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Just thought I would post the 1881 to go with the 1891 and 1901 as a new boy comes in to play

1881
Charles E. Gordon
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Eliza E. Gordon
Gender: Male
Where born: St Georges W, Middlesex, England
Civil parish: Chelsea
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street Address: 19 Oakley Crescent
Occupation: Marble & Stonemason
Registration district: Chelsea
Name Age
Charles E. Gordon 31 head stonemason
Eliza E. Gordon 31
George C. Gordon 33 visitor Armourer Sergt 66th Reg
Elizabeth T. Gordon 34 visitor Aberdeen
Cosmo C. G. Gordon 8 Alverstoke, Hampshire, England
Elizabeth F. G. Gordon 7 Alverstoke, Hampshire, England
Priscella C. G. Gordon 5 Poona, East Indies
Ada M. G. Gordon 2 Deesa, East Indies
Elizabeth R. Creasy 61 Lodger

Hi

I have your nans birth certficate we needed it to find out who her parents were we have found lots of stuff on your nans side we have not hot nothing on your grandad, we had so many theories as to who he was but now i have got a bit more information i will try and see what i can find out.

Your nan seems an amazing lady, i knew she married dudley then married hans but did not know what happened inbetween,

If you have any pictures of your nan and hans my great auntie norma would love to see as i would,

I will scan in her birth certificate and send it you.

Norma was overwelmed of the story you have posted, i have just come on here and will be on all this afternoon just going to go through a few things and i may have questions if thats ok

Many Thanks

Definitely not irrelevant - my knowledge ends with knowing that Stewart Forbes Gordon was my grandfather and that he died motor racing at Brooklands ... I have never known his date of birth nor exact date of death.

Besides memories from my childhood when my mother used to recount family stories to me, I also have a note on the back of a photograph:

"He was killed at Brooklands in 1915 when your father was 24 months old. He ran into a concrete pillar after which they were changed to straw, a brass plate was put in the ground where it happened."

Now I have to say that the number of months is difficult to read, the 2 was first written as a 1 then changed to a 2.

I visited Brooklands some years ago but that section of the track was removed many years ago, so no trace of the brass plate. I gather that in the early days of motor racing that it was common practice to commemorate a driver’s death with a brass plate in the track showing their name and date of death. Later they were removed as they became a hazard (as most were on the corners!).

I have my parents’ birth, marriage and death certificates but that's as far back as my paper trail goes.

The family obviously had little regard to the importance of completeness and accuracy on certificates as my father's age is overstated by 1 year on his marriage certificate, and going back in time his birth certificate shows his father as Dudley Gordon.

I would greatly appreciate any/all assistance in tracking down the marriage certificate of my grandparents Ruby Dorothy Carash and Stewart Forbes Gordon [Dudley Stewart Gordon] as well as his birth and death certificates.

The fact that the family had a habit of switching first and middle names, plus they often miss one or more first/middle names out when filling in certificates, makes it flipping difficult to find.

Now - sorry to carry this on if it is irrelevant.

1891

Name: Stewart F G Gordon
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1889
Relation: Son
Father's Name: George C Gordon
Mother's Name: Elizabeth T Gordon
Gender: Male
Where born: Brompton, Kent, England

Civil parish: Gillingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
Town: Brompton
County/Island: Kent
Country: England

Street Address: looks like 3 Mina Villas

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Medway
Sub-registration district: Gillingham
ED, institution, or vessel: 16
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 661
Folio: 46
Page Number: 1
Household Members: Name Age
George C Gordon 43 Royal Engineer Army, b. Westminster
Elizabeth T Gordon 44 b. Castrick, Aberdeenshire
Priscilla C G Gordon 15 b. East Indies
Ada M G Gordon 12 b. East Indies
George E G Gordon 9 b. Gosport
Florence A G Gordon 6 b. Brompton, Kent
Charles E G Gordon 4 b. Brompton, Kent
Stewart F G Gordon 2

The only problem with that is his middle name!

