Find Ancestors

Click on the link.......and it will explain to you about the 1939 census.

http://www.findmypast.co.uk/1939register?dclid=CNuFxMaGzMkCFYuI2wodDA8GBg

Thanks prickly holly I didn't realise we can acces census after 1911. I am wondering if Arthur lived with Gertrude on the 1921 census

On the 1939 census......

Arthur and wife Suzannah are living in St Pancras, London.

You would need to purchase credits to "unlock the household" to get full transcript including birth dates, occupations, address & full names and the original image.


http://www.findmypast.co.uk/1939register?dclid=CNuFxMaGzMkCFYuI2wodDA8GBg

Edit: Just found them on the Electoral Roll...

Arthur James Harper in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
Name: Arthur James Harper
Year: 1939
County or Borough: Camden
Ward or Division/Constituency: St Pancras South West
Street address: 9 Mornington Street

Susannah appears as Susan Mary Harper

At the same address is John Gildie.....Possibly... John Joseph Gildea


Arthur James Harper in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
Name: Arthur James Harper and Susannah Mary
Year: 1936
County or Borough:Camden
Ward or Division/Constituency:St Pancras
Street address: 17 Seymour Street

Most experienced GR researchers don't use GR for researching. They use either Ancestry or FindmyPast.

I use Ancestry which is where I found the Electoral Roll details. Ancestry is especially good for London parish records.

On all the Electoral Registers......Gertrude and Harry are living with the Buer family.

James Buer and his wife Lucy.

Here they are in 1911......at the same address.

James Buer in the 1911 England Census
Name: James Buer
Age in 1911: 54
Estimated birth year: abt 1857
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: London, United Kingdom
Civil Parish: St Pancras
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 80 Bartholomew Rd, Kentish Town N W
Marital Status:Married
Occupation: PLAYING CARD MAKER
Registration district: St Pancras

Household Members:

James Buer 54
Lucy Buer 31
James George Buer 26
Maud Buer 22
Lucy Buer 5
Charles Buer 11

Thanks prickles. Do you have to pay to access electoral roll as I couldn't find historical ones? I would like to see who she lived with and who the house belonged to. The plot thickens, now I need to find out how Arthur was brought up. As we have no access to census after 1911 how can I do this? My dad, who is now deceased only found out that Arthur was Gertrudes son when she died as Arthur is recorded as her son on her death certificate My dad had always thought Gertrude was his auntie while she was alive, never knew she was his grandmother, so doesn't sound as if Arthur was adopted as Arthur kept in touch with her, perhaps another family member or friend brought him up?

It is entirely up to you if you choose to have separate trees.

I have just have the one tree.......I like everything all in one place. :-)

Gertrude is on the Electoral Roll....living at 80 Bartholomew Road, St Pancras from 1929 to 1965

I have checked them all and Alfred is not with her on any of them.

Yes prickles Arthur married Suzannah Mary Griffiths in 1932. I am also tracing her family who resided in Wales. Got back to her parents so far
As I am new, should I be starting different trees for different parts of the family? I currently have everything on one tree, ie my mothers and fathers ancestors and want to put on my husbands mother and fathers ancestory too.

Hi Julie

I am pleased we have sorted it out for you.

Do you know if Arthur married?

I have read through the posts again and now realise that Arthur was born in the workhouse then moved with Gertrude to the convalescent home, where they lived when he was baptised. The address within the electoral role 1939 confirms we have the correct Gertrude as this is the address on the death certificate. I am so impressed how far prickly holly has gone back so quickly, and see that Gertrude is no longer living at home in Newbury in 1911 and the workhouse records she is from Newbury. Seems to rule out the other 3 London Gertrude Harpers born between 1891 and 1897 doesn't it? I wonder why she moved to London, perhaps she had a cousin of the same name there?

Wow, how interesting. I am so pleased I subscribed. I never expected so many replies, thank you so much. So..... Piecing this together.... Was the convalescent home near the workhouse? Did Gertrude have Arthur on 20th March then move straight to the workhouse? lots of info indicating Gertrude is from Newbury and a large family there but there is also a Gertrude from Camden which is where Arthur lived all his life. So is the only way I clarify this by sending off for Gertrude's marriage certificate to find out who her parents are? How can I find out if Arthur lived with Gertrude whilst he was growing up as we cannot yet access the 1921 census? This is so exciting I can see why people get hooked

Julie does appear to know how to view the replies - she sent a PM timed at 4.22pm.

She says that the death in 1967 is correct

Name: Gertrude Giddy
Birth Date: abt 1895
Date of Registration: Dec 1967
Age at Death: 72
Registration district: St Pancras
Inferred County: London
Volume: 5d

Her year of birth as given on the 1939 Register was 1892, but we all know that people can be economical with the truth!

Although I'm also drawn to the Newbury born Gertrude, there are other candidates. The current favourite's birth reg -

First name(s) GERTRUDE LIZZIE
Last name HARPER
Birth year 1890
Birth quarter 2
District NEWBURY
County Berkshire
Country England
Volume 2C
Page 229
Page: 1069

(FreeBMD has incorrectly transcribed as Gertrude Lily - correction submitted)

Julie asks if Gertrude's MC would help. Although the research already undertaken is probably correct, it wouldn't harm to order it from http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/ at a cost of £9.25.
Only use the details from the index, and nothing else

First name(s) GERTRUDE L
Last name HARPER
Marriage quarter 3
Marriage year 1936
Spouse's last name GIDDY
District PANCRAS
County London
Country England
Volume 1B
Page 162

I will send Julie a PM to let her know she has received replies.

