- What do you guys do with old photos of people where you have no idea who they are? Do you just keep them in a folder somewhere? I can't bear to bin them as they'd be fascinating to their descendants. Even if I have no way of knowing who they are to get them to those descendants. They are very old so no living relatives to ask questions of who would know. There are some great photos, very old.

- Military stuff. How much is it possible to get for free before subscribing to databases? For example, there is a pamphlet by the War Office, 9th June, 1943 with PTE A.G. Luke and number 14152742 on it. It's a RAMC training pamphlet which is interesting in itself. However, I want to work out what my grandfather was enlisted to do exactly. Should I subscribe to a more expensive version of Ancestry for this kind of info or is it possible to get some basic info first without subscribing to get the full details. Advice greatly appreciated as always.

sorry, I know this is off topic from the Florence Marshall and Elizabeth Jacques query

Best

It would be interesting to see what details she has on the 1918 marriage- see if it gives us anymore clues.

It's possible this was the Charles she married:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Bramall Yard Hackenthorpe Near Sheffield, Beighton, Derbyshire, England

Harry Barker Head Married Male 35 1876 Derbys Hackenthorpe Coal Miner Hewer
Agnes Sarah Barker Wife Married Female 34 1877 - -
Joseph Frederick Palmer Nephew - Male 12 1899 - -
Charles Richardson Brother Single Male 37 1874 Derbys Hackenthorpe Coal Miner Hewers Filler
-----------------------

Agnes was his sister- in 1918 Agnes and Harry were living at 6 Bark Yard, Hackenthorpe (On William Marshall's medal card, Elizabeth is noted as living at 12 Bark Yard, Hackenthorpe)

It's been fantastic to find out more about my great grandfather William Barber Marshall. It's been very frustrating to find my great grandmother to still be so elusive. I'm assuming that her father is the Luke everyone mentions above, but still can't find a way to prove it. And I still can't find a birth entry for her to find out who her mother was. Perhaps this isn't her real birth name, her biological father or her real date of birth. Very difficult even to narrow down which birth certificates to order as there is no one that looks particularly likely to be her.

On the plus side, if our Luke above is her father, then I have a lot of information about him and his family now thanks to you guys, plus some other public trees on Ancestry. But none of them mention our Elizabeth. Perhaps because she's illegitimate or perhaps not her real father at all. Need to take a break as I'm at that point where it gets frustrating and you need to come back to it later. I think I'll order her second marriage certificate to see if her dob is different from that.

Thanks again for all your help so far.

I’ve just been trying to get to the bottom of this family and all the links. Very complicated! I’ll keep working at getting my head around the possibilities. So much detailed information here. I’m very grateful to you all

This could be unrelated, I can't find any immediate connections, so it may all be coincidence.

I was looking at this 1939 register below (Elizabeth was listed as born c1884 on her marriage to William Marshall- I'd be interested to see what her age was on her second marriage to Charles Richardson):

1939
Richardson Household 40 Stanley Street West , Tynemouth C.B., Northumberland, England
Elizabeth Richardson 16 Apr 1884 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married

At the same address are:
George Brown 1909 married
Elizabeth Brown 1916 married
Charles Jackson 1876 Widowed
George Marshall 1865 Married
Catherine Soulsby Marshall (Johnson) 1884 Married
---------------------------------------

Charlotte- wife of Luke had maiden name Thompson.
Thompson was also Catherine Soulsby's maiden name.
Catherine's father was Thomas John Thompson

Birth:
THOMPSON, THOMAS JOHN mmn: HALL
GRO Reference: 1843 D Quarter in TYNEMOUTH UNION Volume 25 Page 396

I think his parents were James and Mary.

But then there is this possible birth for Charlotte- I suspect James and Mary were too old to be the parents of Charlotte too- but interesting they have the same mother's maiden name.

Birth:
THOMPSON, CHARLOTTE mmn: HALL
GRO Reference: 1868 J Quarter in TYNEMOUTH Volume 10B Page 226
-----------------------------

There is also a George Marshall in the household- Marshall being the name of Elizabeth's first husband, and also Browns in the house- Elizabeth's mother remarried a Brown.

They are of course common surnames within the area. I have to go to work- I'm running late. I'll have another look tomorrow if nothing is found.

