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Old

I have only just seen your update ........ excuse, been away for a few days.


Thank you for the update.

Certainly very intriguing!





sylvia

Have now obtained his will.

I have never seen so many bequests, nearly all family related but nothing I can see related to Adelaide.

He left one hundred pounds to Mrs Alice Eades employed as Booking Clerk at Church End Station - intriguing.

He set up a trust to provide for his servant Annie Jenner, whether or not she was in his service when he died.

Did get married names of his sisters.

Chris

Many thanks for the link.

An amazing site that could lead to lots of useful info.

http://www.gravestonephotos.com/public/gravedetails.php?available=yes&fullname=John%20Charles%20Horsey&grave=140454&personid=299340

(photo of grave, John Charles Horsey, in case you haven't seen it)

Chris :)

Quoy

I actually have his will. It was amongst papers my father gave me that started my family research.

It was very useful as his sisters inherited money and I was able to find their marriages.

Hello
posting this if you do not have it I will just put the highlights

The Times, Monday, May 25, 1908; pg. 2; Issue 38655


John Charles Horsey deceased
notice is given to any person having claim to estate of John Charles Horsey late of The Crown Hotel Twickenham Middlesex ( formerly with Messers Murrietta and Co Bankers ) who died on the 24th December 1907 intestate.
Probate granted to Henry Field Horsey Norfolk Lodge ,Nether Street,lawful brother and one of the next of kin to the deceased.

Sylvia

I do have the will and it was very interesting.

Emmeline and Arthur had 3 children, Arthur Jnr., Harry & Maud.

Arthur Jnr. was a 'black sheep' of the family who married young, left his wife and had a child by his housekeeper.

Arthur & Emmmeline did not attend the wedding.

In her will Emmeline left money to Harry, Maud AND Arthur Jnr and his wife.

By the time Arthur died, Arthur Jnr. was dead.

My own father did not know the name of his father's brother. When I was looking through family photographs I asked who was it playing with Harry & Maud. He replied "That's their brother. He died young in an institution."
Sadly this ws true, but he was 40 when he died.

As you noted, wills can be invaluable and if there were lots of daughters, you can sometimes be lucky and find their married names from them being beneficiaries in a family will.

Old


not without a will


One possibility might be that the will was worded the opposite way to what I posted above.


In other words, did Emmeline have the money?

Could she have left a will that left the money in trust, with Arthur having an income from the trust during his lifetime, and then the trust went to the 2 children?


You would have to buy that will to find out!


But it is a possibility.




sylvia

Sylvia

I have obviously led a sheltered life.

i am going to splash out and get this will. The Horsey family all appear to have been successful and left significant sums.

My great grandfather Arthur, married Emmeline Horsey - daughter of a 'gentleman' Charles James Horsey. Emmeline left a will, but annoyingly my great grandfather did not! His 2 surviving children inherited whatever was left - my father always said that his Aunt Maud never worked again, so I think the amount must have been large. Any ideas as to how it might be possible to find out the amount

















emmeline horsey, daughter of a 'gentleman' Charles James horsey.

Old


Even so, the will itself contains other information ................. if the widow is the one named, she will have to carry out the instructions in the will.

Which may say things like.....

"I leave my favourite chair to xxx; my watch and watch chain to zzzzz".

Or "I leave £yyy to my wife, and the rest to be divided between my children xxx, xxxx and xxxx. I direct that my faithful servant Joe Blow receive £xx and my best pair of shoes"

Or "I direct that my wife receive the interest from the estate and be allowed to continue to live in the house until her death, at which time the remainder will go to ........."


Those instructions are not shown unless you buy the will.


The name shown on the Probate Registry is still only the name of the person who was deemed responsible enough by the person who wrote the will AND his solicitor to handle the legalities.

Many wives are not named in the Probate Registry extract ...... instead sons, brothers-in-law, friends of the husband or solicitors are named.


This would definitely apply if Henry and Adelaide were not married. She would not have the legal standing.



