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Catherine was living in Wallsend with eldest son John 1911....

James had married Annie McCardle in 1897 and was living Shiremoor..their eldest son William b 1897 was killed on The Somme..1916 CWGC site also on Shiremoor Memorial.


This side of the family is reasonably easy to locate.
.Although 1891 Census gives Jane's age as 30 a probable birth 1870 in Scotland shows she should be 20...
Jane Mclay
Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950


birth:

6 October 1870

CAMBUSLANG, LANARK, SCOTLAND


father:

Dennis Mclay


mother:

Catherine Mechan *****(Ireland as place of birth(1891) more likely with this or variables to surname

Death...1896

McClay Jane 24 Tynemouth 10b 154

Maybe Catherine McLay's death ?:


Deaths Jun 1913 (>99%)
Mcclay Catherine 76 Tynemouth 10b 232

Theresa....

Mary's Mother Catherine was living in West Row Backworth 1891...

Catherine McClay 58 Widow b Ireland
John McClay 31 Coalminer b Scotland
Jane McClay 30 single..no occ. b Scotland
James McClay17 Coaminer b.Scotland


I am not sure about Cath.being b. Ireland her maiden name was ? Mitchie..cant get a more Scottish Surname.

Many thanks for the help, the John Smith that I'm looking for is definitely the one that lived at Percy St he was married to Mary nee Mclay who's parents were Dennis and Catherine Mclay I dont know any more than that other than what it says on the 1911 census. Once again thank you

Wild shot in the dark - but for all we know, the family may have been in Ireland, not England/Scotland:


John Smith
in the 1861 England Census
Name: John Smith
Age: 6
Estimated birth year: 1855
Relation: Son
Mother's name: Catherine Smith
Gender: Male
Where born: Ireland
Civil Parish: Birkenhead
Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity
Town: Birkenhead
County/Island: Cheshire
Country: England
Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
View image
Registration district: Birkenhead
Sub-registration district: Birkenhead
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 208
Piece: 2642
Folio: 57
Page Number: 32
Household Members:
Name Age
Catherine Smith 30 - widowed, charwoman
James Smith 8
John Smith 6

All born Ireland.

OK, I've had a look - couldn't stand the suspense.

Marriage:
28 February 1882 at Park Street, Motherwell.
John Smith, coalminer, bachelor, age 26.
Usual residence: Williams Row, Glenhead.
Father: Michael Smith, railway labourer, deceased.
Mother: Catherine Smith nee Smith.

Mary McClay, cotton cloth dyer, spinster, age 18.
Usual residence: Williams Row.
Father: Dennis McLay, coalminer, deceased.
Mother: Catherine McLay, nee Michie.

Witnesses: Arthur (can't read surname - llooks like Beyaest).
William McLay.



So those censuses look correct, but the Irish baptism is wrong.

1891:

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Tavern Row, Holywell, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England

John Smith Head Married Male 36 1855 Coal Miner Ireland
Mary Smith Wife Married Female 28 1863 - Scotland
Ellen Smith Daughter - Female 9 1882 - Scotland
Dinah Smith Daughter - Female 7 1884 - Northumberland, England
John W Smith Son - Male 4 1887 - Northumberland, England
James Smith Son - Male 0 1891 - Northumberland, England
Harry Jackson Boarder Single Male 22 1869 Coal Miner Yorkshire, England

Sorry AG! They look to be the correct ones given the marriage Theresa posted.

Baptism of son Dennis:

Name: Denis Smith
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 30 Mar 1884
Baptism Place: St. John, Annitsford, Northumberland, England
Father: Johannes Smith
Mother: Mariae Mcelane Smith
FHL Film Number: 2046657

and birth on the GRO:

SMITH, DENNIS MCCLAY
GRO Reference: 1884 J Quarter in TYNEMOUTH Volume 10B Page 252

Oh, bother, AQ!

I had already posted those censuses , but then deleted them when Theresa changed the YOB!

How do you know about John?
Is it through his marriage to Mary?
If so, what more do you know about her?
Have you found them on censuses after marriage? Where did they live? Scotland? Ireland?

We might be able to work backwards.

You changed it to born 1845? But 1901/ 1911 suggest birth was1854/5:

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
20, Percy Street, Backworth, Tynemouth, Northumberland, England

John Smith Head Married Male 46 1855 Coal Miner Hewer Ireland
Mary Smith Wife Married Female 38 1863 - Scotland
Ellen Smith Daughter Single Female 19 1882 - Scotland
Dennis Smith Son Single Male 17 1884 Coal Miner Pony Putter Underground West Holywell, Northumberland
John W Smith Son Single Male 14 1887 Apprentice Blacksmith West Holywell, Northumberland
James Smith Son Single Male 10 1891 - West Holywell, Northumberland,
Catherine Smith Daughter Single Female 6 1895 - Backworth, Northumberland,
Jane Smith Daughter - Female 0 1901 - Backworth, Northumberland, England
Catherine McClay Mother-In-Law Widow Female 66 1835 - Ireland
John McClay Brother-In-Law Single Male 42 1859 Coal Miner Hewer Scotland
-------------------------------------------

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
20 Percy Street Backworth Newcastle-On Tyne, Backworth, Northumberland, England

John Smith Head Married Male Coal Miner Hewer 57 1854 Co Fermanagh South Brough Ireland Resident
Mary Smith Wife Married Female - 48 1863 Quarter Lanarkshire Resident
Ellen Smith Daughter Single Female - 29 1882 Motherwell Resident
Dennis Smith Son Single Male Coal Miner Hewer 27 1884 Backworth Northumberland
John W Smith Son Single Male Blacksmith 24 1887 Backworth County Northumberland
Mary Smith Granddaughter - Female - 0 1911 Backworth County Northumberland
James Smith Grandson Single Male Coal Miner Hewer 20 1891 Backworth County Northumberland
Daniel Smith Son - Male - 0 1911 Backworth County Northumberland
Catherine Smith Daughter Single Female Dressmaker 16 1895 Backworth County Northumberland
Hugh Smith Son - Male - 2 1909 Backworth County Northumberland
Jane Smith Daughter - Female - 10 1901 Backworth County Northumberland

The marriage reference on SP - 6 credits will let you see the document without having to buy a copy:

SMITH
JOHN
MCLAY
MARY
1881
639/ 21
Dalziel

I see John and Mary McLay married in Scotland- do you have the marriage certificate?- It should list his parents.

Many thanks

Google - What is the Irish name for John?

In Irish, it is written as Eóghan, Eoghan, Eóin, Eoin (pronounced Owen) or Seán (pronounced Shawn). The latter is a Gaelicisation of the Norman-French 'Jean'. In some cases, the pronunciation of the original initial "Y"/"I" also changed to variants of "J". In Scotland, it is Iain or Ian.
John (given name) - Wikipedia


The baptism posted by Argyll Gran will have the names written in Latin as it is Roman Catholic

Just looking through some info i had I thought that Sean was Irish for john have I got the wrong info ? all help is appreciated. Thanks

Thank you

Very useful site:

https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/

Free to use (you have to register), and you can view images of original documents.

Many thanks any further help on Joannis and Sarah Smith. Also can anyone recommend an Irish ancestry site. Thanks

???

Joannis Smith
in the Ireland, Catholic Parish Registers, 1655-1915
Name: Joannis Smith
[John Smith]
Baptism Age: 0
Event Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 1845
Baptism Date: 14 May 1845
Baptism Place: Drumully, Fermanagh and Monaghan, Ireland
Parish Variants: Currin, Scotshouse
Diocese: Clogher
Father: Joannis Smith
Mother: Sarah