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Superb! Good work Aileen.

Looks more and more likely that Cecilia was either misinformed by her mother regarding who was who in the family or she had just got it all mixed up.

So what he have so far is

Cecilia's birth - father unknown

Cecelia's marriage - father John Drummond, who was her grandfather (but possibly with the occupation of her actual father, name unknown)

Ann's death - a ficticious husband, and her father given her mother's maiden surname. but with the correct occupation.

So could Cecelia's father have been called John too (but not Drummond) and maybe he was actually a Coal Merchant.


EDIT

Great work Tom! Aileen has given the reference for Ann's birth in 1864.

i have a copy of 1922 drummond john , young annie marriage
when and where how married
1922 at blairgowrie john age 26 annie age 21
name surname of father
john drummond coal miner deceased
ann drummond maiden name martin deceased
i havent found ann birth but have death her father was john martin millworker deceased
how do i keep the family on one thread
informant was cecilia daughter

Dot, Have another look at this thread.

It has been found that Ann's father was John Drummond and her mother Catherine Drummond maiden surname Martin.

Tom is looking for Ann's birth for you just now and will post the details when he can.

Death for Catherine Drummond

1901 DRUMMOND CATHERINE MARTIN F 71 ST MARY DUNDEE CITY/ANGUS

parent's given as James (Weaver) and Jane Martin ms Crichton

Ann was born 06/02/1864 at Wilkie's Lane Hawkhill Dundee
Father John Drummond Mill Overseer.
Mother Catherine Drummond m.s. Martin
they were married 1846 April 25th at Tillicoultry

Hope this helps

I will still search for the marrriages for George and John and see what I can find






george and John

I hope to keep building my family tree once i get all of this in order thanks for all your help i think it is starting to get someplace at long last
my maiden name was drummond my parents where george grant and phyllis drummond and my grandparents where annie and john drummond

Dot

Just remember that the information on a death certificate is only as good as the informant's knowledge.

So the your Grandfather John Drummond was the John married to Ann(ie) Young? I take it then that the Ann Drummond (whose's maiden surname wasn't really Martin but Drummond as she never married) and the John Drummond that you are looking for (whose name was not really Drummond but may have been a Coal Merchant or Coal Miner) are your Great Grandparents!

I was hold from my father george grant drummond who died 2000 that cecilia drummond maiden name married a reeves in 1919 that she was his aunt as a child i always thought she was my great aunt
yes john and annie where my grandparents

That makes sense Dot as Cecelia was the sister / half sister of your Grandfather John.

on the marriage 1922 for drummond john and young annie says parents john drummond and ann or cath drummond nee martin i cant make it out can you help with that one

it makes it harder for me at this end as i am married to an ozzie and now live in australia so all my family are in the uk

I think when John Drummond married Annie Young he has given his parents as John Drummond, Coal Miner and Ann Drummond m.s. Martin.

It was her mother Catherine who's m.s. was Martin and not his own mother Ann.

The age fits for him to be Ann Drummonds son and as he registered his mothers death in 1917 and gave her husbands details as John Drummond perhaps to afford her some respectability, he has then carried this on when getting married himself. As we know from his birth record he was actually born John Burke and not Drummond.

As there is not an RCE on his birth showing a recorded change of name through the Registrar General's office, to correctly register for marriage in Scotland his details should have been entered as John Drummond (formerly Burke). In the 1901 census he is described as John Drummond so obviously he assumed the name Drummond like his brother George and his sister Cecilia. Quite common practice actually even today.

As was stated before the accuracy of the register entry is dependent upon the informant, and sometimes through just not knowing they will give the information they believe to be the truth or have been told is the truth.

Today when we arrange marriages and people lodge notice then we ask for proof in the form of birth certificates so this kind of confusion is rarer. It is things like this that make searching interesting though.

Good luck Dot with your tree, it can become very addictive as many here will attest to.

Tom

Hi tom

I wonder if you can help me again i have got john drummonds death 1884 married to catherine martin but in the parents section i cant make out the father and mothers names i think it is john drummond and margaret something ?
statutory death 282/010005
thanks again
dot

Dot, Could it be Fletcher? On the 1871 census John gives his birthplace as Stirlingshire and there is this birth on the IGI?