Births Jun 1888 Gordon Stewart Frank G Medway 2a 593

1901

Name: Stewart F G Gordon
Age: 12
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1889
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Elizabeth S Gordon
Gender: Male
Where born: Gillingham, Kent, England

Civil parish: Gillingham
Ecclesiastical parish: Gillingham St Barnabas
County/Island: Kent
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Medway
Sub-registration district: Gillingham
ED, institution, or vessel: 31
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 267
Piece: 738
Folio: 23
Page Number: 38
Household Members: Name Age
Elizabeth S Gordon 54 Wife, Married
Ada M G Gordon 22
Florence A G Gordon 19
Stewart F G Gordon 12
Jessie B G Gordon 9

12 Ferris Road, East Dulwich is the address shown on my parents’ marriage certificate 17 August 1935.
They lived there for a while and then moved to 226 Stockwell Road, SW9.
My father passed away on 30 May 1951 in his sleep at home (226 Stockwell Road, SW9).
In WW2 my father was in RAF aerial reconnaissance North Africa, he was also a member of the Royal Egyptian Archaeological Society and spent some considerable time photographically cataloguing Egyptian antiquities – particularly in the Valley of the Kings (Thebes, Luxor) but also around the many pyramids of Lower Egypt. After the war he became a freelance photographic journalist (based in Fleet Street).
In the autumn of 2000 my wife Angela and I spent some time visiting Luxor as I wanted to walk in my father’s footsteps around the temples and tombs of Upper Egypt, capturing my own images of the many photographs I had seen as a child.
In 2006 we visited Lower Egypt so I could continue my journey of remembrance, around the many pyramids and spending hours (actually days) in the Museum of Egyptian Antiquities in Cairo.
In 2009 we returned to Lower Egypt with our daughter Katherine and her boyfriend – I think they enjoyed the pyramids and the museum, but were not quite as impressed as I was with our camel trek through the white desert. Our Bedouin camel herder spoke no English and neither did our armed guard – our support vehicle driver spoke reasonable English, but we only saw him at meal times (he drove on ahead to cook the meals and set up camp).

Oh this is wonderful!! So glad you turned up,Lucy! :-D

Stuart-it sounds as though your ggrandmother certainly knew how to make an entrance!! Ah,for the good old days when one could travel by plane with their shield and spear in tow.;-)

Now that the London Electoral rolls are on Ancestry I did a very quick dig:
1927

12 Ferris Road
Agnes and Cedric Thomas Joseph Carash
Emma and Henry Caplin
..........
Later on..1938
12 Ferris Road
Emma Georgina Caplin
Ellen and Walter Jesse Cobb
Ruby Georgina Gordon
and at number 14
Agnes Carash
................
1939
12 Ferris Rd
Emma Georgina Caplin
Alice,Dudley and Ruby Gordon.

14
Agnes Carash
..........

All the best,
Maureen

I do have one memory of my great grandmother!

This was recounted to me by my mother (Alice Gertrude Cheney) on several occassions...

My father (Dudley Bertram Gordon) went to London Airport (Croydon) to collect his grandmother!

We are going back to the 1930s when passenger air travel was a real luxury.

His grandmother had been to East Africa visiting relatives (her uncle if I correctly recall) that ran a safari lodge/hotel.

As my father watched the people emerging from the plane and descending the aircraft steps onto the runway, there was a pause, then a native spear started to emerge from the door, followed by a shield, as the persons arms appeared he realised they were his grandmother’s.

Once out of the door she stood erect with the ends of the spear and shield resting on step by her feet, she paused and surveyed the scene in front of her, then descended the steps to runway.

Apparently she was the only passenger on that flight to bring back a spear and a shield!

The Gordon side of the family has always been quite adventurous ... I met my wife (Angela Norma Farmery) in Gaberone, Botswana, Africa (she's originally from Yorkshire)!

