Find Ancestors

Go to the thread and open it.

copy the url from the top of page, e.g. www.genesreunited... etc etc and then paste it onto here.

Dea x

The link within the last thread

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1349828?d=asc

(edit: note to helpers, the first named 'Hiram Moore' ( and daughter) in that thread has been eliminated so go to to the details further into the thread)

Dea, sorry about it connecting to other threads, all I wanted to know who lived at 25 Hulme St and it all progressed from there. Answer to your last question, No it just said Pollie and no mention of Mary Ann

Thank you RR

That's what usually happens John when you don't keep everything on the same thread - you ask what you think is a seperate question and before you know it it has spiralled out of control and all the same info is being researched all over again ;-)

Just had a read through the original thread and am a bit befuddled now so I will come back to it afresh in the morning.

I am convinced the family I have posted relates to the Mary Ann birth in Manchester but we need to find a way to confirm that she is in fact the mother of Mary Teresa.

The connection to Leeds looks good but it may just be a co-incidence ?

Will look further tomorrow.

Dea x

I can't work back on the threads to check right now but John did this Polly come up on the original search and was she eliminated ?

Births Jun 1877 (>99%)
Moore Polly Barton 8c 688

EDIT Forget that, she died the following year, I remember now that I looked at that one before.

Hello Rose, no I don't think so, because I wasn't sure if she was the mother of Mary Teresa Moore. I think that Polly was a nickname, as I said in a previous post I received a birth certificate this morning for MTM and it stated mother as Pollie but looking at Manchester workhouse records for 1904 ,it was written in lightly before the name of Polly being Mary Ann?. Even though I received this cert. I still can't be 100% sure I have got the right Moore family. It's now trying to find who this Pollie/ Mary Ann is. Finding it all so frustrating

Could this be the Mrs Hawcroft who took Polly to the Workhouse in 1904 ??


1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
102, Devonshire Street, South Manchester, Chorlton, Lancashire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Richard Hawcroft Head Married Male 47 1854 Warehouse (Grey Goods- Calico) Manchester, Lancashire, England
Elizabeth A Hawcroft Wife Married Female 27 1874 - Manchester, Lancashire, England
Margaret M Hawcroft Daughter Single Female 5 1896 - Manchester, Lancashire, England
Richard Hawcroft Son Single Male 1 1900 - Manchester, Lancashire, England
Margaret Lonergan Boarder Single Female 27 1874 Corset Maker Manchester, Lancashire, England
Annie Foy Boarder Single Female 26 1875 Mattress Case Maker Dublin, Dublin, Ireland

NB - ALL the adults on here are marked as Deaf & Dumb from birth !!!

Didn't we have that 'possible' for Mary Ann in 1911 as a former Laundress who was also Deaf & Dumb from the age of 4 !!

It would seem likely that being D & D they would possibly know each other.

I will explore..............

In the meanwhile

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1893
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
HAWCROFT Richard MURPHY Elizabeth A Chorlton-on-Medlock Register Office or Registrar Attended Archives+, Manchester Central Library CHO_RM/103/34

Back later,

Dea x

P.S. I haven't checked again if any of this is on your other thread but I don't remember seeing it.

Dea x

Wow Dea, you are fantastic . It certainly all seems to tie in with Mrs Hawcroft as being deaf and dumb, they obviously befriended Mary Ann/Pollie. Pollie was living or possibly working at 25 Hulme Street with Annie Hart the tailoress when she gave birth to her daughter Mary Teresa. It seems that due to the circumstances of Pollie being deaf that's why the authorities took Mary Teresa away and put her in Hollymount Tottington Bury. Because of this MTM didn't know her mother and there was no father on birth certificate,that's why when she was in the mother and babies home in Leeds and on her death certificate in 1970 it states parents unknown.. On death even her age unknown. This is why I think I have the right MTM. It is all so tragic, MTM died of scalding in an Asylum in a Sheffield in 1970 , her own daughter never knew her and yet again no father, but at least she had a wonderful happy life in America. I am so grateful you finding all this out for me obviously you know just where to look

We do have to be careful here though John for although it does all seem to fit and I have 'one of my feelings' about it that it is right, as yet we have found no 'actually proof' that it all relates to 'your' Mary Teresa. :-( :-( :-(

I would feel much better if we could find something to prove it is all correct.

I will keep looking..............