IGI Individual Record FamilySearch™ International Genealogical Index v5.0

JOHN DRUMMOND Pedigree
Male
Christening: 31 OCT 1828 Campsie, Stirling, Scotland


Parents:
Father: JOHN DRUMMOND Family
Mother: MARGARET FLETCHER


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.

Hi Rootgatherer

I found this on the scottish people search and it doesnt look like fletcher to me its looks like something smaller
its 1884 drummond john statutory deaths 282/010005
john drummond married to catherine martin
parents of john drummond i think its john drummond and again i think its margaret ? but i could be wrong i have tried everything to read this but its so unclear it looks like a small name
thanks agin for your time
dot

Dot

Do you want my email address to email me a copy and I will try to read it for you? Sorry I don't have any credits at the moment or I would download it and have a look.

hi there

That would be great hope you have a bit more luck than i am having
cheers for that
dot

Hi,
I read John Drummond's mother's maiden name as Margaret Dow

Well done Aileen, thank you for that.

thank you Aileen

I will try now to find them and see if i can get back anymore
Thanks again

cheers

dot

I wonder if his mother's name was actually Mary?

JOHN DRUMMOND
Event(s):
Birth:
08 MAY 1825
Christening:
29 MAY 1825 Muthill, Perth, Scotland

Parents:
Father: JOHN DRUMMOND
Mother: MARY DOW

On a couple of census returns he gives his place of birth as Perthshire

1851

Name: John Drummond
Age: 25
Estimated birth year: abt 1826
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name: Catherine
Gender: Male
Where born: Muthil, Perthshire
Parish Number: 350
Civil parish: Dunning
Town: Dunning
County: Perthshire
Address: 11 Bridgend
Occupation: Woollen Weaver
ED: 7
Page: 19 (click to see others on page)
Household schedule number: 83
Line: 4
Roll: CSSCT1851_74
Household Members:
Name Age
John Drummond 25
Catherine Drummond 25
Catherine Drummond 4

1861........not given on transcript

Name: John Drummond
Age: 35
Estimated birth year: abt 1826
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Catherine
Gender: Male
Registration Number: 282/2
Registration district: Dundee Second District
Civil parish: Liff and Benvie
County: Angus
Address: 8 Wilkie's Lane
Occupation: Flax & Jte Mill Dresser
ED: 33
Household schedule number: 31
Line: 21
Roll: CSSCT1861_41
Household Members:
Name Age
John Drummond 35
Catherine Drummond 36
Catherine Drummond Jr 14
Janet Drummond 12
Mary Drummond 10
Cecilia Drummond 5
John Drummond 2
Ann Master 19

1871........

Name: John Drummond
Age: 44
Estimated birth year: abt 1827
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Catherin
Gender: Male
Where born: Ardeek, Stirlingshire
Registration Number: 282/2
Registration district: St Mary
Civil parish: Dundee
County: Angus
Address: Dudhope Crescent Land 18
Occupation: Mill Woversees
ED: 5
Household schedule number: 196
Line: 17
Roll: CSSCT1871_50
Household Members:
Name Age
John Drummond 44
Catherin Drummond 44
Catherine Drummond 26
Jannet Drummond 23
Mary Drummond 20
Cecilia Drummond 14
John Drummond 11
Ann Drummond 6
Agnes Drummond 4
James Joyce 3

1881

Name: John Drummond
Age: 54
Estimated birth year: abt 1827
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Catherine
Gender: Male
Where born: Ardoch, Perthshire
Registration Number: 282/2
Registration district: St Mary
Civil parish: Liff and Benvie
County: Angus
Address: 49 Larch St
Occupation: Jute Facty Overseer
ED: 19
Household schedule number: 122
Line: 11
Roll: cssct1881_83
Household Members:
Name Age
John Drummond 54
Catherine Drummond 54
Mary Drummond 26
Ann Drummond 17
Agnes Drummond 15
Catherine Gellis 5