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Hello again

I meant to say can you send me link for newspaper article re: Bigamy and his army details.

Kind regards

Josephine

I think these are the links to the articles on Find My Past

Just noticed this one gives address for mother- living Whalley New Road, Blackburn. Also says Caroline is living with her.
http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000290%2f19240606%2f040
CHARGE OF BIGAMY
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http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000329%2f19240605%2f021
BIGAMY CHARGE
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This is the link to the one where he states he was in the army:
http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000265%2f19240613%2f084
Newton Abbot Bigamy Case

(no idea on below!)

British Royal Air Force, Airmen's service records 1912-1939 Transcription (Find My Past)

First name(s) Charles
Last name Derry
Birth year 1876
Birth date 10 Mar 1876
Birth parish Richmond
Birth county Surrey
Occupation Organiser (Political Agent)
Attestation year 1918
Attestation date 08 Jun 1918
Attestation age 42
Service number 195558
Marriage year 1907
Marriage date 31 May 1907 (on image, 31/7/1901. Town, Liverpool)
Spouse's first name(s) Kathleen
Child's first name(s) Millicent Irene Maynard
Child's birth date 08 Sep 1905
Archive reference AIR 79/1773
(address for nok, wife, Kathleen Derry, 26, Armthorpe Road, Nether Green, Sheffield)


Births Dec 1905 (>99%)
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Derry Millicent Irene M Pontardawe 11a 948

Chris :)

West Midlands Birth indexes for the years: 1879

BUCK Caroline S West Bromwich North East Sandwell Register Office
WBNE/70/417


West Midlands Marriage indexes for the years: 1876

BUCK Edward WOOD Eleanor J West Bromwich, All Saints Sandwell Register Office 22


http://www.westmidlandsbmd.org.uk/index.php


Baptism (Brother)
County Staffordshire
Place West Bromwich
Church All Saints
RegisterNumber
DateOfBirth 02 Aug 1877
BaptismDate 20 Aug 1877
Forename John Edward
FatherForename Edward
MotherForename Eleanor Jane
FatherSurname BUCK
MotherSurname
Abode Hately Heath
FatherOccupation Gas holder worker
Notes Sponsors: James Wright, Edward Buck, Charlotte Wood

http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/Search.pl


Deaths Mar 1932 (>99%)
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Buck Eleanor J 79 Basford 7b 323

(if Mother)


http://newspapers.library.wales/view/3434518/3434530/242/

Think that RAF attestation is for the correct man- it says prior engagements 2nd Batt Welsh Rgt- rank on discharge, Corporal. Lots of snippets in the papers about him

Liverpool Daily Post - Wednesday 27 June 1917

ABERCROMBY BY- ELECTION

A Great Meeting will be held at the Stadium, Pudsey Street..... Speakers: Charles Derry, late 2nd Welch Rgt, General organiser and agent.
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Seems to be the same man who wrote a letter to the editor of Sheffield Evening Telegraph - Wednesday 19 May 1920 and signs himself CHARLES DERRY, Sergeant Major. 22 Aldred Road, Sheffield. (This was the address given on his discharge papers from the RAF)
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In trouble again!
"Portsmouth Evening News - Friday 04 April 1924
Charles Derry of 21 Beach Road, Southsea was summoned for unlawfully offering himself as a servant, asserting that he had been a servant to Captain F Winter"- this was a lie, he admitted he'd made up references. In his defence he stated " I was a sergeant major with the Welsh regiment and after being invalided I was subsequently marked fit and I did not go to the situation in London because my wife's sister in Southsea was taken ill."
Southsea Ex-Service Man Fined at Havant

Hello

Did you send me another message at 10.27 am? I got notification of another message but have not received one.

Kind regards

Josephine

You have messages at 10.20, 10.27 & 10.54

Wow I am again amazed. I think I do not search in the right places!

You have found so much for me to get on with. Yes he seemed to spend his life in trouble!

Again many thanks

Regards

Josephine

OK- found them!!! Needs a little explaining:

On one of the bigamy articles Charles states that he had supported his first wife through the war, but he knew they were not compatible. Then on the RAF record Charles states his Wife is Kathleen Derry, but gives his date of marriage as 1901 Liverpool (which is when he married Caroline). So maybe Caroline went by the name Kathleen? I checked the 1911 census and found her- with her Mum (who also appeared with the name Derry!)