Saw below...(apologies if already added)

Chris :)

National School Admission Registers & Log-books 1870-1914 Transcription (Find My Past)

First name(s) Lizzie
Last name Jacques
Birth year 1896
Birth date 20 Jul 1896
Event year 1903 (2/11/03)
School name Holywell County First School
Town Holywell
County Northumberland
Parent name(s) Luke
Book type Admissions
(Address, 44, Middle Row)


(also, Charlotte Born 28/4/1901, Emily Born 13/11/1898)


1939 Register (Find My Past)

16 Holywell Dene Road , Seaton Valley U.D., Northumberland,
Emily Jacques 13 Nov 1898 Female Shop Manageress (Cleaners & Dyers) Single
George Brown 09 Jan 1869 Male Colliery Hewer (Retired) Married
Charlotte Brown 09 May 1868 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married


Marriages Sep 1938 (>99%)
---------------------------------------------------------------
Brown George Jacques Nthmbld.S. 10b 569
Jacques Charlotte Brown Nthmbld.S. 10b 569


Deaths Mar 1929 (>99%)
-----------------------------------------------------
Jacques Luke 64 Tynemouth 10b 398


Births Sep 1864 (>99%)
------------------------------------------------
JACKS Luke Tynemouth 10b 198

No worries- it'll still be here! Just adding stuff as I see it- I probably wont be around much tomorrow, but I'll check in over next few days.

Hackenthorpe was originally in Beighton, Derbyshire (and later Sheffield)- there is a possible birth of another child Leonard in Chesterfield (Derbyshire) 1919. I haven't got the time to look into it any further at the moment.

It's possible that, as her daughters married in Northumberland, Elizabeth moved back to the Tynemouth area. Unless she left her daughters in the care of relatives?

Ah, she becomes Richardson and moves to Sheffield. Desperate to get on with this research but I’m out with family today

The medal card of William Marshall also has a little more info on the reverse:

Mrs E Richardson applies for '1914 Star' in respect of her late husband Sgt W Marshall. (no date)

Address: 12 Bark Yard, Hackenthorpe nr Sheffield

A little more information. On the UK, Army Registers of Soldiers' Effects on Ancestry war gratuity was sent to Elizabeth in 1919- by this time she had remarried and was Elizabeth Richardson.

Most likely this marriage:

First name(s) ELIZABETH
Last name MARSHALL
Marriage quarter 4
Marriage year 1918
Spouse: Charles Richardson
Spouse's last name Richardson
District Tynemouth
County Northumberland
Volume 10B
Page number 377

Might be an idea to get this marriage certificate for your research.

Quick question - do families of that era usually call their children the same Christian names? Possibly a different mother for our Elizabeth though. I’ll comw back to this this evening

Hi all. Fascinating stuff! I’m out all day today but will look at this properly when I get time this evening. I really do appreciate your help! I love this!!

And these Jacques at the address on the CWGC in 1911:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
16 Middle Row Bates Cottages Holywell Seaton Delaval S O Northd, Holywell, Northumberland, England

Luke Jacques Head Married Male 46 1865 Northumberland Earsdon Coal Miner Hewer
Charlotte Jacques Wife Married Female 42 1869 Northumberland Cramlington -
Florence Jacques Daughter Single Female 16 1895 Northumberland Earsdon -
Elizabeth Jane Jacques Daughter Single Female 14 1897 Northumberland Earsdon -
Emily Jacques Daughter Single Female 12 1899 Northumberland Earsdon School
Charlotte Jacques Daughter Single Female 9 1902 Northumberland Earsdon School
Lilian Alexander Jacques Daughter Single Female 2 1909 Northumberland Earsdon
---------------------------

AG discounted the above Elizabeth- but, given the address, it seems likely this family were related somehow.

The George living at 16 Middle Row in 1939, was the brother of Luke who was living at the same address in 1911:

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
North Row, Holywell, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England

George Jacques Head - Male 39 1832 - Northumberland, England
Elizabeth Jacques Wife - Female 33 1838 - Northumberland,
Guy Warwick Adopted Don - Male 20 1851 - Northumberland,
Jane Jacques Daughter - Female 11 1860 - Northumberland, England
Dorothy Jacques Daughter - Female 9 1862 - Durham, England
Luke Jacques Son - Male 6 1865 - Northumberland, England
Thomas Jacques Son - Male 4 1867 - Northumberland,
Elizabeth Jacques Daughter - Female 0 1871 - Northumberland,
---------------------------------------

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
23, Geo St East, Tunstall, Sunderland, Durham, England

George Jacques Head Married Male 49 1832 Northumberland Heath, Coal Miner
Elizabeth Jacques Wife Married Female 43 1838 Durham, Durham,
Dorothy Jacques Daughter Single Female 19 1862 Northumberland Heath, Domestic
Luke Jacques Son Single Male 16 1865 Northumberland Heath, Coalminer
Thomas Jacques Son Single Male 14 1867 Northumberland Heath, Coalminer
Elizabeth Jacques Daughter Single Female 10 1871 Northumberland Heath, Scholar
George Jacques Son Single Male 4 1877 Northumberland Heath, Scholar
Guy Warwick Boarder Head Married Male 23 1858 Northumberland Coal Miner
Elizabeth Warwick Wife Married Female 22 1859 Durham, Durham,

Interestingly there are Jacques at the address in 1939 (wonder if they are possible relatives of Elizabeth?)