???

Charles Waite in the 1851 England Census
Name:Charles Waite
Age:10
Estimated birth year:abt 1841
Relation:Son
Mother's name:Prudence Waite
Gender:Male
Where born:Boxford, Berkshire, England
Civil Parish:Boxford
Ecclesiastical parish:St John
County/Island:Berkshire
Country:England

Registration district:Newbury
Sub-registration district:Thatcham

Household Members:

Prudence Waite 46
Mathew Waite 19
Charles Waite 10



Births Jun 1840 (>99%)
Wait Charles Newbury 6 221


Note that Charles's mothers name is Prudence!

Have to go out now......will pop back on here tomorrow.........Prickles.

Going back to that 1867 marriage I posted...


Marriages Dec 1867 (>99%)
King Martha Newbury 2c 460
WAITE Charles Newbury 2c 460

There is a death for a Charles Waite in 1868...of the right age, time and place.


Deaths Jun 1868 (>99%)
WAITE Charles 27 Newbury 2c 129

And there is a Martha King born 1844 Leckhampstead Berkshire...


Martha King in the 1851 England Census
Name:Martha King
Age: 7
Estimated birth year: abt 1844
Relation: Daughter
Father's name:Moses King
Mother's name:Martha King
Gender:Female
Where born:Leckhampstead, Berkshire, England
Civil Parish:Speen

County/Island:Berkshire
Country:England

Household Members:

Moses King 40
Martha King 45
John King 15
James King 14
Ann King 10
Martha King 7
Elizabeth King 10 Mo


Martha King in the England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name:Martha King
Registration Year: 1844
Registration Quarter:Apr-May-Jun
Registration district: Newbury
Inferred County:Berkshire
Volume: 6
Page:213

3 of Jesse and Kate's children are with Kate's mother and stepfather in 1911

1911 England Census....
Name Martha Drewett
Age in 1911 67
Estimated Birth Year abt 1844
Relation to Head Wife
Gender Female
Birth Place Leckhampstead, Berkshire, England
Civil parish Newbury
County/Island Berkshire
Country England
Street Address14 Oxford Street, Newbury
Marital StatusMarried
Years Married40
Estimated Marriage Year1871
Registration districtNewbury
Registration district Newbury

Henry John Drewett 66
Martha Drewett 67
Sarah Berrey Drewett 39
Martha Jane Drewett 30
Charles Earnest Drewett 22
Aurther Harper 13 (Grandson)
Edward Harper 8 (Grandson)
Olive Harper 2 (Granddaughter)

This is complicated.

I am going to go back.......and work forward as I think it will make more sense to you that way.

Kate's birth registration....

Kate Prudence Wait in the England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name:Kate Prudence Wait
Registration Year:1868
Registration Quarter:Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district:Newbury
Inferred County:Berkshire
Volume:2c
Page:228

On the 1871 census, she appears as Catherine "G?" Waite.......Step Daughter
Name:Catharine G Waite
Age:2
Estimated birth year:abt 1869
Relation:Stepdaughter
Mother's name:Martha Dreweatt
Gender:Female
Where born:Boxford, Berkshire, England
Civil Parish:Boxford
County/Island:Berkshire
Country:England
Registration district:Newbury
Sub-registration district:Speen

Household Members:

Henry I Dreweatt 26
Martha Dreweatt 27
Catharine G Waite 2

Kate was obviously born out of wedlock because her mother didn't marry until 1870

Unless of course Martha had been married before?

??

Marriages Dec 1867 (>99%)
King Martha Newbury 2c 460
WAITE Charles Newbury 2c 460



Marriages Dec 1870 (>99%)
DREWETT Henry John Newbury 2c 465
WAITE Martha Newbury 2c 465



Kate P . Waite in the 1881 England Census
Name:Kate P . Waite
Age:12
Estimated birth year:abt 1869
Relationship to Head:Daughter
Father:Henry J. Drewett
Mother:Martha Drewett
Gender:Female
Where born:Boxford, Berkshire, England
Civil Parish:Boxford
County/Island:Berkshire
Country:England
Street address:5 Hunts Green

Household Members

Henry J. Drewett 36
Martha Drewett 37
Kate P. Waite 12
Sarah B. Drewett 9
Henry E. Drewett 3
Martha Drewett

Workhouse documents

Name: Gertrude Harper
Born: 1890
Occupation: Servant
Admission 20 Mar 1911
Discharge 10 Apr 1911
Address of nearest known relative or friend: Father. Marsh Benham, Newbury

Baptism of Arthur

Name: Arthur James Harper
Birth Date: 20 Mar 1911
Baptism Date: 6 May 1911
Archive Provided Parish: Barnes, St Mary
Parish as it Appears: Barnes
Father: Harper
Mother: Gertrude Lizzie Harper
No Father
Address 15 Beverley Gardens, Barnes

Edit

I have found 15 Beverley Gardens in the 1911 Census and it appears to be a Convalescent Home comprising of five patients, all young women, and three babies who are the illegimate children of the patients.

Gertrude Lizzie Giddy in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
Name:Gertrude Lizzie Giddy
Year:1939
County or Borough:Camden
Ward or Division/Constituency:St Pancras North
80 Bartholomew Road with........Harry Stanley Giddy