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
24 Cecil Stret Carlisle, Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Ellen Darry Head Widow Female Boarding House Keeper 60 1851 Stafordshire Wednesbury
Kathleen Darry Daughter Single Female Drapers Assistant 29 1882 Staffordshire Walsal
Dorothy Darry Daughter Single Female Actress 21 1890 Warickshire Birmingham
Vera Darry Grandchild - Female School 9 1902 Scotland Glasgow
Irene Darry Grandchild - Female School 5 1906 Scotland Glasgow
Frank Kitchen Boarder Single Male Grocers Assistant 25 1886 Cumberland Culgarth
Fred Kitchen Boarder Single Male Grocers Assistant 22 1889 Cumberland Culgarth
William Dickson Boarder Single Male Grocers Assistant 19 1892 Dumfriesshire Dumfries
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So, Caroline/ Kathleen's children were Vera and Irene (possibly Millicent Irene as mentioned in the RAF document)

This is the birth of Vera:
VERA GRACE MARGARET DERRY
born 23rd January 1902
Father: Harry Cecil Charles Derry, theatrical agent
Mother: Caroline Sarah Derry (ms Buck)
Address: Palmadine Road, Glasgow

I don't see Irene or Millicent's birth in Scotland so suspect the birth put up by Chris earlier is the correct one:

Births Dec 1905 (>99%)
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Derry Millicent Irene M Pontardawe 11a 948

National School Admission Registers & Log-books 1870-1914 Transcription
First name(s) Vera
Last name Derry
Birth year 1902
Birth date 23 Jan 1902
Event year 1911
School name Parish Church Schools
Town Preston
County Lancashire
Country England
Parent name(s) Derry Harry
Book type Admissions
Archive reference SMPr/45/4
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England & Wales marriages 1837-2008 Transcription
First name(s) VERA G M
Last name DERRY
Marriage quarter 3
Marriage year 1930
Spouse: FREDERICK A HONICK
District BASFORD
District number -
County Nottinghamshire
Volume 7B Page 611
----------------------------------------------------

Wondering if this is Vera's death:
Name: Veronica G M Honick
Birth Date: abt 1903
Date of Registration: Mar 1959
Age at Death: 56
Registration district: Luton
Inferred County: Bedfordshire
Volume: 4a Page: 139

Possible marriage for Millicent Irene:

England & Wales marriages 1837-2008 Transcription
First name(s) MILLICENT I
Last name DERRY
Marriage quarter 3
Marriage year 1935
Spouse JAMES R EDWARDS
District BASFORD
County Nottinghamshire
Volume 7B Page 609

AND- a possible birth (James) to this marriage :-D

I am speechless! How do you do it. You have enlightend me in so many ways. I did not know about the National School Admissions Register!

Yes that is why I could not find Caroline on searches that I made!!

So many thanks

Regards

Josephine

I must say that when I posted that message I never thought I would find anything and certainly not find someone who is so helpful and found out more about him in a day that I have for many years!!

Kind regards

Josephine

Josephine, just out of interest, who was your Grandmother?

Just reading through some of the letters that Charles sent to various papers after WW1, and despite some of his wrong doings, I think his heart was in the right place, with many of his letters fighting for better conditions for other people- especially those widowed and orphaned by the war. In one he complains that it may be well and good to have war memorials, but not when they cost thousands and the fatherless children sit hungry and barefooted at their base, which I think was probably a feeling echoed by lots at that time.

Interestingly there are also several reports of a letter being sent Dec 1914 from a Charles Derry a private in the Welsh Regiment to a Mr David Davies- in it he praises the bravery of Davies son:

"Your son, utterly disregarding danger to himself, came to me as I lay wounded, and under terrible shell fire picked me up and carried me down to cover, going back to fetch my brother from a barn where the wounded lay in agony"

It's possible that the letter was sent by your Charles, as his brother, Ernest Richard also served with the Welsh regiment.

How do you do it! You have just made my day. Where are these letters? How do you find them! I think you should be charging for your services!!