Dea x

P.S. - Where is that Rambling Rose when we ned her ?? ;-) :-D (Or any other helpers for that matter - PLEASE! :-D

Dea x

I can all but hope it is the Moores I want. I am letting the family in America know all that you have found so far.

I'm just looking back through the other thread, because something isn't sitting right somehow..

John, forgive the repetition , do you have Mary Teresa's ( born 1903) birth cert?

The reason I am going back to this is the Teresa aged 15 mentioned on the previous thread, which you considered possible at Hollymount

Name: Teresa Moore
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1886
Relation to Head: Inmate
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Manchester, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Tottington
Ecclesiastical parish: St Anne
Town: Tottington
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Bury
Sub-registration district: Tottington
ED, institution, or vessel: Holly Mount
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3635

Dea's solution sound very likely, but like her, I never say definite unless there is some real proof...

Several things are bothering me...so I'll have to copy over from the other thread,

"Rose I have just looked again at the Manchester Workhouse and saw Polly Moore as living at what looked like 58 Newcastle Street Hulme but when I went along to the next set of paper work alongside it I magnified it and it states Mr or Mrs Haucroft 38 Newcastle Street Hulme so could re look for me please and see who was living at no 38. "

The Hawcrofts Dea has posted are in Devonshire St 1901 and 18 Clarendon Place Clarendon St C On M in 1911 ... I don't know the area so don't know if that would put them close to Newcastle street?

edit and where does the address 25 Hulme St come into it ? ( sorry if I have missed info but dodging between threads is confusing me lol, I have them all open at once along with Ancestry) :-D

I'm copying this over too just so I can find it easily..

Name: Mary Seresa Moore (Mary teresa)
Age in 1911: 6
Estimated birth year: abt 1905
Relation to Head: Inmate
Gender: Female
Birth Place: South M/C, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Tottington
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Occupation: School
Registration district: Bury
Registration District Number: 462
Sub-registration district: Ramsbottom
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Piece: 23458

That's a good idea John - perhaps they might come up with some other bits of info?

However, PLEASE do tell them that it is not yet 100% certain - we really do need some 'proof'!

Dea x

Hi Rose,

Yes - It 'is' confusing moving between 2 threads !!

I believe that the Hulme St address in on the 1903 birth st for Mary Teresa.

Dea x

Just for ref Richard Hawcroft is not on the 1911 at home,

Name: Richard Howcroft
Age in 1911: 57
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854
Relation to Head: Patient (Institutional)
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Manchester, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: South Manchester
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Warehouseman
Registration district: Chorlton
Registration District Number: 464
Sub-registration district: Didsbury
ED, institution, or vessel: 44
Piece: 23701

Thanks Dea :-) I wasn't sure if John had the birth cert,

RR and Dea. Here are the list of certificates and info that has been sent to me. Received the birth cert yesterday for Mary Teresa Moore born at 36 Hulme Street,South Manchester. 30th Mar 1903. mother Pollie Moore. Tailors Presser. living at 36 Hulme Street S/M. No father.. Mary Teresa Moore gave birth to a daughter in Jan 1925 Leeds Yorkshire, no father and her address before going to the mother and babies home was Church Street Boston Spa occupation Domestic Servant. Her parents unknown and her age about 20 yrs old. Mary Teresa Moore died 1970 Sheffield, states age unknown and parents unknown. I have in possession of all these documents. I am still waiting for information from Holly Mount Convent ,Tottington to find if they have information who the next of kin might be for Mary Teresa Moore , when she went there and where she was sent to work when it was time to leave Holly Mount.. I have presume that because she didn't know who her parents were, that it was her in the Manchester workhouse and she was taken from her mother Pollie or Mary Ann Moore and placed in Holly mount so they were separated and if it was her mother in the workhouse in 1911 and being deaf and dumb, they may have thought she couldn't look after her properly.. I hope this will help you.

Another bit of info I can give you albeit irrelevant trying to find Pollie/Mary Ann Moore. Mary Teresa Moore was admitted to St Margaret's mother and baby home on 18 th Nov 1924 and discharged 3rd Feb 1926 , which quite a long stay but she was of ill health suffering from muscular rheumatism and not at all strong but her baby was full of life, could walk and talk before they were eventually sent to St Veronicas mother and baby home in Sheffield on 3rd Feb 1926 . Also interesting a man was named to be the father living in Boston Spa but he married another girl just a month before MTM daughter was born. It was taken to court on 25th Nov 1925 but was unsuccessful.

Gone to bed now but will be back in the mornng !

Nine nite all,


Dea Xxx