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Sorry Eringobragh if you read this a moment ago- edited this post as I found the extra birth.

These are the (5) children that are supposedly theirs on the 1901 census:

Mary Caplice Daughter Single 25 1876 Tipperary
Margaret Caplice Daughter Single 23 1878 Tipperary
James Caplice Son Single 19 1882 Tipperary
Ellen Caplice Daughter Single 15 1886 Tipperary
John Caplice Son Single 6 1895 Tipperary

Seems some confusion on names (two Margarets- think one is Ellen, but definitely listed on the civil records as Margaret!!)

1. Name MARY CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1875 (5th December)
Group Registration ID 8626440
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Father: Patrick Caplice (farmer)
Mother: Margaret Caplice (formerly Green)
Address: Glenacunna

Name MARGARET CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1877
Group Registration ID 10631540
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex N/R
Father: Patrick
Mother: Margaret (formerly Green)
Address: Gurtishal

2. Name JAMES CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1882
Group Registration ID 10902036
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex N/R
Father: Patrick (labourer)
Mother (formerly Green)
Address: Gurtishal

3. Name MARGARET CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1885
Group Registration ID 10572652
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex N/R
Father: Patrick (Labourer)
Mother: Margaret (Formerly Green)
Born: Gurteshal

4. Name JOHN CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1894
Group Registration ID 11441708
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex N/R
Father: Patrick (farmer)
Mother: Margaret (formerly Green)
Address: Gurthesal

I think what has happened is when filling out the 1911 Census under How many children and how many living ? This may have been interpreted as Living at Home...I have seen that before....

This is Mary's birth- note the address is the same for Ellen's birth:

Name MARY CAPLICE
Date of Birth 1875 (5th December)
Group Registration ID 8626440
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Father: Patrick Caplice (farmer)
Mother: Margaret Caplice (formerly Green)
Address: Glenacunna

So I'm confident that Mary was the unwed mother of Ellen Caplice b.1899.

I wasn't sure about the birth of Daniel

There is this death, but the age is a little out (approx birth 1878)

Name MARY CAPLICE
Year of Death 1906 (June 20th)
Group Registration ID 4863268
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Deceased Age at Death 28

Servant of Ballyporeen.
Informant: Ellen Caplice, Ballyporeen, present at death

Think you have a result AustinQ

No sign of Mary 1875 after the birth of Daniel 1908?

Maryb.

So perhaps Mary was the mother of all the children:

Name ELLEN CAPLICE
Date of Birth 29 March 1899
Group Registration ID 10493686
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex N/R
Born Glennacunna?
Mother: Mary Caplice

Perhaps the family gave them the surnames of the fathers?

Margaret's death:

Name Margaret Caplice
Year of Death 1932
Group Registration ID 1450531
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Deceased Age at Death 82

Widow of Farmer of Gurtishall
Informant: John Caplice, son
--------------------------------------

Patrick's death:

Name PATRICK CAPLICE
Year of Death 1918
Group Registration ID 5642857
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Deceased Age at Death 71

married farmer of Gurtheshall.
Informant: John Caplice, son

1901 had daughter Mary living with the family- there's these births (which tie in with the John Dunlea and Patrick Russell that appear on the 1911 census:

Name JOHN CAPLICE
Date of Birth 21 September 1902
Group Registration ID 7152555
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex Male
Mother's Birth Surname CAPLICE

Mother: Mary Caplice of Gurtheshal, Registered by Margaret Caplice of Gurtheshal
-------------------------------------------------

Name PATRICK CAPLICE
Date of Birth 18 January 1905 (originally April 3rd- statutory disclaimer filed)
Group Registration ID 416245
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex Male
Mother's Birth Surname CAPLICE

Mother: Mary Caplice of Gurtheshal
-----------------------------------------------------

Name DANIEL CAPLICE (died at 2 months old in the workhouse)
Date of Birth 20 January 1908
Group Registration ID 555984
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname CAPLICE

Mother Mary Caplice of Clogheen Workhouse

Unsure if Daniel is of the same Mary, as Mary may have died in 1906- but will leave just in case.
------------------------------------------------------

And death of James:

Name JAMES CAPLICE
Year of Death 1965
Group Registration ID 2785692
SR District/Reg Area Clogheen
Deceased Age at Death 85

Small farmer of Gurteshal, Ballyporeen

I'm not convinced of the death of Patrick Russell that was posted above. What if all the children took on the Caplice name?

Bear in mind that in 1911 the family were living house 9 in Gorteeshal (Ballyporeen, Tipperary)

This is a John Caplice- travelling to Canada- he was born Ballyporeen, and gives his nearest relative as BROTHER, James Caplice, Gurteshal, Ballyporeen

Name: John Caplice
Gender: Male
Age: 23
Birth Year: abt 1905
Birth Country: Ireland
Date of Arrival: 12 Apr 1928
Vessel: Marloch
Port of Arrival: St John, New Brunswick, Canada
Port of Departure: Cobh, Ireland
---------------------------------------------

And then there is this Patrick Caplice, born in Ballyporeen, travellingg to Canada to his Brother, John Caplice in Toronto, Ont. His nearest relative is given as UNCLE James Caplice, Gurteshal, Ballyporeen

Name: Patrick Caplice
Gender: Male
Age: 24
Birth Year: abt 1905
Birth Country: Ireland
Date of Arrival: 16 Jun 1929
Vessel: Aurania
Port of Arrival: Quebec, Canada
Port of Departure: Cobh, Ireland

Mary, you're not the only one struggling with this!