There is probably no reason for them not to marry if his wife was dead, and he had not already married again in the interim before setting up house with Adelaide.

Of course, she herself might have been previously married and husband was still alive.


As to why claim on the census that they were married if they were not


Plain and simple .................. decency's sake!

They would have told all the neighbours etc that they were married, probably adding that they got married while they "were away" ............. and the information on the census was just keeping up with that tale.


Another reason for not marrying might have been that he did not want his money and effects to be divided up any more than they already were, eg not to go to any family that Adelaide might have had


Another possible scenario ............... she might have been married before, husband was deceased, and the terms of that will said that she would lose any inheritance if she married again .............. that was not unknown



There are all kinds of reasons why people didn't marry


and living common law was just as common then as it is now.






sylvia

Sylvia

Looking at the other wils on the page, money is generally left to the widow (much nicer than relict) if there is one.
The executors in this case are his nephew and wife. The nephew is found to be living in the Norfolk Lodge in his will - he leaves the money to his son.

Would still like to find the second marriage for Henry field Horsey - to an Adelaide - is there any reason why they could claim on the Census to be married when they were not? It has been suggested they might be unmarried, but there is no legal reason as his wife had died many years before.

If you bought the full will, then it will tell you how the money was actually left .............. the Probate Registry only tells you the name(s) of the Administrator(s) or Executor(s)


It is possible that he might have left money to Adelaide

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/genealogy_chat/thread/1259939

(to get a full copy of the Will, have a look on above link)

Chris :)

The entry reads:

Horsey Henry field of Norfolk Lodge Nether-street Finchley Middlesexdied 22 Dec 1925 Probate 26 January to frederick wilde gentleman and Rose Wilde (wife of the said Frederick Wilde) , Effects £28778 18s. 4d.

Are there any other names mentioned in the Will, that might give a clue?...

Chris :)

London, England, Electoral Registers, 1847-1965

Name: Henry Horsey
Electoral Year: 1919
Parliamentary Division: Finchley
County or Borough: Barnet


Henry and 'Addie' are living at Norfolk Lodge, Nether Street, Finchley.

After 1919 he is on his own, which suggests Addie died some time in 1919/1920.

I have looked for an Adelaide or 'Addie' dying in that time frame in that area, with no luck.

I have not found her death.

Did Adelaide die before or after Henry please?

Presumably the Frederick Wilde who inherited Henry's estate was the son of his sister Anne and Francis Stephen Wilde?


Deaths Dec 1925 Horsey Henry F 89 Barnet 3a 482

1881 England Censusabout H.F. Housey
Name: H.F. Housey
Age: 44
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1837
Relation: Head
Gender: Male
Where born: Islington, Middlesex, England

Civil parish: St Mary Islington
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address: 498 Holloway Rd
Condition as to marriage: Widow
Education:

Employment status:
View image

Occupation: Butcher

Registration district: Islington
Sub-registration district: Islington East
ED, institution, or vessel: 29
Neighbors: View others on page

Piece: 257
Folio: 97
Page Number: 4
Household Members: Name Age
H.F. Housey 44
F. Wilde 19 - Relation: Nephew
A. Newman 26
G. Double 22
P. Laker 17
L. Hunt 29

I presume the F. Wilde is his nephew to whome he left all his money.

???

1861

Name: Adelaide Pollard
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1844
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Brighton, Sussex, England

Civil parish: Maidstone
Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity
County/Island: Kent
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Maidstone
Sub-registration district: West Maidstone
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 34
Piece: 500
Folio: 37
Page Number: 8
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Wador Sheatfield 27
Ann W Sheatfield 28
Adelaide Pollard 17

1851

Name: Adelaid Pollard
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: George Pollard
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Brighton, Sussex, England

Civil parish: Southwark St John Horsleydown
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View image

Registration district: St Olave Southwark
Sub-registration district: St Olave
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 20
Piece: 1559
Folio: 547
Page Number: 5
Household Members: Name Age
George Pollard 26 Widower, Tallow Chandler
Adelaid Pollard 6
George Pollard 3