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Ahh I see. thank you :)

How did you find it?

From Find My Past for School reference.

Chris :)

Natalie asked:

"Hi Chris. Is Thomas James - father of John Waters?"

If you look at page one of this thread, Thomas James is likely to be the uncle by marriage of John Waters, as I believe Thomas married Rachel Waters, the elder sister of Jane Waters (mother of John Waters, or so I reckon) who had married Thomas Harries in 1890, before her early death as posted by Chris.

There are various marriages, baptisms and census material posted previously that I used to support this, early on in this thread.

Yes sorry, thanks. As I posted it I remembered what you had said about the situation. I will be on my laptop later so I'll be able to have a good read through things later. Thanks for the information about my Horton/Francis line too. X <3

just a note about Vernon 1915

Name: Vernon Louvain Waters
Birth Date: 9 May 1915
Date of Registration: Sep 1996
Age at Death: 81
Registration district: Westminster
Inferred County: London
Register Number: A39C
District and Subdistrict: 2581A
Entry Number: 132

perhaps there was a family estrangement


... on the electorall roll up to 1965 (last available) he was living with Martha Waters, assuming that the Vernon in Westminster and then Paddington on the ER was the right Vernon (which the death record indicates)

Name: Martha Waters
Birth Date: 12 Apr 1918
Date of Registration: Jun 1999
Age at Death: 81
Registration district: Westminster
Inferred County: London
Register Number: E44C
District and Subdistrict: 2581E
Entry Number: 153


possible marriages

Marriages Sep 1945
Morgan Martha A Ryan Haverfordwest 11a 3340
Waters Vernon Palmer Haverfordwest 11a 3340

perhaps more likely since no middle name for Martha:

Marriages Sep 1948
Eddy Martha Waters Willesden 5f 865
Gething Martha Waters Willesden 5f 865
Waters Vernon Gething Willesden 5f 865
Waters Vernon Eddy Willesden 5f 865

I'm gething she was divorced, hehehe

Marriages Dec 1938
Eddy Martha Gething Hendon 3a 1579
Gething Raymond E Eddy Hendon 3a 1579

so she was born Eddy

Waters-Eddy births late 1950s, Penzance, early 1960s, Paddington ... Penzance definitely belongs to a different marriage

the child born in the 60s has a tree here at GR with themself in it but does not have Vernon & Martha so the name / place of birth could be a coincidence

not sure whether you have Ancestry access so I'll send you the info privately plus current contact info for that person, who may or may not be a child of Vernon



oh btw, when you sit there with your cuppa wondering what to search next, you start hunting up other people's ancestors ............ :-D

It's going to be such a downer if John and Carrie/Caroline turn out NOT to be Selwyn's parents after all this! :-0

Still think it's a very strong possibility though, so lets hope that birth cert arrives soon. :-)

Oh dear, Kucinta, don't say that! If John & Carrie are not the parents it will all be my fault. I think I was the first one to suggest it.

I ordered a certificate at the same time that Natalie did but hopefully hers will arrive sooner, mine has to come to Canada.

I hope we have the right people. Thanks so much again everyone!

I'm running home from work every day waiting for the birth certificate. How long does it usually take?

Thanks

Margee, I still suspect you are right, or I wouldn't have followed your lead, even if it was insommia that was keeping me up that night/morning :-D

But even if they aren't, there's no 'fault' involved - it was the strongest circumstantial lead you/we could find, given the information we have, and all of us said that getting Selwyn's birth cert was paramount to verify or refute it, so that Natalie does get to trace the right tree.

Natalie - usually within about a week or so, depending on how busy they are. Sounds like you're getting some good exercise though ;-)

Getting some exercise and then sitting in front of the laptop with tea and biscuits!! :-D

Ooops!

I also think that the leads are very promising.. hopefully we will soon know.

You have all been amazing!

Yeah, we're like that on Genes ! ;-)

You'll probably get the certificate Friday or Saturday...you didn't order until last Friday evening and so they would "get that" until Monday morning. So they normally say four working days ....gives you Friday/Saturday.....

I like the exercise followed bgy tea and biscuits (though wine and cheese and biscuits sounds better) :-)

Jude

Wine on Friday night!

Been a long week in work and with waiting for the birth record! I'm impatient!

How very virtuous Natalie :-)

Jude

Still no birth certificate :-(

I feel like a child on a journey saying "are we there yet', only in my case it's "is it here yet?!"

Hope that Friday wine takes the edge of your impatience! ;-)

Just noticed - in the 1891 census where Thomas and Jane Harries and John Waters are visitors with the Adams family, the next household is that of widower farmer Thomas James, who just happens to have a servant named Rachel Waters.

So it looks like Rachel got to marry her employer.

The Friday wine did help - although I had a terrible had the following morning :-S haha. Hopefully Selwyns birth certificate will arrive within the next few days x <3

Still no birth certificate :-(

Thanks for the update anyway :-(