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Have you also seen my message that says Ellen Sweetman born 1914 could have married George Rosenberg in 1939?

I just read your message about the ellen sweetman who died in 1994 that doesn not belong to the lady in 1914.

Now I understand. I was reading everbody message very quickly last week.

and i was getting a bet confused.

thats I was asking odd questions.

North

She died in hospital

They did'nt just guess her name and age...someone told them

maybe she wasn't registered with a doctor.

North

Ellen would have given her doctor all her details when she registered with him ...... that's just the same as you do now.

So he would have had her birth details, her marital status, etc, on record.


When she was taken into hospital, she would have given those same details HERSELF to the hospital administration ........... just as you do now

If she was unconscious, or otherwise unable to give the details, the hospital would have contacted her doctor to get them.


Your mother and her brother would have been far too young to be asked.



so, this seems to show that the details on the death certificate regarding her age and her surname are exactly what ELLEN herself told the hospital ........ and the informant then used that information for registering her death.




sylvia

That is why we have been asking about who registered the death, if it was someone from the hospital surely they got her birth details from her medical records which Ellen would have given them?

my mother was 9years old. nobody asked my my mother. her father was not there to give any information. So I dont know where did they get info from.

Phew!!!

I am exhausted, and I bet we all are.

Can I bring it all together?

Ellen Sweetman purported to be married to Harold Osbaldeston. They had two children born 1945 and 1947, registered as Osbaldeston, mmn Sweetman. The younger of these children is North's mother.

Ellen Osbaldeston died in 1956, so North's mother says. This is the reference:

Name: OSBALDESTON, Ellen
Registration district: [?] Oldham
County: Lancashire
Year of registration: 1956
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at death:47
Volume no: 10F
Page no: 34

North says the age at death is wrong, we have no proof of that. Her children would have been aged only 11 and 9. So somebody adult reported the death.

The first thing therefore is to get that death certificate, assuming that North is confident the this death is of her grandmother. Surely her mother will remember whether or not her own mother died when she was aged only 9.

Can you answer that North? Was your mother around that age when her own mother died?

As Elllen Sweetman never married Harold Osbaldeston, we have no proof as to who either's parent were

The death cert is the first port of call North, then we can come back to the thread with some more positive informationl,

Ann

I think it was a Lancashire saying, using either tongue or hair.

Certainly, all the oldies in Oldham used to say it!

Sylvia - is that an Oldham saying or general. My gran came from Oldham and she used to tell me she was

"as old as her tongue and a bit older than her teeth"

so agree that parents and grandparents often did not actually tell you their true age. I even have to work out now how old my mother was when she died and that was only in 1998

North

The site www.ukbmd.org.uk does NOT carry any records

It is a means of finding other sites that do carry records.


so it is not surprising that you did not find Ellen Sweetman's record on there.



sylvia

I typed Ellen Sweetman born in 1914. on www.ukbmd.org.uk.
There is any not any record. yet on freebmd.org.uk
There is a record. Thats odd.

thanks Sylvia - I had missed that bit when re-reading the posts

Ann

North said earlier that his mother knew nothing more about the family.

have you asked your mother or uncle if they know the names of their grandparents

what you said is corrects about census and the other records.I also heard this info from teacher.

nice chatting to you all

I ll have to log off.

Thank again

you were, and are, very welcome!



sylvia

Thank you for your help

North


Records are NOT always correct.


Ages in censuses depend on when the census was taken vs the person's birth date ............... the person was asked how old they were, the modern day transcriber converts that to birth year. Age on a census can be as much as 2 years out.

Age on a marriage certificate depends on what the bride or groom tells the vicar ................... people lose (ie, say they are younger) 5 or more years with great abandon, especially if the spouse is younger than them

Age on a death certificate depends on what the deceased told other people

People lie about their ages

Many women keep their ages quiet ...... always did, always will!

Many people in the 19th century didn't really know how old they were! Age, and brthdays, were not as important then as they are now.


Your mother was a child when Ellen said how old she was


When I was approximately the same age as your mother, I asked MY mother how old she was.

Her answer???


As old as my hair and a little bit older than my teeth!


.......... and that was all most of my friends knew about their mother's ages!

Again, this was in Oldham ................ I'm a little older than your mother, but it was during the same era.




sylvia

When your grandmother died someone had to register her death.

It was either someone who knew her or maybe the doctor/nurse at the hospital where she died. If it was the hospital surely they got her details from her medical records?

If it was a friend or family member they may have not known?

My grandfathers death cert says he was 69 because everyone in the family thought that was his age.
I have found since that he was 72