I suspect that Ellen (Fitzgerald) was perhaps a foster daughter or like, and had been with the Caplice family from a very early age, and took on the surname??

But the 2 Ellen's were both at the same address in 1901 with Patrick and Margaret.

There is this
Ellen Caplice born @ 1885 Ireland left Queenstown on the ship Cretic arrived Boston USA 28/5/1904.I can't make out the address.

Ellen who married Richard had her last child 1942 making her 56 if she was the one born 1886!

Is it deffinately the one who is the daughter of Patrick and Margaret nee Greene or another Patrick.

Maryb

Morning AustinQ...That's the 1901 I looked at and the 1911 has Andrew remarried and all the children from 1901 have been dispersed to who knows where the only children from his first marriage b after 1901 are Alice Annie and Katie..Thomas id from his marriage to Mary A.

The marriage certificate of Ellen and Richard is on https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/

Address on marriage for Richard looks like Rathnareen/ Rathnaveen- father Andrew Ryan, Farmer.

I suspect this is him in 1911:

Residents of a house 5 in Rathneaveen (Ryan) (Solloghodbeg, Tipperary)

Ryan John 48 Male Head of Family R Catholic Co Tipperary Farmer
Ryan Ellen 40 Female Wife R Catholic Co Tipperary Farmer Married - 19 years
Ryan Richard 15 Male Servant Roman Catholic Co Tipperary Farm Servant Single
-----------------------------------

This is his baptism:

Catholic Birth and Baptism Registers, 1763-1912
Name: Richard Ryan
Baptism Date: 29 Aug 1896
Baptism Place: Annacarty, Tipperary, Ireland
Father: Andrew Ryan
Mother: Mary Quinlan
Abode: Furnaclara?

Godparents: Richard Quinlan & Alice Ryan

There is a helpful note on the baptism (obviously added later) that says 'married in Tipperary 13th April 1921 to Ellen Caplice'
----------------------------------------------

Going by the address, I think this is Richard in 1901:

Residents of a house 5 in Farranaclara (Kilmucklin, Tipperary)

Ryan Andrew 30 Male Head of Family R Catholic Co Tipperary Boot and Shoe Maker Married -
Ryan Mary 28 Female Wife R Catholic Co Tipperary - Married -
Ryan Mary 9 Female Daughter R Catholic Co Tipperary Scholar
Ryan Michael 7 Male Son R Catholic Co Tipperary Scholar
Ryan Bridget 6 Female Daughter R Catholic Co Tipperary Scholar
Ryan Ellen 4 Female Daughter R Catholic Co Tipperary -
Ryan Richard 3 Male Son R Catholic Co Tipperary -
Ryan Margaret Female Daughter R Catholic Co Tipperary -

Natasha.. What was Richards address on the MC.?
.Whereabouts in the Co.Tipp did they live after their marriage.

????

i think ellen caprice and ellen fitzgerald born 1899 are the same person if you have a daughter called ellen caprice born 1886 ? you will not call another daughter ellen caprice unless she died i cant find a death for ellen caprice i would buy the birth cert for ellen caprice born 1899
mind abby could be wrong

Re Baptism of Patrick 1842 posted by Maddie (8th Oct.16.10) mothers surname should read Johanna POWER.....see son John's Baptism May1828 in Church Register

Probably the death of Patrick Russell who appears on 1911 census:

Patrick Russell
in the Ireland, Civil Registration Deaths Index, 1864-1958
Name: Patrick Russell
Estimated birth year: abt 1905
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1938
Death Age: 33
Registration district: Clogheen
Volume: 4
Page: 283
FHL Film Number: 101741

Just for the record - Patrick & Margaret's marriage. Maddie posted a different version which didn't give Margaret's name:

Patrick Caplice
in the Ireland, Civil Registration Marriages Index, 1845-1958
Name: Patrick Caplice
Date of Registration: 1875
Registration district: Clogheen, Ireland
Volume: 4
Page Number: 545
FHL Film Number: 101252
Records on Page:
Name
Patrick Caplice
Margaret Greene

Maryb..... Your not missing something...I am just as confused , I can usually sort out whats what...but ,I've looked at this a few time and am still sorting !!!

Richards family is even worse if they are who I think they may be...!!

So if Patrick and Margaret Green had according to 1911 census 4 children all living and 3 with them in 1911 -minus Mary 1875 and Ellen 1886 or 1899 then who were the daughters who married and gave birth to
John Dunlea 7 Grandson
Patrick Russell 5
Ellie Fitzgerald 11 granddaughter
All on 1911 census!

Or am I missing something?

Maryb.