Our family has had a tendency to use middle names and sometimes nicknames (on my mother's side of the family I had an Uncle Harold Edward Cheney who was known to all his friends and work colleagues as Sam - no idea why).

Anyway, my grandfather's name as shown on my father's marriage certificate was Dudley Stewart Gordon (Deceased).

Hence my name in his memory is Stuart Dudley Gordon (my mother did not like the fact that Stewart can be truncated to Stew, so my father agreed to Stuart).

Now Dorothy always referred to her first husband as Dudley but on the family photographs his name is written as Stewart Forbes Gordon (sorry I used my Stuart spelling previously - I had forgotten). I suspect that his full name was Stewart Forbes Dudley Gordon but I've never seen that written anywhere.

Sadly my knowledge of the Gordon history stops with my grandfather.

When I used to visit Dorothy and Hans in Switzerland there were never any conversations about life before von/de Becker's.

What a wonderful addition to this thread! It is absolutely superb that you have taken the time to share this information Stuart. I am sure that Lucy will have many questions for you.

I think the one thing that we didn't get to the bottom of was the names of your Grandfather Gordon's parents.

I don't think that we found him on any census with his parents.

hi guys just want to say yaaahhhh!!!

thank you so mush for all this information this fills so many gaps, as you can properly see from the thread we have had a very hard time, i have quite a few questions, but need to go back and figure out what i wanted to find out
Thank you for the picture as well thats great,

I am so over the moon to find a family member who has a lot of answers

We have struggled to work a lot of stuff out beacuse we have limted information.

We have letters from Ruby Dorothy when she was with hans when she wrote to ruby as ruby looked after her nan emma and ruby sent money for her when she was looking after emma, making sure she is well e.t.c but norma nd my nan dont rember alot which is a shame,
My nan has a glass cutlerty set that your dad dudley had left her when he passed a prsent for his niece, my nan still has it.
They also have the dudleys funeral card with the date and church on it.
Norma did not know that dudley exsited my nan did as she is a bit older than norma but both remember the funeral

I am going to have a look and tell my family about this

I dont mind you boring me with the gordon family history i really would love to know and so would my family

Thank you so much :-D

Hi Maureen,

It was purely by chance that I stumbled across the two Genes Reunited threads ("Trying to Find the mother of Ruby and Douglas" and "Enie D N Forder") via a Google search for my grandmother's maiden name. In fact I had not thought about her maiden name for decades, but it caught my eye when I was looking at my father's birth certificate for his place of birth (I needed it for an India Visa application). Anyway, seeing the name Carash after all these years triggered my memory to recall my childhood, hence the Google search to see if any relatives from that side of the family are still alive.

Please do ask questions and I'll do my best to answer.

I do hope Lucy sees these messages one day and gets in touch ... I am sure I can entertain/bore her for a few hours with Gordon family history.

Best regards,

Stuart

What a turn up for the books!! Smashing.........

Hi Stuart,

Oh gosh-been a while and looking back on this thread you must know/think we are all crazy people.

Would you mind if we ask a ton of questions?

And where is Lucy?

Maureen


:-) :-)

Hi Maureen,

..........
"It must have been in the very late 1950s when my uncle drove us to Forest Hill so I could meet my father’s sister Ruby and her family (husband John and two daughters Enie and Norma)."
.........

Oh yes, indeed they are Lucy's people - Enie is Enie D N Forder.

Best regards,

Stuart

Hi Sylvia,

My grandmother Dorothy de Becker (Ruby Dorothy Carash) was indeed an amazing lady.

I'm probably the only surviving family member who spent any time with her.

When I took Angela, my fiance, to meet Dorothy in 1977 (we were driving back from Botswana part way through a 15,000 miles 6 month overland trip) her one piece of sage advice to Angela was: never marry a much younger gentleman as they age more slowly than ladies.

Hans de Becker was a fine figure of man however he was totally devoted to Dorothy, she had no cause for concern.

Over the years we had many fine meals together in some the best restaurants in Switzerland.