Well I would like to think that he did have a heart! You have also just informed me that he had a brother! In one asylum record it does mention a brother but no name.

My grandmother was Elizabeth Eggers b. 1887 in Hull. Her parents were German and landed at Hull - but she later called herself Cecilia Derry. Interestingly I have a photograph of a steamer with funnels called Cecilia. I wonder if this is the ship they arrived on. She called him her husband but I do not think they were married but..... with his record!

I am so enjoying getting your emails! I work from home and have just finished for the day and am going to start really looking at everything you have sent me.

Kind regards

Josephine

Meant to say my grandmother also was a 'variety artist' at some point so maybe this is when she met him.

Regards

Josephine

If you have access to Find my Past newspapers you should be able to find some of his letters:

Birmingham Daily Mail 02 December 1914
Welshman's Heroism in Rescuing Wounded men

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000644%2f19141202%2f057
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Sheffield Evening Telegraph 10 May 1919
War Memorials

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000276%2f19190510%2f066
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Sheffield Evening Telegraph 17 March 1919
Gratuities

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000276%2f19190317%2f035
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Relation Name: Millicent Derry
Date of Birth: 1905
Place of Birth: Cllydach

(a check on 'Search All Member Trees' (top tight of page, under 'Search') brings above, they also have a Vera 1901, the surname of Member looks interesting!)

Chris :)

(Pontardawe, Clydach, Swansea area?)

Hi again

I actually have Ancestry, Findmypast, TheGeniologist! I have never had much luck searching GRO War records or Newspapers! I think I have just never taken the time to find our how to do it properly.

There is a Welsh connection. My Great Grandmother left husband and moved to Cardiff with the children.

I am really enjoying looking through everything you have sent me. I really need to be much more thorough in my searches!

I will now know how to search better!

Kind regards

Sylvia

Census for Charles and family- seems like Charles wasn't the only one who'd had run- ins with the law. Check FMP crime prisons & punishment for Charles' brother, Ernest!

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Murray Buildings, Lambeth, London, England
Charles Derry Head Married Male 28 1853 Wine Merchants Cellarman Hereford, Herefordshire
Margaret Derry Wife Married Female 28 1853 - Cork, Cork, Ireland
Charle Derry Son Single Male 5 1876 Surrey
Grace M Derry Daughter Single Female 3 1878 Surrey
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1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Marshall Street, St James Westminster, Westminster, London, England
Margaret Derry Head Married Female 39 1852 Charwoman Cork, Ireland
Charles Derry Son Single Male 15 1876 Telegraph Messenger Richmond, Surrey, England
Grace Derry Daughter - Female 12 1879 Scholar Richmond, Surrey, England
Cornelius Derry Son - Male 7 1884 Scholar St Giles, Middlesex, England
Ernest Derry Son - Male 1 1890 - St James, Middlesex, England
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1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
45, Russell Street, St John, Cardiff, Glamorganshire, Wales
Charles Derry Head Married Male 48 1853 Window Cleaner Hereford, Herefordshire, England
Margerett Derry Wife Married Female 48 1853 - Ireland
Ernest R Derry Son Single Male 11 1890 - London, Middlesex, England
Bernard Derry Son Single Male 8 1893 - Hereford, Herefordshire,
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1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
4 Robert Street Cathays Cardiff, Cardiff, Glamorganshire, Wales
Charles Derry Senr Head Married Male Window Cleaner 58 1853 Hereford City
Margaret Derry Wife Married Female - 58 1853 Mallow Co Cork Ireland
Bernard Derry Son Single Male Carter 18 1893 Hereford City
John F C Derry Grandson - Male - 6 1905 Kennington London
Robert Cornelius Derry Grandson - Male - 4 1907 Deptford London
Lily Agnes Derry Granddaughter - Female - 3 1908 Peckham London
Frederick Richard Derry Grandson - Male - 1 1910 Peckham London

The Grandchildren on the 1911 are the children of Cornelius

Oh dear - a family of crooks!

Interesting they were in Cardiff where my Grandmother lived.

I cant wait for the 1939 record set to come out!

I hope you have been as successful with you own search!!

Thank you again

Josephine