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I'd wait and see what his birth certificate says- hopefully it'll give you some answers. Please keep us updated! :)

Someone on ancestry has a photocopy of the Emma Price/ Thomas Start marriage certificate:

Date: Nov 28th 1861
Thomas Start of full age, Bachelor, book keeper of St. John's Oadby, Leicestershire
Father: John Start, Shoemaker

Emma Price of full age, Spinster of St. John's Oadby, Leicestershire
Father:Joseph Price, Farmer

Witnesses: John Richard Cain & Sarah ??? Ball

oh just looked at the probate - so do you think Thomas who Emma married was using start-taylor a double barell name but only start was recorded and then albert start taylor was then registered for my grandfather who then dropped the start and went by taylor? just a thought?

bought the birth certificate tonight... will post when I know more - thank you so much for your help. I keep updating the information as I go along. Think I may have to get more access. :)

Nice work Mary- that confirms the 1873 birth you put up for Albert earlier is the correct one.- So he was registered a Taylor / Start- Taylor.

Think I'd just have to buy that birth cert!!

When Emma marries Dibben one of the witnesses is Elizabeth Taylor- a connection to the Taylor name perhaps?

Was there any connection to the head of the house in 1901 at 20,Portland Street
Edith transcribed as Hillard but I'm not sure it is that. Not known where born,also gives her age as 39 but that could be wrong as they seem to got Edna and Albert's ages wrong.

Emma Dibben of Freemans Cottage died 12/7/1923 probated to Albert Harry Andrew Start-Taylor £787 8s 2d

Maryb.

Just for the record:

Marriages Dec 1861 (>99%)
PRICE Emma Blaby 7a 129
START Thomas Blaby 7a 129

wonder if the chapman could be any relation to edna? could they have known each other through albert? hum... will request some certificates today. many thanks everyone

- But it doesn't explain where the Taylor surname came from!

This is his Mum in 1871 (Mistranscribed)

Name: Emma Wart
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Thomas Wart
Gender: Female
Where born: Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Civil Parish: St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: St John
Town: Leicester
County/Island: Leicestershire
Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Household schedule number: 79
Piece: 3268 Folio: 50 Page Number: 14
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Wart 33 Hosier's warehouseman Shepshed Leicester
Emma Wart 30
Harriet A Woodford 21
George B Rolfe 20
-------------------------------------------------
Possibly the death of Emma's first husband:
Name: Thomas Start
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838
Registration Year: 1877
Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun
Age at Death: 39
Registration district: Leicester
Inferred County: Leicestershire
Volume: 7aPage: 152
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Could do with finding the 1881 to see if she's perhaps living with a Taylor, or has Albert with her.

Also explains where his middle name of Start came from I guess

Jude

This doesn't help with Edna at the moment, but might be of interest.

Reading through the articles on Albert's bankruptcy, one of them states:

"In answer to Mr Scott, debtor said he let Mrs Dibben of Leicester have his bike, as he owed her £45 and she was willing to have the machine...."

So this appears to be Albert in 1891- but what he didn't say in the article was that Mrs Dibben's was his Mum.

1891
Name: Albert H Taylor
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Gender: Male
Where born: Leicestershire, England
Civil Parish: St Mary
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: Leicestershire
Registration district: Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Piece: 2536 Folio: 104 Page Number: 8
Household Members:
Name Age
George F Dibben head 81 retired solicitor Leicestershire
Emma Dibben wife 50 Leicestershire
Albert H Taylor son 18 Draper Apprentice Leicester
-------------------------------------------------

The Dibben's marriage- both widowed

Name: George Julian Dibben
Gender: Male
Birth Year: abt 1811
Marriage Date: 10 Sep 1883
Marriage Age: 72
Marriage Place: Birmingham, St Nicolas, Warwickshire, England
Spouse: Emma Start
Spouse Gender: Female
Spouse Marriage Age: 42
Father: George Dibben
Spouse's Father: Joseph Price

Witnesses: Henry Thomas Pratt & Elizabeth Taylor

Sydney Vincent was also a twin (to Ernest J) but his birth on 1939 says 1915 when he was actually born in 1917.

Dea x

Another child was 1913 Gertrude Mary Taylor mum nee Chapman and twin brother Charles V7a P440

Maryb.

Have you any of the other children's birth certs of Alfred and Edna
to make sure of maiden name


I know of a Lady who used her married name as her maiden name
as she wasn't married to the father of the child

Mavis

Is this Albert
Albert Harry A S Taylor J/F/M 1873 Leicestershire V7a P 199

No sign of this man after this.
Just thought he might have married under another Christian name.

Maryb.

Thank you very much for your help everyone I will look at the info again and see if any small clue can give me anything. I have Edna's death certificate and my grandfathers birth certificate with her as mother which states previously chapman. Will look at my great grandfather death certificate as a angle. I am curious as it looks as though he had 2 children to his second wife... Was looking to see if I could track them down

In case you don't have this........

Albert Start Taylor in the England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966
Name: Albert Start Taylor
Probate Date: 27 Nov 1951
Registry: London, England
Death Date: 16 Jul 1951
Death Place: Leicestershire, Leicester, England

Of 68 Parklands Drive, Loughborough, Leicestershire.

To Mark Guy Pearce...solicitor...and Herbert Stanley Williams...solicitors clerk.

Effects: £704...1s

Ah well followed through Austin!

This is the only other one I can find that may be a possibility...a lady missing

Marriages Jun 1898 (>99%)
Barnett Thomas Leicester 7a 495
Cuthbert Annie Leicester 7a 495
DAVENPORT John William Leicester 7a 495
OLIVER Annie Leicester 7a 495
Taylor Albert Edward Leicester 7a 495

But Albert Edward :-( :-(

jude

I think that's what Emma's trying to find out!!

This looks like the Edna Parr/ Albert Taylor 1901, so not our Edna:

Name: Edna Taylor
Age: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation to Head: Daughter-in-law
Gender: Female
Spouse: Harry Taylor
Birth Place: Greetland, Yorkshire, England
Civil Parish: Brighouse
Ecclesiastical parish: Brighouse St Martin
County/Island: Yorkshire
Registration district: Halifax
Sub-registration district: Brighouse
ED, institution, or vessel: 11
Piece: 4115 Folio: 124 Page Number: 20
Household schedule number: 131
Household Members:
Name Age
George Taylor 50
Martha Taylor 50
Walter Taylor 29
Albert Taylor 28
Fieldhouse Taylor 20
Ethel Taylor 12
Harry Taylor 9
Edna Taylor 21
Geo Saml Taylor 1/12
----------------------------------

Marriage:
Name: Albert Taylor
Birth Year: abt 1873
Age: 27
Marriage or Bann Date: 3 Mar 1900
Parish: Halifax, St John the Baptist, Yorkshire, England
Spouse: Edna Parr
Father: George Taylor
Spouse Father: Sam Parr

So how did she become Chapman because the Parr marriage is the only marriage that fits (and has a birth to go with it)

If they didn't actually marry and was born Chapman, then where is her birth?

:-S :-S

Jude

No, the birth certs of Albert's children have mm Chapman.

http://ww3.gloucestershire.gov.uk/bmd/BirthSearch.aspx
TAYLOR Edna V TAYLOR TAYLOR CHAPMAN 1901 Cheltenham Cheltenham, Cheltenham