Best regards,

Stuart

Hi Stuart,
That was very kind of you to share that much information with us.
..........
"It must have been in the very late 1950s when my uncle drove us to Forest Hill so I could meet my father’s sister Ruby and her family (husband John and two daughters Enie and Norma)."
.........
I got lost somewhere-are these Lucy's people?

Kind regards,
Maureen

Hi Stuart


as one of the ones who was helping tLucy to sort out her family ...... I can only say thank you for posting that incredible story.


She must have been quite a woman!





sylvia

Ruby Dorothy Carash was my grandmother, she was married several times.

Her first husband was Stuart Forbes Gordon, he died motor racing at the Brooklands circuit in Surrey shortly after Ruby Georgina Gordon was born (thus 1914 or 1915).

According to my mother: Dorothy and Stuart eloped when Dorothy was only 14 years old. They were married in Gretna Green.

Their first child was Dudley Bertram Gordon born 14 Oct 1913 died 30 May 1951 (my father) and they had a second child, a daughter Ruby, but I only met her once when I was a very small boy.

It must have been in the very late 1950s when my uncle drove us to Forest Hill so I could meet my father’s sister Ruby and her family (husband John and two daughters Enie and Norma).

My grandmother's last marriage was to Hans de Becker (formerly von Becker).

Hans was the son of Count von Becker. Main estates (2 castles) on the East side of the Berlin Wall. There’s one memorable family story from between the two World Wars … when the Kaiser visited they had a dinner service made for the occasion.

When the Second World War broke out they were in Germany but managed to escape through France to England and then onto New York. They changed von Becker to de Becker as it was more acceptable. Hans spoke French as fluently as his native German. In fact Hans was a linguist his English was far better than mine! He also spoke fluent Italian.

My grandmother was always known as Dorothy, it appears to have been a family trait to use middle names as I’ve never been 100% certain as to whether my grandfather was Stuart Forbes Gordon or Forbes Stuart Gordon.

My grandfather was a consulting engineer and created/refined a carburettor design that he sold to an Italian car company around 1910 – this enabled him to devote his life to motor racing. His workshop was next to Malcolm Campbell’s they were firm friends and rivals.

So Dorothy was a widow with two children by the age of 19.

She went to Paris and danced with the Folies Bergère where she met her second husband, a wealthy sheep farmer from Australia; however, she did not enjoy life on the farm in the Australian outback (she preferred the high life) so after a very short time she ran away (horseback) with the children.

The next few years are rather vague – certainly spent some time on cruise ships and she had another one or two husbands before returning to Paris and London.

Dorothy was quite a linguist, whilst English was her native language she was totally fluent in French and German. She could also carry on reasonable conversations in Italian and Spanish.

Hans and Dorothy de Becker lived most of their life together in New York and then retired to Adligenswil, Near Luzern, Switzerland. I visited them several times. The first time was difficult for me as they normally spoke French, they were stunned at my appalling French and we had to use English as that is the only language that I can manage.

They are both buried in the von Becker family grave near Luzern – I visited the cemetery in 1982.

The von Becker's maintained a substantial family home (they had 22 household staff) on the banks of Lake Luzern; however, according to rumour it was taken over by the Swiss authorities to cover the Count's gambling debts.

Hans' two sisters established the Christian Scientist Church in Luzern ... it was their life's work. Dorothy passed away before Hans and left her estate to Hans, then when he passed on all the family assets went to his sisters/Christian Scientist Church.

I have just scanned a photo of SF Gordon winning a race at Brooklands on 7 July 1909 ... I'll upload it to my tree.

I'm certainly not going to discount it for now,..mainly because that seems to be the only instance of that name (or variant) in the area!!!

Maureen

I don't think the workhouse would have refused her because she was Canadian. My G. Grandfather was Irish but was admitted to a workhouse in Glasgow when he was dying. I think where possible they tried to recoup the cost of care from the birth parish.

I don't think, in view of that 1881 census that Susan is related to our Mary Jane. Does anyone else?