1939
Jacques Household (2 People) 16 Middle Row , Seaton Valley U.D., Northumberland, England

George Jacques 09 Apr 1876 Male Colliery Stone Below Heavy Worker Married
Clara Jacques 09 Mar 1890 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married
--------------------------------

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Top Row, Holywell, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England
George Jacques Head Married Male 59 1832 Northumberland, England Coal Miner
Elizabeth Jacques Wife Married Female 53 1838 Northumberland, England -
Elizabeth Jacques Daughter Single Female 20 1871 Northumberland, England Greengrocers Assistant
George Jacques Son Single Male 14 1877 Northumberland, England Scholar

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
2, Church Row, Holywell, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England
George Jacques Head Married Male 69 1832 Northumberland, Miner Coal Wasteman
Elizabeth Jacques Wife Married Female 63 1838 Northumberland, -
George Jacques Son Single Male 24 1877 Walbottle, Northumberland, Miner Coal Hewer

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
2 Church Row Bates Cottages Holywell Seaton Delaval S O Northd, Holywell, Northumberland, England
Elizabeth Jacques Head Widow Female 73 1838 Whitley Hillheads Northd -
George Jacques Son Married Male 34 1877 Blutcher Pit Wallbottle Northd Coal Miner Hewer
Clara Jacques Daughter Married Female 21 1890 Bates Cottages Northd

William's first marriage was 1895
:
Marriages Dec 1895
Brown Anna Bella Tynemouth 10b 385 <<<<<<<<<
Marshall William Barber Tynemouth 10b 385 <<<<<<<<<
Robinson David Tynemouth 10b 385
Webster Charlotte Jane Tynemouth 10b 385
---------------------------------------------

William died WW1:

Serjeant MARSHALL, WILLIAM BARBER

Birth year 1876
Age 41
Death date 22 Aug 1917
Number 43580
Rank Sergeant
Unit "a" Bty. 180th Bde.
Regiment Royal Field Artillery
Grave reference V. B. 5.
Cemetery or memorial Mendinghem Military Cemetery
Burial country Belgium

Additional information Husband of E. Marshall, of 16, Middle Row, Bates Cottages, Seaton Delaval, Northumberland.

https://www.cwgc.org/find/find-war-dead
--------------------------

Just for the record, there are no Jacques or Marshalls in Tyne Street in 1911.

Looking again at the marriage certificate, it clearly says Longlass, but given that they have spelt Elizabeth's name Jacks, they probably made a mistake. I can understand why they used his address for the purpose of the banns, or perhaps they were staying there. But Florence's birth certificate also has that address. This is so fascinating. Thanks for all your help. Tricky to find information post 1911 of course, except the 1939 register, but your detective skills have given me a few more clues to ponder.

You guys are all really good at this! I'm spending a couple of hours now looking into some of your findings. ErikaH, the potential sister in Lowestoft is exciting. I'll look into that one now. Then I'll look into the Longstaff lead too.

Austin Q, his marriage certificate says bachelor, but I too had noticed he is a widower at 25 in the census.

Well found AG- couldn't see address on FMP- but now knowing, here's the fmp version:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
36 Tyne St No Shields, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England

John Longstaff Head Married Male 34 1877 Usworth Durham Coal Miner Hewer
Selina Longstaff Wife Married Female 24 1887 South Shields
John William Longstaff Son - Male 4 1907 Sunderland
George Longstaff Son - Male 2 1909 Sunderland

Just having dinner now.

For reference- WIlliam was a widower when he married?

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
1, Queens Terrace, North Shields, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England

Robert Hindmarsh Head Married Male 40 1861 North Shields, Northumberland, Ship Stoker
Phillis Hindmarsh Wife Married Female 36 1865 North Shields, Northumberland,
Agnes O Brien Daughter Single Female 15 1886 North Shields, Northumberland,
Margaret A O Brien Daughter Single Female 11 1890 North Shields, Northumberland
William O Brien Son Single Male 9 1892 North Shields, Northumberland,
Sarah O Brien Daughter Single Female 8 1893 North Shields, Northumberland,
William B Marshal Brother Widower Male 25 1876 North Shields, Northumberland Ship Yard Labourer
-----------------------------

William was half brother to Phillis (nee Dodds).

births:
MARSHALL, WILLIAM BARBER mmn: BROWN
GRO Reference: 1875 S Quarter in TYNEMOUTH Volume 10B Page 184

DODDS, PHILLIS mmn: BROWN
GRO Reference: 1865 M Quarter in TYNEMOUTH Volume 10B Page 163